UPT right to not return equipment

[hexentrics 5]

I’ve recently sent my rig in for a repair on the reserve flap grommet and during the routine inspection, upt have found cause to ground the rig. 
they are now refusing to return my equipment unless I have them re harness the rig. 
Do have any legal right to do this? 

[hexentrics 5]

Cheers for the reply’s and the advice given  referencing letter and or legal council was my initial though also. It is further complicated by the fact I’m no us based and I could get the repair done locally. But as stated they refuse to release unless the manufacturer executes the repair.

It seems they have no legal right in the us to withhold this equipment so that is good information. 
thanks for your help 

[dudeman17 270]

Hmmm...  This could be an interesting ploy. Lawsuits are expensive to defend regardless of the outcome. If they send back an unairworthy rig and someone jumps it and goes in, they could be sued. If you threaten to sue them for not returning your property, maybe they'll offer you a new rig as a cheap (insurance) way out.

I've got an old Vector in the closet, I think I'll send it to them...

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

13 minutes ago, hexentrics said:

I’ve recently sent my rig in for a repair on the reserve flap grommet and during the routine inspection, upt have found cause to ground the rig. 
they are now refusing to return my equipment unless I have them re harness the rig. 
Do have any legal right to do this? 

Hi hexentrics,

Disclaimer:  I am not an attorney.

Something similar happened to a local jumper with a different item & a different company.  I told him to write to them demanding that they return the equipment that was his legal property.  He did contact them with this argument via email & his equipment was returned to him.

I suggest that you write them as professional of a letter as you can [ get some help with writing it if you feel you need help ].  Send it as a Registered Letter via the US Postal Service with a signature req'd upon delivery.

If that does not work, consider an attorney.

Just my $0.02,

Jerry Baumchen

[Bigfalls 110]

To the best of my knowledge, if you send an aircraft part to be overhauled and the facility finds the part non airworthy, they can mark the part not airworthy and return it to you but they are not allowed to destroy the part.  I don't know if it is the same with parachute equipment.  The manufacturer has determined your rig not airworthy.  They don't want the liability if the rig is jumped.  If they feel it is not airworthy, you don't want to jump it.  You may be able to look up FAA regulations and find something or call your FAA, FSDO office and ask them.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

28 minutes ago, Bigfalls said:

To the best of my knowledge, if you send an aircraft part to be overhauled and the facility finds the part non airworthy, they can mark the part not airworthy and return it to you but they are not allowed to destroy the part.  I don't know if it is the same with parachute equipment.  The manufacturer has determined your rig not airworthy.  They don't want the liability if the rig is jumped.  If they feel it is not airworthy, you don't want to jump it.  You may be able to look up FAA regulations and find something or call your FAA, FSDO office and ask them.

Hi falls,

IMO what we did 'back in the day' is not what one should do today.

Back when Security Parachute Co's Security AeroConical ( SAC ) canopy suffered from the 'Acid Mesh Problem,' Security had gone out of business and could not provide any info on what to do.  Therefore, the FAA issued an AD directing riggers as to what to do should they come across any of these canopies.  The AD said, among other things, to mark out the TSO markings & write on it something to the effect of 'Non-airworthy.'

In today's litigious world, I would not mark up/cut up another person's property unless the FAA gave me specific instructions to do so.

At the end of the day, this rig is someone's legal property.  It is not the property of the mfr.

Jerry Baumchen

 

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

28 minutes ago, hexentrics said:

Cheers for the reply’s and the advice given  referencing letter and or legal council was my initial though also. It is further complicated by the fact I’m no us based and I could get the repair done locally. But as stated they refuse to release unless the manufacturer executes the repair.

It seems they have no legal right in the us to withhold this equipment so that is good information. 
thanks for your help 

Hi hexentrics,

I would still write them a Letter of Demand.

Another, idea would be to 'sell' the rig to someone you know & trust in the US for about $1.00.  This person, then could write the Letter of Demand.

Don't give up, this is your legal property.

Jerry Baumchen

 

[riggerrob 558]

Why are you worried about getting a non-airworthy rig back?

Why are you wasting time on this "legal" argument. Jerry knows how and why I love and respect lawyers and how much I want to become a lawyer when I grow up. Hah! Hah!

Your money is far wiser spent on surgeons, ambulance drivers, mechanics and riggers.

Since the factory has determined that the harness is non air-worthy, no rigger can legally repack and return it to the air. Shipping an non-airworthy harness to another country only benefits the shipping company.

As for where to do harness repairs, the factory can do the job quicker and neater than any local rigger. The biggest hassle with factory repairs is the cost and time to ship it to the factory. Sinc ethe rig is already at the factory, that question is nul.

Finally, some factories forbid major repairs outside of the factory because they have seen too many sloppy repairs done by outsiders who lacked the machines, patterns, materials or skills to do repairs properly.

My advice comes from an FAA Master Rigger who used to make those sorts fo decisions at Rigging Innovations. I re-sized or repaired dozens of Talon, Telesis, Javelin, VEctor, Racer, etc. harnesses.

[riggerrob 558]

Just now, riggerrob said:

Why are you worried about getting a non-airworthy rig back?

Why are you wasting time on this "legal" argument? 

Jerry knows how and why I love and respect lawyers and how much I want to become a lawyer when I grow up. Hah! Hah!

Your money is far wiser spent on surgeons, ambulance drivers, mechanics and riggers.

Since the factory has determined that the harness is non air-worthy, no rigger can legally repack and return it to the air. Shipping an non-airworthy harness to another country only benefits the shipping company.

As for where to do harness repairs, the factory can do the job quicker and neater than any local rigger. The biggest hassle with factory repairs is the cost and time to ship it to the factory. Sinc ethe rig is already at the factory, that question is nul.

Finally, some factories forbid major repairs outside of the factory because they have seen too many sloppy repairs done by outsiders who lacked the machines, patterns, materials or skills to do repairs properly.

My advice comes from an FAA Master Rigger who used to make those sorts fo decisions at Rigging Innovations. I re-sized or repaired dozens of Talon, Telesis, Javelin, Vector, Racer, etc. harnesses.

 

[hexentrics 5]

59 minutes ago, riggerrob said:

Why are you worried about getting a non-airworthy rig back?

Why are you wasting time on this "legal" argument. Jerry knows how and why I love and respect lawyers and how much I want to become a lawyer when I grow up. Hah! Hah!

Your money is far wiser spent on surgeons, ambulance drivers, mechanics and riggers.

Since the factory has determined that the harness is non air-worthy, no rigger can legally repack and return it to the air. Shipping an non-airworthy harness to another country only benefits the shipping company.

As for where to do harness repairs, the factory can do the job quicker and neater than any local rigger. The biggest hassle with factory repairs is the cost and time to ship it to the factory. Sinc ethe rig is already at the factory, that question is nul.

Finally, some factories forbid major repairs outside of the factory because they have seen too many sloppy repairs done by outsiders who lacked the machines, patterns, materials or skills to do repairs properly.

My advice comes from an FAA Master Rigger who used to make those sorts fo decisions at Rigging Innovations. I re-sized or repaired dozens of Talon, Telesis, Javelin, VEctor, Racer, etc. harnesses.

Well kid, the reasons are my own and irrelevant. 
The factory can say what ever they want at the end of the day, but if they have legal leg to stand on, I’m not having property held ransom.

As for your humble rigging innovations rigger brag, cheers dits who cares