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Phil1111

Boris outdoes trump

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I didn't think it was possible.But Boris has outdone trump.  But in an effort to distract from covidpartygate. Boris Johnson has initiated a new immigrant process.

"Boris Johnson said 50 people have been told they will be sent to Rwanda within the next fortnight, and that he was ready to fight with “leftie lawyers” seeking to challenge the government’s plans for refugees.

Under the £120m scheme announced last month, people deemed to have entered the UK unlawfully will be transported to the east African country, where they will be allowed to apply for the right to settle."

Blame the left, lawyers, "people smugglers", etc. Classic populist distraction methodology.

How can UK citizens show their faces or passports anywhere in the world?

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If you really want to laugh, consider that Boris (or Priti Patel the foreign secretary, I can’t quite remember) introduced this policy with the words “while our compassion is infinite…

Are we living in Black Mirror or an Orwell novel? Hard to tell sometimes.

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These people are mainly economic migrants, coming to the UK for what they see as a free lunch in a 'soft touch' country. Unlike Ukraine, where we have welcomed women and children whose men have stayed behind to fight for their country, these freeloaders, who are often in the main male,  have transited through many safe countries on their way to their perceived meal ticket in Great Britain. If you don't live in the UK, feel free to zip it, your comments are irrelevant. If you do live in the UK, wake up and look around you. The country is too small to simply open it's borders to whoever wants to come here and is already creaking at the seams due to overload on our social services, all to the detriment of it's legitimate citizens. 

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21 minutes ago, jakee said:

If you really want to laugh, consider that Boris (or Priti Patel the foreign secretary, I can’t quite remember) introduced this policy with the words “while our compassion is infinite…

Are we living in Black Mirror or an Orwell novel? Hard to tell sometimes.

The British government says it wants to put the "criminal smuggling gangs who operate dangerous Channel crossings out of business."

“We cannot allow people traffickers to put lives at risk and our world-leading partnership will help break the business model of these ruthless criminals," Johnson said on Twitter.

Well that will do it. The refugees can enter the smuggling chain again in Rwanda. Then head back to the UK.

2 minutes ago, Bokdrol said:

These people are mainly economic migrants, coming to the UK for what they see as a free lunch in a 'soft touch' country. Unlike Ukraine, where we have welcomed women and children whose men have stayed behind to fight for their country, these freeloaders, who are often in the main male,  have transited through many safe countries on their way to their perceived meal ticket in Great Britain. If you don't live in the UK, feel free to zip it, your comments are irrelevant. If you do live in the UK, wake up and look around you. The country is too small to simply open it's borders to whoever wants to come here and is already creaking at the seams due to overload on our social services, all to the detriment of it's legitimate citizens. 

I thought it was all about "safety" and putting "smugglers out of business".

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59 minutes ago, Bokdrol said:

These people are mainly economic migrants, coming to the UK for what they see as a free lunch in a 'soft touch' country. Unlike Ukraine, where we have welcomed women and children whose men have stayed behind to fight for their country, these freeloaders, who are often in the main male,  have transited through many safe countries on their way to their perceived meal ticket in Great Britain. If you don't live in the UK, feel free to zip it, your comments are irrelevant. If you do live in the UK, wake up and look around you. The country is too small to simply open it's borders to whoever wants to come here and is already creaking at the seams due to overload on our social services, all to the detriment of it's legitimate citizens. 

Generally, if someone is coming to the UK as an economic migrant they will have applied for entry prior to leaving their home country, will have a job already lined up and letters from their employers and sponsors to show as proof. 

Most of the people crossing the channel are not economic migrants but refugees and asylum seekers, fleeing either unsafe conditions (war, famine etc) or persecution (political, religious or because of their sexuality). 

The definition of a refugee according to The 1951 United Nations Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees is:

“A person who owing to a well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group or political opinion, is outside the country of his nationality and is unable or, owing to such fear, is unwilling to avail himself of the protection of that country; or who, not having a nationality and being outside the country of his former habitual residence as a result of such events, is unable or, owing to such fear, is unwilling to return to it.”

In the UK, a person becomes a refugee when government agrees that an individual who has applied for asylum meets the definition in the Refugee Convention they will ‘recognise’ that person as a refugee and issue them with refugee status documentation. Usually refugees in the UK are given five years’ leave to remain as a refugee. They must then must apply for further leave, although their status as a refugee is not limited to five years.

Refugees certainly aren't coming here for a "soft touch". They're not allowed to work and most are given £40.65 per week to cover all their day to day expenses (food, toiletries, transport etc). If they're given accommodation it will usually be in a hostel or some other poor standard housing (including ex-military camps that have been classified as unfit for human habitation).

There is no such thing as an ‘illegal’ or ‘bogus’ asylum seeker. Under international law, anyone has the right to apply for asylum in any country that has signed the 1951 Convention and to remain there until the authorities have assessed their claim

It is recognised in the 1951 Convention that people fleeing persecution may have to use irregular means in order to escape and claim asylum in another country – there is no legal way to travel to the UK for the specific purpose of seeking asylum

The 1951 Refugee Convention guarantees everybody the right to apply for asylum. It has saved millions of lives. No country has ever withdrawn from it.

The UK's social and medical services are being overloaded, not by brown people fleeing war or persecution (usually from countries where the UK has been involved militarily - Iraq, Afghanistan - or from places where we've sold arms to countries such as Saudi Arabia who then use those weapons to bombard civilian populations in countries like Yemen) but by systematic and chronic underfunding of those services by successive governments.

The UK only accepts 0.026% of all the world's refugees with 86% being offered sanctuary in countries close to their country of origin.

If refugees were allowed to work while their claim for asylum was assessed they could make a massive contribution to the economy and society of the UK:

About 1,200 medically qualified refugees are recorded on the British Medical Association’s database. It is estimated that it costs around £25,000 to support a refugee doctor to practise in the UK. Training a new doctor is estimated to cost between £200,000 and £250,000 and takes between 5 and 7 years to qualify as a junior doctor.

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15 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

Why Rwanda and not the USA which is operating under a labour shortage right now?

The simple answer is cronyism. The company with responsibility for assessing asylum claims is InfoSys, a company based in Kigali and mainly owned by Nagavara Ramarao Narayana Murthy, an Indian businessman and father-in-law to the current Chancellor of the Exchequer, Rishi Sunak.

 

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3 minutes ago, rifleman said:

Most of the people crossing the channel are not economic migrants but refugees and asylum seekers,

Refugees from France and other EU countries that they've had to transit??? Don't make me laugh. They're coming here for a free ride and so I hope they like sunny Rwanda. In the immortal words of Bart Simpson  'Hey immigrants, country's full'. 

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The greatest threat to the UK public comes not from brown people fleeing war and persecution, but from over privileged, over educated, emotionally stunted public schoolboys who are pissing on them and telling them it's raining.

 

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3 hours ago, Bokdrol said:

These people are mainly economic migrants, coming to the UK for what they see as a free lunch in a 'soft touch' country. 

Bullshit. We’re talking about boat people who’ve taken a significant risk of death to get here in the first place. If you’re saying that’s what they consider an ‘easy life’ then you have to think about how awful things must be in the places they’re leaving. 
 

Never mind that some of the people being shipped out first are Afghan refugees fleeing the shitstorm we left behind.

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6 hours ago, Phil1111 said:

I didn't think it was possible.But Boris has outdone trump.  But in an effort to distract from covidpartygate. Boris Johnson has initiated a new immigrant process.

"Boris Johnson said 50 people have been told they will be sent to Rwanda within the next fortnight, and that he was ready to fight with “leftie lawyers” seeking to challenge the government’s plans for refugees.

Under the £120m scheme announced last month, people deemed to have entered the UK unlawfully will be transported to the east African country, where they will be allowed to apply for the right to settle."

Blame the left, lawyers, "people smugglers", etc. Classic populist distraction methodology.

How can UK citizens show their faces or passports anywhere in the world?

Hi Phil,

I was reading about that policy a day or so ago.

I am strong believer that any country has the right to determine who can or cannot enter their country legally.  Sometimes that becomes a very uncompassionate reason.

If it means that your mother-in-law cannot join you, too bad.

On the other hand, almost every person in the world wants to do what they can to improve their station in life; it is why I went to college.

In the words of JFK:  'Life isn't fair.'

Jerry Baumchen

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(edited)
2 hours ago, jakee said:

Bullshit. We’re talking about boat people who’ve taken a significant risk of death to get here in the first place. If you’re saying that’s what they consider an ‘easy life’ then you have to think about how awful things must be in the places they’re leaving. 
 

Never mind that some of the people being shipped out first are Afghan refugees fleeing the shitstorm we left behind.

Yeah, really awful in France where they just left, isn't it?? Total warzone ROFL ......the fact is the French don't make it 'easy' for them, nor do the Germans, nor do any of the other multiple countries they've transited to get to the land of perceived 'easy' benefits and free housing. Our veterans and homeless have to go to the foodbank while these wasters get it all. BS back at you x 2.

Edited by Bokdrol

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5 hours ago, rifleman said:

They're not allowed to work and most are given £40.65 per week to cover all their day to day expenses (food, toiletries, transport etc). If they're given accommodation it will usually be in a hostel or some other poor standard housing (including ex-military camps that have been classified as unfit for human habitation).

And yet we have our own citizens living rough/sleeping under the arches/dying of exposure/selling Big Issue to earn a crust - Wow - makes perfect sense to let all the freeloaders in, doesn't it??

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42 minutes ago, Bokdrol said:

Our veterans and homeless have to go to the foodbank while these wasters get it all. BS back at you x 2.

And once Boris has sent all the thieving refugees packing he’ll have loads of spare cash and will immediately offer much more support to veterans and the homeless, won’t he? ….. Wont he? Jesus man, I bet you believed the NHS slogan on the Leave bus too.

 

If you think veterans are being poorly treated, ask for veterans to be treated better. Their plight isn’t the refugee’s fault, it’s the government’s fault. Decade after decade of conservative and neo-liberal policies constantly eroding social services in favour of corporate tax breaks, shipping a few brown people off to central Africa isn’t going to undo that.

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5 minutes ago, Bokdrol said:

And yet we have our own citizens living rough/sleeping under the arches/dying of exposure/selling Big Issue to earn a crust - Wow - makes perfect sense to let all the freeloaders in, doesn't it??

I’m not sure why you think people willing to do what it takes to illegally immigrate would be freeloaders. Clearly you are regurgitating talking points and not thinking it through.

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7 minutes ago, Bokdrol said:

And yet we have our own citizens living rough/sleeping under the arches/dying of exposure/selling Big Issue to earn a crust - Wow - makes perfect sense to let all the freeloaders in, doesn't it??

Explain how one has anything to do with the other.

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2 hours ago, gowlerk said:

I’m not sure why you think people willing to do what it takes to illegally immigrate would be freeloaders. Clearly you are regurgitating talking points and not thinking it through.

In the UK 62% say immigration benefits the country v 29% that are conservative and, well, wrong.  "migrants living in the UK contribute £2,300 more to public purse each year than the average adult, suggesting a net contribution of £78,000 to the exchequer over their lifespan in the UK."

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(edited)
18 hours ago, rifleman said:

The greatest threat to the UK public comes not from brown people fleeing war and persecution, but from over privileged, over educated, emotionally stunted public schoolboys who are pissing on them and telling them it's raining.

 

The greatest threat to the UK comes not from overprivileged ex public shooolboys in office, it comes from 'New' Labour, which is these days simply a badly patched version of the Tories. Lead by a limp-wristed millionaire Knight of the Realm and his harpy deputy, they would take us further down the drain that was started by the other millionaire new-labourite-warmonger Blair. Let's not even talk about the Marxist terrorist sympathiser Corbyn. If Labour want to get back into power they need to go back to being the party of the working class and stop being Tory re-treads. Until that time BoJo is the man, suck it up.

Edited by Bokdrol

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18 hours ago, Bokdrol said:

and is already creaking at the seams due to overload on our social services

Like the NHS, which is massively staffed with immigrants?

And guess why the social services is overloaded - it starts with a 'C'. I personally know many doctors who were in the NHS who have left the UK due to the antics of Jeremy Hunt. Even now our Health Secretary is saying "the NHS has enough money" and saying it should be more like Netflix.

Blaming the most vulnerable people for your problems might make you feel better, but it won't solve your problems.

12 hours ago, Bokdrol said:

Yeah, really awful in France where they just left, isn't it?? Total warzone ROFL

Warzone? You can't afford to go there on holiday can you? :rofl: So what you know of France probably comes from the Daily Mail. Hint: they're lying to you.

The French authorities are very harsh towards asylum seekers, so no matter how nice of a place it is for people who aren't poor, I can understand why asylum seekers would want to flee further to the UK.

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12 hours ago, gowlerk said:

I’m not sure why you think people willing to do what it takes to illegally immigrate would be freeloaders. Clearly you are regurgitating talking points and not thinking it through.

From your flag you are a Canadian....check my initial post......

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(edited)
13 minutes ago, Bokdrol said:

If you REALLY need to ask this question, then you clearly wouldn't understand the explanation.

Try me. I've studied a lot of partial differential equations and specialised in nonlinear numerical methods, so I think I can handle a bit of complexity*. If you can just kindly provide an explanation from your shining intellect I'll try to translate it for the laypeople here.

(*not as credentialled as the professor here, only a master's degree but I do like technical stuff)

Edited by olofscience

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3 minutes ago, olofscience said:

Like the NHS, which is massively staffed with immigrants?

And guess why the social services is overloaded - it starts with a 'C'. I personally know many doctors who were in the NHS who have left the UK due to the antics of Jeremy Hunt. Even now our Health Secretary is saying "the NHS has enough money" and saying it should be more like Netflix.

Blaming the most vulnerable people for your problems might make you feel better, but it won't solve your problems.

Warzone? You can't afford to go there on holiday can you? :rofl: So what you know of France probably comes from the Daily Mail. Hint: they're lying to you.

The French authorities are very harsh towards asylum seekers, so no matter how nice of a place it is for people who aren't poor, I can understand why asylum seekers would want to flee further to the UK.

You've illustrated my point/s precisely. Thank you. (1) NHS is staffed with immigrants, but not ILLEGAL immigrants as these freeloaders are.  (2) I'm hoping that you got the sarcasm in my France 'warzone' statement - it's a perfectly safe country for them to settle in as were the other countries they transited to get to France - just because the French and others  are harsh on them (as we need to be) doesn't give them the right to row their boats over here to the perceived land of milk and honey. They are illegal, they are economic migrants (despite what pub quiz captain said in his migrant dissertation - yaaaawn - earlier). They need to go. 

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1 minute ago, Bokdrol said:

doesn't give them the right to row their boats over here[]. They are illegal

Actually it does -  it just shows your ignorance of international law. That's why they've been having so many problems stopping them - because they're not doing ANYTHING illegal.

It's legal to row to the UK and claim asylum.

The Government, however, IS actually trying to break international law, and they even admit it.

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