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brenthutch

Climate Fails 2021

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6 hours ago, brenthutch said:

Here is a quick look as 2021 comes to an end, let’s hope we can learn from our mistakes 

https://junkscience.com/2021/12/unsung-zeroes-the-top-10-under-reported-climate-flops-of-2021/

eagerly awaiting the attacks on the messenger instead of addressing the message 9_9

You having cold flashes again?

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Quick; Someone explain to all the people in Superior CO and Louisville CO who just received their first measurable snow December 31, a day after a wildfire tore through, that there is no climate change.

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26 minutes ago, ryoder said:

Quick; Someone explain to all the people in Superior CO and Louisville CO who just received their first measurable snow December 31, a day after a wildfire tore through, that there is no climate change.

Not all wildfires are "wild".

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/11/19/us/california-wildfires-gary-stephen-maynard.html

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25 minutes ago, ryoder said:

Quick; Someone explain to all the people in Superior CO and Louisville CO who just received their first measurable snow December 31, a day after a wildfire tore through, that there is no climate change.

That’s an easy one, the West Coast is hogging all of the snow.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/lake-tahoe-sees-16-feet-snow-december-crushing/story?id=81986675

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1 minute ago, kallend said:

Red herring - not in the slightest bit relevant to the CO fire that destroyed hundreds of houses.

I didn't realize there was already proof that it wasn't arson.  Care to show me where you got that info?

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I made no claim.  I simply pointed out that fires aren't always wild.  That might be the case here, might not.

One of the things that bothers me all the time is how certain you all are that it couldn't be anything other than climate change.

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Initial blame was on high winds causing power lines to spark, but Xcel investigated and found no evidence of such.

Meanwhile someone post cellphone video from a car stopped at the intersection of 93 & 170 showing a small tool shed burning on the NE corner of the intersection around the time the fire started. This is at the upwind edge of the suspected location it started.

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(edited)
18 minutes ago, airdvr said:

I made no claim.  I simply pointed out that fires aren't always wild.  That might be the case here, might not.

 

What started it, and why it happened are two different issues.

This is a suburban area, with insufficient vegetation to maintain a wildfire were it not for 2 things that combined to enable it:

1. No snow whatsoever this winter until the day after the fire, leaving all the dead, dried out grasses exposed.

2. Winds maintaining 60+ mph, and gusting to 90+.

The combination enabled burning materials to to travel long distances to be deposited on new flammable areas. For example the fire initially swept into Superior, and then jumped a six-lane divided highway (US36) to set Louisville on fire.  What stopped the fire was when the winds died off at dusk.

 

Edited by ryoder

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9 minutes ago, ryoder said:

What started it, and why it happened are two different issues.

This is a suburban area, with insufficient vegetation to maintain a wildfire were it not for 2 things that combined to enable it:

1. No snow whatsoever this winter until the day after the fire, leaving all the dead, dried out grasses exposed.

2. Winds maintaining 60+ mph, and gusting to 90+.

The combination enabled burning materials to to travel long distances to be deposited on new flammable areas. For example the fire initially swept into Superior, and then jumped a six-lane divided highway (US36) to set Louisville on fire.  What stopped the fire was when the winds died off at dusk.

 

OK...but you aren't able to equate that scenario to climate change.  sometimes it doesn't snow.  Grass dries out and winds blow.

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4 minutes ago, airdvr said:

OK...but you aren't able to equate that scenario to climate change.  sometimes it doesn't snow.  Grass dries out and winds blow.

The city/county of Denver (17 miles South)  just broke two records for, latest first snowfall, and consecutive days without snow:

Source: https://www.weather.gov/bou/DenverSnowLessStreaks

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36 minutes ago, airdvr said:

I didn't realize there was already proof that it wasn't arson.  Care to show me where you got that info?

It is being blamed on high winds and damaged powerlines along with a wet spring followed by an extremely dry summer and fall. Even if arson was involved it would only be a part of the picture. You are asking for proof? I'm sure you know that it is impossible to prove a negative. 

https://www.npr.org/2021/12/31/1069416715/colorado-marshall-fire-caused-by-high-winds-drought

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(edited)
42 minutes ago, airdvr said:

One of the things that bothers me all the time is how certain you all are that it couldn't be anything other than climate change.

Everything weather related is now instantly blamed on climate change. I get what your frustration is. How can you possibly know the exact cause of a single event? So instead of that consider the steady and provable increase in CO2 levels, the steady and provable increase in ocean temps, and the steady and provable decrease in the size of glaciers. Don't get distracted, keep your eyes on the ball.

Edited by gowlerk
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(edited)
1 hour ago, ryoder said:

Initial blame was on high winds causing power lines to spark, but Xcel investigated and found no evidence of such.

Meanwhile someone post cellphone video from a car stopped at the intersection of 93 & 170 showing a small tool shed burning on the NE corner of the intersection around the time the fire started. This is at the upwind edge of the suspected location it started.

And the burning shed video, which I saw on Reddit yesterday, has made it to mainstream:

https://kdvr.com/news/local/could-this-burning-shed-be-the-source-of-the-marshall-fire/

The car was headed East at this intersection:

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9536962,-105.2322947,3a,75y,89.45h,87.5t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1swXUzZZP30Tajy1weuLkSSw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

ETA: This was the source of the video posted at 1708 on the day of the fire:

 

Edited by ryoder

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1 hour ago, airdvr said:

I didn't realize there was already proof that it wasn't arson.  Care to show me where you got that info?

The cause of the fire isn't anywhere near as relevant as the speed that it spread and the damage it did.

Something like 97% are started by people. Some accidently, some intentionally, some negligently.

Climate change doesn't cause the fires. 

It doesn't start the fires.

But they sure seem to be bigger and more destructive than they used to be.

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19 minutes ago, wolfriverjoe said:

The cause of the fire isn't anywhere near as relevant as the speed that it spread and the damage it did.

Something like 97% are started by people. Some accidently, some intentionally, some negligently.

Climate change doesn't cause the fires. 

It doesn't start the fires.

But they sure seem to be bigger and more destructive than they used to be.

Increased humidity, increased instability, from climate change can cause more lightning.

Otherwise I agree with everything. AFAIK there should have been snow on the ground in that area this time of year. At least that was reported in several news dispatches. Be it loss of wildlife, human life, or homes wildfires are bad news.

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I suppose one of our deniers will be along to tell us that the current  January 2 tornado watch in KY, TN and AL is due to arson, along with the record breaking December 2021 tornado outbreak there.   Couldn't possibly be climate change.

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