To gouge or not to gouge

[metalslug 31]

19 hours ago, billvon said:

Think of "the money and effort they saved by not taking climate action!"   And as long as he gets richer than other people, and as long as he dies before the climate gets REALLY bad, he 'wins.'

We disagree on timeline here. I expect you believe that the climate gets REALLY bad within the lifetime of the current generation, hence your perception that conservatives only plan 'until they die'. I'll concede that a conservative approach amounts to 'kicking the can down the road' but then conservatives also believe that it's still a really long road ahead. No point debating the length of the road here, plenty of other threads for that topic, we retain our respective opinions. It's unrealistic to think that conservatives have a disregard for future generations, especially their own. For some it's akin to an imperial bloodline for them.

19 hours ago, billvon said:

Sure, that can work.  That in the context of climate is a ruinous carbon tax, such that if you are one of the gluttons, you lose a lot of money.  

A domestic carbon tax might certainly have some local bite but I'm a lot less convinced internationally. India and China are currently still regarded as 'developing' countries thereby granted some exemptions from emissions commitments and they will most certainly play that card for as long as they possibly can. There is also the option that they are currently using similar to ongoing trade between Russia, India and China despite sanctions, finding trading partners (anywhere they can) that will exempt a carbon tax. China is already preparing their economy for sanctions following from the inevitable invasion of Taiwan. They already know the economic consequence of either sanctions or a future carbon tax with the West and they don't care. While the West buys green solutions, they buy warfare solutions. Whoever has made the better preparation (as opposed to prevention) will be better positioned.

[SkyDekker 1,121]

1 hour ago, metalslug said:

It's unrealistic to think that conservatives have a disregard for future generations, especially their own.

The last Republican President clearly didn't care about anything but himself and could care less about his kids. Why would it be unrealistic to think that if the revered leader of the party is like that, a fair chunk of his followers are like that?

[billvon 2,380]

1 hour ago, metalslug said:

We disagree on timeline here. I expect you believe that the climate gets REALLY bad within the lifetime of the current generation

Not for most people, no.  Which is why a 50 year old conservative doesn't care much - as long as he doesn't lose his beach house.

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then conservatives also believe that it's still a really long road ahead.

And for a rich conservative in upstate New York - he is right.  It won't affect him much in his lifetime.  For the thousand or so people who recently died from the heat wave in Spain, not so much.  But again, as long as the New York conservative got his four slices, he doesn't care.

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It's unrealistic to think that conservatives have a disregard for future generations, especially their own. For some it's akin to an imperial bloodline for them.

You gave a good example above.  If it doesn't occur within their lifetime they don't much care - they can "kick the can down the road" to their kids.

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India and China are currently still regarded as 'developing' countries thereby granted some exemptions from emissions commitments

Yes.  So let's give them economic incentives.  Funding for nuclear power plants as long as they shut down their coal fired power plants.  Funding for solar and wind - again, as long as they shut down their gross polluters.  Heck, give them zero interest business loans to set up their own PV and SMR manufacturing facilities.

[ryoder 1,381]

5 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

The last Republican President clearly didn't care about anything but himself and could care less about his kids.

Not true!

 

[SkyDekker 1,121]

8 minutes ago, ryoder said:

Not true!

The fact he objectifies his daughter is a pretty clear sign he doesn't care for her or her wellbeing.