Elon Musk Going full trump

[JerryBaumchen 1,046]

27 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

Like most public figures Elon dislikes the lack of privacy that comes with the spotlight. I don't blame him for using the power that spending all that money has brought him to attempt to limit what he can of that on the platform he owns. But of course it is futile because there are so many other platforms, and he was already on record as saying he would not do that. He has the same chance of sending people to Mars that he does of controlling that information. Exactly zero.

Hi Ken,

IMO, he has chosen to be in the spotlight.  I have seen many, many photos of him attending events that he did not have to attend.

It was his choice; now, it seems as though he does not like the repercussions.

Jerry Baumchen

[SethInMI 145]

20 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

he does not like the repercussions

ElonJets is now on TrumpSocial! (I kid. Maybe it is though)

[SethInMI 145]

21 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

He has the same chance of sending people to Mars that he does of controlling that information. Exactly zero

I don't think his chances of sending people to Mars are zero. NASA has enough faith in his new huge rocket to make it part of our return to the moon, and once that comes off, Mars def becomes a thing.

Creating a permanent colony on Mars is something I wish there would be a zero chance of happening. Just a dumb idea, but that might be a thing too. 

[jakee 1,254]

1 hour ago, BIGUN said:

Posting the flight data is public

Posting of individuals on those flights is private. 

What was Elonjet doing?

What were the journalists doing?

[billvon 2,379]

1 hour ago, BIGUN said:

Posting the flight data is public

Posting of individuals on those flights is private. 

So if someone on Twitter posts a picture of Greta Thunberg getting on a private jet - that would also be against the rules?  

[SkyDekker 1,119]

1 hour ago, BIGUN said:

Posting the flight data is public

Posting of individuals on those flights is private.

The twitter account wasn't posting people on the jet. Was simply posting movement of the jet through publicly available data which the Supreme Court has previously ruled to be protected by the first amendment.

[gowlerk 1,901]

1 hour ago, SethInMI said:

I don't think his chances of sending people to Mars are zero.

Manned travel to Mars is not going to happen unless there is some hope of return. I do believe this will probably happen someday, but not in Elon's lifetime.

[SethInMI 145]

3 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

Manned travel to Mars is not going to happen unless there is some hope of return. I do believe this will probably happen someday, but not in Elon's lifetime.

The reason the latest rocket from SpaceX burns methane and not kerosene is they can get methane on mars. The idea is to extract fuel from the environment and use it to return to earth. He really wants to do it, and he has made far more progress toward that goal than I think anyone thought he could (say from 10-15 years ago). So what will the next 10-15 bring? It's going to be interesting.

 

[gowlerk 1,901]

44 minutes ago, SethInMI said:

The reason the latest rocket from SpaceX burns methane and not kerosene is they can get methane on mars. The idea is to extract fuel from the environment and use it to return to earth. He really wants to do it, and he has made far more progress toward that goal than I think anyone thought he could (say from 10-15 years ago). So what will the next 10-15 bring? It's going to be interesting.

 

Yes, I am aware of that and I am at least loosely keeping track of the plan and its progress. There are theories about the possibility of producing and capturing methane on Mars. But the engineering challenges involved are daunting to say the least. There is no current plan that realistically can provide a return ticket. I suppose a suicide mission is possible and I am certain that there would be no shortage of volunteers to go on such a grand adventure. But there is little to be gained from such a venture overall that can't be done robotically. It will be a many decades long project to set up a methane plant and handling system for fueling a return. Also as far as I know the fuel used is not methane alone, but liquid methane and liquid O2. Is that also easily available on Mars? There would be a lot of heavy machinery needed that would need to be dropped on the surface somehow. 10 or 15 years may be a timeframe for developing a plan. More decades would seem likely to implement it. 

Edited December 16, 2022 by gowlerk

[jakee 1,254]

36 minutes ago, SethInMI said:

The reason the latest rocket from SpaceX burns methane and not kerosene is they can get methane on mars. The idea is to extract fuel from the environment and use it to return to earth. He really wants to do it, and he has made far more progress toward that goal than I think anyone thought he could (say from 10-15 years ago). So what will the next 10-15 bring? It's going to be interesting.

Also (as I understand it) the lack of soot buildup meaning the engines will theoretically be able to be turned around and relaunched much more quickly with much less work than Merlins. Which is probably a much bigger concern for the foreseeable future. 

[SethInMI 145]

22 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

There are theories about the possibility of producing and capturing methane on Mars. But the engineering challenges involved are daunting to say the least.

I have only loosely kept track of this "let's go to Mars" thing, so I shouldn't come off as too experty. As you are well aware, there is an army of interested people on youtube who posit on the feasibility of this till the cows come home. So thanks @JerryBaumchenfor starting this digression, now I can spend my idle moments this weekend watching youtubers and deciding what year this century we will put a person on Mars.

[Phil1111 901]

4 minutes ago, SethInMI said:

... now I can spend my idle moments this weekend watching youtubers and deciding what year this century we will put a person on Mars.

Five years

SpaceX Starship can return from Mars without surface refilling

[gowlerk 1,901]

1 minute ago, SethInMI said:

I have only loosely kept track of this "let's go to Mars" thing, so I shouldn't come off as too experty. As you are well aware, there is an army of interested people on youtube who posit on the feasibility of this till the cows come home. So thanks @JerryBaumchenfor starting this digression, now I can spend my idle moments this weekend watching youtubers and deciding what year this century we will put a person on Mars.

Me too. I'm reading rather than watching though. I've seen where Musk has been quoted as saying he wants to have 1000 Starship rockets by the end of this decade. Flying 3 flights per day. Each. He has a long history of grand plans and over promising.

 http://www.energy-cg.com/NorthAmericanNatGasSupplyDemandFund/NaturalGasDemand_MethaneFuelMuskStarship.html

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/spacex-raptor-engine-starship

[JerryBaumchen 1,046]

21 minutes ago, SethInMI said:

I have only loosely kept track of this "let's go to Mars" thing, so I shouldn't come off as too experty. As you are well aware, there is an army of interested people on youtube who posit on the feasibility of this till the cows come home. So thanks @JerryBaumchenfor starting this digression, now I can spend my idle moments this weekend watching youtubers and deciding what year this century we will put a person on Mars.

Hi Seth,

Sure, kill the messenger.  

Jerry Baumchen

[jakee 1,254]

1 hour ago, gowlerk said:

I've seen where Musk has been quoted as saying he wants to have 1000 Starship rockets by the end of this decade. Flying 3 flights per day. Each. He has a long history of grand plans and over promising.

He certainly does, but I’m pretty sure you’ve misremembered or misread something there. 

[gowlerk 1,901]

2 minutes ago, jakee said:

He certainly does, but I’m pretty sure you’ve misremembered or misread something there. 

From the link I included in the post. Of course they may be mis-quoting him. It does not seen even remotely possible so I understand your skepticism

 

.

According to Darrell Etherington of TechCrunch, Elon Musk, in response to questions during a Twitter interview, indicated "that the spacecraft is being designed with the plan of flying it for an average of three flights per day, each carrying over 100 tons of payload per flight, for a total of more than 1,000 flights per year, per vehicle."  Mr. Musk also stated in the same interview that he is working towards having a fleet of 1000 such spacecraft by the end of this decade.  The spacecraft referenced in the quote is the Starship currently undergoing development and testing at SpaceX's  Boca Chica, TX facility.

[gowlerk 1,901]

I mean, the plan to send ships to Mars up daily completely ignores the fact that the window to get there efficiently comes up only for only for a few weeks every two years. But then again when you have as many fan boys as he does the rules of orbital mechanics may not apply.

[ryoder 1,380]

I'm all for Musk going to Mars; Now if he stays there, even better!

[murps2000 86]

2 hours ago, Phil1111 said:

Five years

SpaceX Starship can return from Mars without surface refilling

Very interesting and thorough video. I’m not surprised that Mars orbit rendezvous is the most efficient way to do it, just as lunar orbit rendezvous was for Apollo missions back in the day. That was the only way we could get each of them done with just one Saturn V at a time.

I really wish Musk was more focused on this right now.

[mistercwood 287]

5 hours ago, billvon said:

So if someone on Twitter posts a picture of Greta Thunberg getting on a private jet - that would also be against the rules?  

Interestingly, the answer is "maybe?". The updated TOS prohibits sharing of someone's live location on the same day... so if you post a selfie saying "Holy crap, Joe Biden's having breakfast in my local cafe right now!", you're in violation. If you posted it a day later, you're in the clear.

BUT, there is also a carve-out in the TOS that covers if something is in the public interest or part of a broader discussion.... what this is most likely to mean in practice is that the rules will be applied arbitrarily, as has become Musk's MO since arriving. I can guarantee that the carve-out will be used to allow accounts like LibsOfTikTok to continue to do stochastic terrorism, while the bans will be applied to anyone that hurts Musk's fee-fees.

 

[mistercwood 287]

7 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Posting of individuals on those flights is private. 

I agree, but that's also never been done by anyone. He has embellished the story to conflate the events and try to justify what is ultimately just a knee-jerk reaction on his part.

To be clear, it is his platform now and he can do all of this, he can do literally anything he wants with it - roll a dice and ban all accounts starting with the letter F, or whatever.

What people are reacting to is the balls-out hypocrisy he's displaying. The majority of his stated intent for the purchase was to have a free-speech haven, yet he has gone back on that over and over again since arriving. Hell, he point blank said he would never ban the ElonsJet account barely a month ago - nothing has changed about the account, but he just decided on a whim that this was now a problem. He also banned the personal accounts of the kid who runs it and is threatening to sue him - he's 20.

[billvon 2,379]

4 hours ago, gowlerk said:

There is no current plan that realistically can provide a return ticket.

Zubrin's Mars Direct plan has been around for at least 15 years.

[Phil1111 901]

55 minutes ago, murps2000 said:

...

I really wish Musk was more focused on this right now.

So would I. What he has done with SpaceX is brilliant. Prior to twitter I thought the same about him. But he has now gone full attention whore. He has no central philosophical or political ideology. He's like trump that way. He's gone completely impulsive. He does have Asperger's Syndrome(self admitted) so I cut him some slack.

 

[ryoder 1,380]

3 minutes ago, Phil1111 said:

So would I. What he has done with SpaceX is brilliant. Prior to twitter I thought the same about him. But he has now gone full attention whore. He has no central philosophical or political ideology. He's like trump that way. He's gone completely impulsive. He does have Asperger's Syndrome(self admitted) so I cut him some slack.

 

Ever heard of Gwynne Shotwell?

From what I've read, she is the one who actually runs SpaceX, not Musk.

[JoeWeber 2,294]

8 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Frankly, I haven't seen anything he's done that's outside the official set of rules. https://help.twitter.com/en/rules-and-policies/twitter-rules

I "think" he's trying to clean it up - but time will tell and as Wendy states, it may not be the cool playground to go to in the future. 

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