cbuffalino 0 #76 January 29, 2013 Thanks! That clears that up. Would rolling the nose on the canopy for a slower more staged opening lessen the pain? And am I to understand that in BASE when a tracker deploys since there is no time to spare going back to box, they often face very painful openings?Never give up on something you can't go a day without thinking about. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pulse 0 #77 January 30, 2013 For 22 years now I've always deployed in a track and I'm a good tracker. I grab my pilot chute and as I bring my arms forward I pitch it. Then my arms go forward and I pitch my body up. This may help to bleed off a little speed. But it definitely helps orient my body flatter to the relative wind. I've only had three malfunctions and I wasn't tracking on any of those. :)"Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FreeFallFiend 0 #78 January 30, 2013 QuoteThanks! That clears that up. Would rolling the nose on the canopy for a slower more staged opening lessen the pain? And am I to understand that in BASE when a tracker deploys since there is no time to spare going back to box, they often face very painful openings? Yeah, you pack differently for terminal openings. Some people roll the shit out of the nose, some people do folds, some people tuck these rolls/folds into other cells, direct slider control, holding your mouth a certain way, etc. There are a lot of tricks and everyone seems to find a combination they prefer really it doesnt make too much of a difference. When it comes to terminal openings on a BASE canopy i find body position is much more important than packing tricks...but no matter whats it's gonna slam ya.Fiend I am about to take my last voyage, a great leap in the dark. - Thomas Hobbes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stayhigh 2 #79 January 30, 2013 who really slows down their fwd speed to be truely falling flat vertical again?? I dump in a track and I track more after I pitch my pilot chute. If dumping in a track is dangerous all the big wall base jumper will die after every jump??? and don't give me their base canopy opens hard,,, they open hard because of their pilot chute size, big ass vents and nose, and unique base environment slider. If you want soft opening, jump a soft opening canopy. They aren't sabre1, i haven't jumped soft opening specter either but they don't open hard. never had luck with cobalt. definitely not the old fx Soft ones out there are crossfire, velos, and xaos.Bernie Sanders for President 2016 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dthames 0 #80 January 30, 2013 Quotewho really slows down their fwd speed to be truely falling flat vertical again?? People that have been tracking really fast and don't want to open going that fast. I try to flare and give 3 or 4 seconds for slowing before deployment if I am going really fast.Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!” Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
uberchris 0 #81 January 31, 2013 QuoteI love these discussions because what people don't realize is that deploying in a track does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to change the deployment. And here's why: When you track, you are converting vertical speed to horizontal speed. Key word: Converting. That means, what you take from one, turns into the other. So, if you were falling at 10mph, and started tracking at 5mph horizontally, you are roughly falling 5mph now. Second thing to consider is that when you deploy, no matter what orientation or speed in which direction you are going makes any difference. Once you pitch your pilot chute, it will go PERFECTLY in line with the relative wind every single time, guaranteed. The ONLY thing that does change, is the orientation of your body once you deploy. When you deploy normally, your body changes roughly 90 degrees from belly to vertical. When you're tracking, your body changes somewhere closer to 180 degrees and it may "seem" that it is harder or more violent etc. Fact is, the bad openings are likely caused by poor body position as you body transitions that 180 degrees. I deploy while still tracking, and directly from full wingsuit flight 100% of the time. I have never had a bad, hard or crazy opening as a result of that. amen. i have a tube3 tracksuit, and theres really no way you can "slow down" without getting insanely unstable. i dump in a full track because if i try to flare too long or i arch, i start getting insanely unstable...............gravity brings me down......... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dthames 0 #82 January 31, 2013 QuoteQuoteI love these discussions because what people don't realize is that deploying in a track does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to change the deployment. And here's why: When you track, you are converting vertical speed to horizontal speed. Key word: Converting. That means, what you take from one, turns into the other. So, if you were falling at 10mph, and started tracking at 5mph horizontally, you are roughly falling 5mph now. Second thing to consider is that when you deploy, no matter what orientation or speed in which direction you are going makes any difference. Once you pitch your pilot chute, it will go PERFECTLY in line with the relative wind every single time, guaranteed. The ONLY thing that does change, is the orientation of your body once you deploy. When you deploy normally, your body changes roughly 90 degrees from belly to vertical. When you're tracking, your body changes somewhere closer to 180 degrees and it may "seem" that it is harder or more violent etc. Fact is, the bad openings are likely caused by poor body position as you body transitions that 180 degrees. I deploy while still tracking, and directly from full wingsuit flight 100% of the time. I have never had a bad, hard or crazy opening as a result of that. amen. i have a tube3 tracksuit, and theres really no way you can "slow down" without getting insanely unstable. i dump in a full track because if i try to flare too long or i arch, i start getting insanely unstable............... I beg to differ. I will show you my GPS data if you will show me yours. http://pyrodan.privatedata.com/skydive/tracking/high-performance-track-9-Jan-2013.pdf Do the math and tell me if you would want to open about the 46 second mark.Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!” Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rwieder 0 #83 January 31, 2013 Quoteis deploying in a track a bad or unsafe idea? It's my favorite deployment position. I got used to it years ago when I was flying a Cobalt. It was the only way to get the POS to open right.-Richard- "You're Holding The Rope And I'm Taking The Fall" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #84 January 31, 2013 I'll just reply to myself because I'm going to quote myself anyway - QuoteDespite what some of the higher time jumpers would have you believe it's not a good idea. The problem with pulling in a track is that it adds another variable to your pull time. We know from vast experience that stability and body position are key to good openings and clean deployments, and anything you can do to increase the odds of that happening is a good idea. So when you add a track to your pull sequence, you run the risk of hard openings and excessive swing-out at line strech which can lead to flip throughs and entanglements. Also, if you're not managing your speed properly, the quicker/harder opening will make body position that much more important. A slightly dipped shoulder that would have been a non-issued with a normal airspeed opening, will be amplified with a higher airspeed opening, and can lead to trouble. In short, when done properly you can open in a track with good results. However, if not done properly, it can and will have a negative effect on your openings. Modern rigs and canopies are designed to open soft while falling flat and stable. If you can't get a good opening while falling flat and stable, trying to open in a track is not your solution. Figuring out what's wrong with your gear or your packing is the solution. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeslieRP 0 #85 February 1, 2013 If opening while tracking was dangerous, wouldn't wingsuiting be as well? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #86 February 1, 2013 QuoteIf opening while tracking was dangerous, wouldn't wingsuiting be as well? Wingsuiting is dangerous. Opening is a critical time in a wingsuit jump, and that's one of the reasons that a first-flight course spends so much time on practice pulls and deployments. Now if someone wanted to spend time in a classroom, and do dedicated jumps toward the goal of pulling in a track, it would be much less of a risk. However, if you just want to learn on your own, in the course of regular jumps, it's best left until you can guarantee your own performance in both the track and deployment before combining the two. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wasatchrider 0 #87 February 1, 2013 I always dump before I take off or after I land.BASE 1519 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites