Packing - a bit of stuffing

[RichyR 0]

Right. This packing lark is totally doing my head in.

I've been on a packing course, and practiced packing my rig dozens of times, including watching packers pack it, and getting tips, but I still can't get it anywhere remotely close to what I've been shown.

I can bag it almost every time, however the bag folds aren't neat or particularly symmetrical, and I pretty much end up 'stuffing' bits in.

My question is, as long as it comes out the bag vaguely symmetrical, with the canopy wrapped, and the slider is still tight against the grommets, should all be well? When I unwrap the bag via the pilot chute, it comes out looking good.

For info, I have a ZP canopy with around 70 jumps on, and already reverse s-fold pack, so can easily ensure the slider is tight.

Thanks

[Blis 1]

In my limited experience, the worse it looks the better it opens. So, stuffing is totally ok as long as lines are tight and slider is tight against grommets...

[Anachronist 2]

Takes time, you don't get to be a good packer practicing dozens of times, more on the order of hundreds.

Focus on the important stuff, lines, slider, closing the container, stowing the bridal and PC. Pretty and fast takes time but functional can be a bit messy. Stuffing little bits in is A-OK.

[JohnnyMarko 1]

Ahhh reminds me of my packing days...

Bet your ass I was careful packing tandems (except that one time, sorry Mark) and student rigs.

But when it came to my sport rig, that 190 was just stuffed in there, I knew she wanted to open...honestly, get your lines as symmetrical as you can, then just shove the fucker in the bag. It'll open.

[theonlyski 3]

RichyR

For info, I have a ZP canopy with around 70 jumps on, and already reverse s-fold pack, so can easily ensure the slider is tight.

Well, a new canopy with 70 jumps is why you're having problems. I'd say if it looks good coming out (get an experienced instructor or rigger to make that call) then keep on trucking with what you're doing. Packing a new canopy has made a lot of experienced jumpers say screw it and using packers, so you're not alone there.

The trick with it all is a fine touch and a little technique. You'll find some packers shove it in there, but there are some that will make it look easy and beautiful every time. Keep an eye on what they're doing and how they're doing it and you might pick up on what it is.

A little bit too much pressure could cause the canopy to go sliding out somewhere, so pay attention to it, only use enough to hold it where you need it.

Oh and practice, practice, practice!

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message

[Hellis 0]

What most new packers make mistakes at is when you make the second fold (placing the tail on the slider/label).
If you don't make that fold far enough past the grommets you are pushing the first fold out.
Make sure the second fold is in line with the first fold if you look at the folds from above is really what I'm saying.

That is the main problem I see when people are packing.
If your canopy is large you can place one knee on each side of the first fold, this will keep the canopy from spreading out.
But that does not work on smaller canopies because the fold is too small

[Absolut 0]

Packed tons of canopies: the step from getting it from the ground into the bag is the least important one in my experience as long as you don't fuck up your work before (but it it acutally very easy to do with the right technique, asked your packer). First, get the lines aligned and keep a good tension, then fold everything nicely, set the slider all the way to the grommets and put it on the ground. As long as you don't slide all the way over the canopy it doesn't really matter how it looks in the bag as long as it is more or less symetrical. Stowing the lines is quite important too, but that doesn't seem to be a problem here.

[chuckakers 422]

RichyR

Right. This packing lark is totally doing my head in.

I've been on a packing course, and practiced packing my rig dozens of times, including watching packers pack it, and getting tips, but I still can't get it anywhere remotely close to what I've been shown.

I can bag it almost every time, however the bag folds aren't neat or particularly symmetrical, and I pretty much end up 'stuffing' bits in.

My question is, as long as it comes out the bag vaguely symmetrical, with the canopy wrapped, and the slider is still tight against the grommets, should all be well? When I unwrap the bag via the pilot chute, it comes out looking good.

For info, I have a ZP canopy with around 70 jumps on, and already reverse s-fold pack, so can easily ensure the slider is tight.

Thanks

I'll probably catch hell for this but yes, in my experience most canopies are quite forgiving of minor imperfections like you mentioned.

I spent years as a "trash packer", knowing what I could get away with and what I couldn't. When questioned I would remind folks that every pack job is a trash pack the moment it comes out of the deployment bag.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[RichyR 0]

Thanks for all the great advice.

After I first got it back from being setup by my rigger, it looked like an ironed sheet it was so neat!

One thing I have realised is my container closing loop is around 10mm shorter than Sunpath recommend. Both packers have commented on how tight it is (but said it is safe). I've just bought a replacement, so at least that part should be a bit easier.

[tristansdad 0]

The more you pack the better you'll get. In Theory.

[skygypsie 2]

10,000+ tandem packs, at least that many in student & sport rigs...

a canopy w/ 70 jumps, my suggestion:

run lines, set brakes, clear the cells, clover leaf the slider, clear grommets, pull up tail, gently set on floor, THROW A PIECE OF CARPET OVER IT !!!

After a few minutes, when fabric deflates, gently roll into smallest cocoon you can while maintaining control, not upsetting lines.

Should be more manageable to put into bag neatly.
* use of knees & feet are beneficial *

Maintain control of lines while running stows.
(use a lobster claw type -light grip, don't milk)
Keep stows even.

* Closing loop thing...easier is NOT better, for jumper !

*Remember: whether they want to open or not...

WHAT YOU PUT INTO A PACK

** edited to add: over 20,000 packs in 8 years, only 1 mal resulting in cutaway.
It was my 1st weekend packing tandems. Had no clue what a step through was.
My packing mentor & skydiving instructor, now husband, kept me up till 3 am. "teaching" me as many mals he could think of...he was the TI who had to chop it away

[EvilGenius 0]

Hey RichyR,

I'm in a similar position to you as a new jumper with a brand new canopy! Good news is that I've been wrestling with the ba*%ard thing for about 25 jumps now, it's finally looking tidy in the bag and I've stopped swearing at it.

I found this series of videos really helped me....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhEHdKemr1M

....that and some tips from my friendly rigger on getting the air out and keeping it out.

Good luck!

[Amazon 7]

You may want to invest some time looking at a Psycho Pack

[cruelpops 0]

Try the reverse S-fold method. It's much easier to control (in my opinion).

[DougH 270]

I will second the reverse s-fold. It allows you to put the bag around the canopy instead of stuffing the canopy in the bag. It also is helpful with slide placement, since that is the last fold you make, and the canopy is already bagged at that point.

I can pack anything from a brand new tandem to a pocket rocket with that method with ease.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[dthames 0]

RichyR

Thanks for all the great advice.

After I first got it back from being setup by my rigger, it looked like an ironed sheet it was so neat!

One thing I have realised is my container closing loop is around 10mm shorter than Sunpath recommend. Both packers have commented on how tight it is (but said it is safe). I've just bought a replacement, so at least that part should be a bit easier.

My closing loop was a bit short. I made it tiny bit longer. I was much easier to close and MUCH easier to move the pin with just a little finger pressure. I tightened it back up, got one of those metal power tools and learned to close it easily with the short closing loop.

Struggle on the ground closing the container is better than premature deployment.

Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

[bjbkkb 1]

Blis

In my limited experience, the worse it looks the better it opens. So, stuffing is totally ok as long as lines are tight and slider is tight against grommets...

Blis, you are so right. I have had a couple of pack jobs that on the way up to altitude I do a couple of extra EPs in my head because I am sure I am going to need them. They always turn out to be the sweetest openings.

My goal is that when all is said done I will have a big pile of well used gear and a collection of great stories.

[Joellercoaster 6]

chuckakers

in my experience most canopies are quite forgiving of minor imperfections like you mentioned

Yup. My packjobs looked awful for years. The two mals I've packed were after they stopped looking like that.

RichyR, you will get better. Contrary to what people are saying about major technique changes (Reverse S-fold! Psycho Pack! Ninja Hotdog Pack!), what will gradually make your packjobs neater is a few hundred iterations of putting a canopy in a bag - gradually you acquire a touch.

Knowing in your body, below the level of conscious thought, where to lean, what to press, how to control with the side of your knee (or whatever knacks you personally pick up) just comes from doing it a lot. Watching professionals doing it for a few hours can help but only so much.

You can practise on mine for free

--
"I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan

"You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at?

[CloudyHead 0]

i was having problems packing awhile ago (i couldn't keep it small and tight enough).

Right after my first S-fold, I place both knees on the slider section. Instead of doing the second fold right away like most people would, I barely lift one knee at a time and push the sides as far inwards as i can, until all the fabric is under my knees. This way it keeps it all very narrow and tight, and i have to do much less "stuffing" at the end. it's basically the only way to physically pack my new slippery canopy otherwise it gets away from me.

[RichyR 0]

Thanks everyone.

Now signed off to pack, and have packed a couple unsupervised that both opened great.

Still takes almost 30mins though!!

[TracyS 0]

RichyR,

Don't sweat the time that it takes. Speed comes with repetition.
Just take your time and focus on doing it the same way each time, so it becomes a routine.
The more times you do it, the better your time will get.

RichyR

Thanks everyone.

Now signed off to pack, and have packed a couple unsupervised that both opened great.

Still takes almost 30mins though!!

Canopies must all be female. If I treat mine good, she gives me a good ride. If I slap her in the bag, she will dump me like a turd.

Courtesy of PRE7117, love that line.

[dang32 0]

RichyR

Thanks everyone.

Now signed off to pack, and have packed a couple unsupervised that both opened great.

Still takes almost 30mins though!!

does it really matter that it takes 30 minutes takes me just as long but am confident knowing I packed it and it'll open nice