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NeoX

When is it OK to make/receive phone calls during a skydive?

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> A phone or headset not switched on means what? You won't receive calls for the
>next few minutes. Big deal. Nothing lost.

Same issue with the Gopro. You've lost - what? - 60 seconds of video of the horizon? Yet people still come close to getting themselves killed.

And same issue with phone calls in cars. Not answering your phone in your car means what? You can't chat for half an hour? Big deal, nothing lost. Yet cellphone usage in cars causes 1 in 4 car crashes today - and driving is a lot easier than skydiving.

>Also, on your own arguments against mobile phones, why don't we disallow
>cameras then?

There is a lot of pressure to do so, and that was the genesis of the 200 jump limit.

>Or, perhaps we should impose a minimum number of jumps before phone calls
>are allowed, just like with cameras.

Or treat it like an extraordinary skydive (which it is.) If you really feel you need to do this, then get out on your own pass and land before the next load. That way you are only a hazard to yourself.

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Chris-Ottawa, I've gotta hand it to you. You've explained the dangers of using a phone while skydiving pragmatically and in granular detail once again, in a way that makes perfect sense and painting a picture of a real situation.

Yes, all the scenarios you raised can be a distraction, and it only takes one distraction to kill you.

I think the key is to treat it like doing your first BASE jump or wingsuit flight or formation skydive or surf skydive or camera jump. Each of these requires a lot of extra planning and thought and instructors are aware and mentoring you on ensuring it is done safely and properly. A phone call dive should be no different - planned, communicated, all scenarios considered and limitations set and strictly adhered to. When I first posted this question, it was fairly whimsical in that I could just enter a call under canopy without a second thought and it would be simple. But, I now understand that it carries the same level of risks as many other types of jump and should be treated as such in terms of planning, safety, communication and limitations.

I disagree with billvon's car comparison, though. Half an hour is a lot longer than a few minutes. And all skydives last a few minutes. Car journeys can last several hours without stopping. Plus, I tend to make calls while driving. With skydiving, I'm really talking about receiving a call and only answering it if under canopy and at high enough altitude.

By the way, Chris-Ottawa, this is actually nothing to do with me planning to do this or getting some heat at the DZ for it at all. I posted this because I was joking with a friend about calling them while freefalling, and I thought, why not ask the question on the forum, so I did.
He's doing his Superman thing.

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I'm glad I was able to help you understand the risk.

I've personally seen a jumper with over 2000 jumps, get in the plane without a rig. He was doing tandem video and was simply focused on getting his camera setup ready and totally omitted his rig. We all stared at him, not saying anything. The pilot even caught it and didn't start the engine as a result. Eventually he asked why we weren't moving, and one of the jumpers said "because you've forgotten something".

The look on his face was priceless. The distraction is anything that takes away from the task at hand. In this case, a new jumper on a skydive. Move some of their focus to another priority and shit starts falling apart whether they realize it or not.

Good luck man!
"When once you have tasted flight..."

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They use A-GPS. It's based off the towers using triangulation and a pseudo GPS to triangulate withing the cell tower triangulation. Doesn't work without multiple cell towers and being well above the towers. That's why it's inaccurate.

This is also why cell phone GPS doesn't work without service.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS
"When once you have tasted flight..."

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>Car journeys can last several hours without stopping. Plus, I tend to
>make calls while driving.

A lot of people do that, positive that they are careful and skilled drivers and thus can handle the distraction. A quarter million of them were wrong in 2013.

Skydiving takes a lot more attention than driving.

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Lesson learned!

Never respond to a survey that doesn't have the boobie default option.

This back and fourth Discussion reminds me of Joey. He was a computer jockey to.[:/]

On a happy note the OP is a brit. So he's a euro problem.

If your a young one in the US and try this crap, you might find yourself grounded, and driving a long way to the next dz. Or worse.

One Jump Wonder

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Chris-Ottawa

They use A-GPS. It's based off the towers using triangulation and a pseudo GPS to triangulate withing the cell tower triangulation. Doesn't work without multiple cell towers and being well above the towers. That's why it's inaccurate.

This is also why cell phone GPS doesn't work without service.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS



Assisted GPS is an simply an additional feature in most smartphones to allow them to use cell tower data to get a faster "rough" lock. However pretty much any smartphone on the market for the last 4 years or so that advertises GPS has an actual GPS receiver in it. They're crap in buildings and much less reliable than dedicated units, but are generally accurate to within 10 metres if using the receiver. Cell coverage is not actually required for the GPS to function, depending of course on whether the maps are preloaded or are downloaded on the fly a la GMaps.

Source: 6 years in Telecommunications, primarily mobiles... ;)
You are playing chicken with a planet - you can't dodge and planets don't blink. Act accordingly.

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billvon

>Car journeys can last several hours without stopping. Plus, I tend to
>make calls while driving.

A lot of people do that, positive that they are careful and skilled drivers and thus can handle the distraction. A quarter million of them were wrong in 2013.


In just about everything, including driving and skydiving, there are various levels of skill. You seem to forget that. Some drivers are better after drinking 20 pints and then texting and skyping at the same time than others who are sober and in full control of their vehicle. Of course, I've used an extreme example, but the same point applies at all levels of distraction/skill. The quarter million in 2013 may have been very bad drivers. Skill level is a factor whether you like it or not.

billvon

Skydiving takes a lot more attention than driving.


You really are a master of grandiose wide-ranging statements. I disagree with this statement. I think driving an F1 racecar during a Grand Prix requires more attention than a student on a tandem skydive. Hell, even a flat-flyer can fall asleep during a 120mph freefall and survive. I doubt anyone falling asleep while driving 120mph would survive.

If you're going to make big statements, at least qualify them in some way.
He's doing his Superman thing.

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Krip

Lesson learned!

Never respond to a survey that doesn't have the boobie default option.

This back and fourth Discussion reminds me of Joey. He was a computer jockey to.[:/]

On a happy note the OP is a brit. So he's a euro problem.

If your a young one in the US and try this crap, you might find yourself grounded, and driving a long way to the next dz. Or worse.



What an absolute load of c**p, a euro problem!

Gee thanks, I'm on the plane with a miss routed chest strap, but it's ok he's from Europe. My wife caught a jumper at Elsinore with a misrouted chest strap, his friends who had sat opposite him for the plane ride up hadn't noticed it. Red light on, door opens and their he is knee on the edge ready to go. Did we say it's ok he's American? Did we f**k we grabbed him, made sure he did his chest strap up to stop him becoming a statistic.

Should you go hands free on your phone, i'd suggest not. Do people take selfies while under canopy, yes and i'd say the palm DZ in Dubai holds the monopoly on it (my opinion).

In the Uk, you can get 3 or 4G to 4Kft then some-how get it back around 8k. I've only ever used it on the plane ride to altitude, and never under canopy. Could i use my phone under canopy without being unsafe, yes I think I could. Would I do it, no!

Think of it this way, you can drive a car with your feet; but it doesn't make it a good idea to try it!
At long last the light at the end of the tunell isnt an on coming train!!!

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andym148

***Lesson learned!

Never respond to a survey that doesn't have the boobie default option.

This back and fourth Discussion reminds me of Joey. He was a computer jockey to.[:/]

On a happy note the OP is a brit. So he's a euro problem.

If your a young one in the US and try this crap, you might find yourself grounded, and driving a long way to the next dz. Or worse.



What an absolute load of c**p, a euro problem!

Gee thanks, I'm on the plane with a miss routed chest strap, but it's ok he's from Europe. My wife caught a jumper at Elsinore with a misrouted chest strap, his friends who had sat opposite him for the plane ride up hadn't noticed it. Red light on, door opens and their he is knee on the edge ready to go. Did we say it's ok he's American? Did we f**k we grabbed him, made sure he did his chest strap up to stop him becoming a statistic.
Yep, the Americans on this forum are just proving how much they conform to the typical dumb American we-are-the-center-of-the-world stereotype that is well-known across Europe. I lived in Illinois/Maryland for 6 months when I was 18/19, and even at that young tender age, I was astonished at how much of a brainwashed and clichéd society it was. Most of the people I met had never even left the country and they thought Scotland was a city in England and some asked if I knew the frickin' Queen. [:/]

The problem on this forum is that there's a massive bias towards Americans. I made some comments about Americans earlier in this topic in reaction to negative comments I was receiving about being British. My comments were deleted. Then Krip posts as if Brits can just go ahead and die, and the post remains up. Next, he'll be saying humanitarian aid to war-torn countries should be stopped because they don't own 65" LCD TVs and SUVs on the driveway.
He's doing his Superman thing.

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Deimian


I was hoping someone would bring that up ;)

I do have a question: when did skydiving become so boring (especially at 80 jumps???) that we have to look for other things to do while doing it??

I guess it was when narcissism became the main reason behind becoming skydiver.
But I guess you consider yourself in the minority and not narcissistic? (a major trait of some types of narcissist is that they don't believe they are narcissistic.)

Dunning-Kruger effect... hmm, I wonder if I'm a victim of that... I think I'm a below-average skydiver. Does that mean I'm better than I think? I think it does, therefore I must be a highly skilled skydiver. But if I think that, then I'm probably less skilled than that. So that is my conclusion. But then that must mean I'm a good skydiver. But by thinking I'm good, I must be bad. But then that means I'm good again. Bad. Good. Bad. Good. Oh crap, now I'm f*cking confused. Can I call someone?
He's doing his Superman thing.

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Hey man, if you clear it with the DZO and the S&TA on your DZ, get out on a hop-n-pop by yourself, and make sure the pilot and the other jumpers on the load know about it as well...then what the fuck do I care?

Knock yourself out.

Keep in mind I will tell everyone at every other DZ about it and you probably will get a wierd nickname but you seem like the type of person who does not have a problem with that as you've already let everybody know, in this thread at least, that you don't give a shit about their opinions ....so again...go for it...see what your DZO has to say about it.

#whtever. #pleasedonthangaroundthefirepitafterward #kidsthesedays
#probabletroll

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rifleman

Just a quick question - Given that most hands free earpieces require you to push a button on the headset to connect the call, how the hell are you going to do that through your helmet?



Maybe when he has a midair with another jumper and they bumped body parts.

If I was going to give the dude a dz nickname it would be along the lines Digit Selfie aka Selfie.

Joey is that you:S
One Jump Wonder

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NeoX


But I guess you consider yourself in the minority and not narcissistic? (a major trait of some types of narcissist is that they don't believe they are narcissistic.)



Nope. I am as narcissistic as many others, I am part of the majority. I am just less narcissistic than you. For me (and for the majority) it is enough to share one video from time to time on Facebook or similar. I don't need to call somebody midflight to make sure that they are aware that I am the coolest kid on the block. Among many other things (like considering more important taking care of that planet coming at me than a phone call) because I am not. And neither are you.

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>In just about everything, including driving and skydiving, there are various levels
>of skill. You seem to forget that.

Not at all. I know some very good skydivers and some very bad skydivers. Almost as a rule, they all think of themselves as good skydivers.

>Some drivers are better after drinking 20 pints and then texting and skyping at
>the same time than others who are sober and in full control of their vehicle.

So shall we allow people to drive who have a BAC that is four times over the limit? Or would it be a good idea to set a limit that works for most people to reduce the chances that you or your family will be the ones who are killed by the drunk who was positive he was OK to drive?

I think once you've been in the sport longer you will know someone who has been injured or killed by a hotshot, by someone who thought they were good enough to swoop through a pattern/video their own landing/swoop the base. At that point I suspect your attitude on this may change. Until then be careful.

>You really are a master of grandiose wide-ranging statements. I disagree with
>this statement. I think driving an F1 racecar during a Grand Prix requires more
>attention than a student on a tandem skydive.

There is a phase that most skydivers go through that we call "100 jump wonder" phase. During this time they think they know everything, and have very strong opinions on what's right and what's wrong. Good luck on yours.

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billvon


I think once you've been in the sport longer you will know someone who has been injured or killed by a hotshot, by someone who thought they were good enough to swoop through a pattern/video their own landing/swoop the base. At that point I suspect your attitude on this may change. Until then be careful.



He's already bored enough to want to take selfies/FaceTime with his buds. If he makes it to 200 jumps without moving onto the next shiny thing I'll be surprised. :D
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

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