wmw999 2,120 #1 Posted December 18, 2021 Maybe my "articles you might like" mindreader was looking at dz.com... Either way, I just read this article on dynastic wealth, and just how hard it is to avoid setting up an overclass and an underclass. The Great Inheritors (from Propublica) Yes, Propublica is a liberal source, so consider that. But there is some point there, too. The great equalizer in our extended era was probably the great depression -- there were fortunes lost. Not the truly huge (although some very significant ones -- look up Charles Schwab, the steel tycoon), but certainly plenty of rich people had their circumstances change. Since then, the 50's and early 60's did a decent job of not creating too many new empires. But the combination of trickle-down and the tech boom has really skewed things. I'm relatively rich; I have enough money to pretty much do anything I want to, and donate a decent amount of money. And I'm not in the same universe with even the really rich, never mind the oligarchs who can stomp on people, and who think that all of their money was earned by their superior talents, and that the luck of having had the idea that took root at the right time (were Apple and Microsoft really the absolute best technically, or just in the right place at the right time?). It's not whether they deserve to be rich. It's whether their luck means they effectively get to control that much of America or the world. Wendy P. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,051 #2 December 18, 2021 Musk, Bezos, Gates, etc. are not to blame. The tax codes need to be changed. Period. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,120 #3 December 18, 2021 They are to blame for exerting pressure, especially in the form of campaign support in these times. All those dark money sources... Wendy P. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,394 #4 December 18, 2021 2 hours ago, BIGUN said: Musk, Bezos, Gates, etc. are not to blame. The tax codes need to be changed. Period. And the tax codes will never change because of - Musk, Bezos, Gates etc. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,051 #5 December 18, 2021 4 minutes ago, billvon said: And the tax codes will never change because of - Musk, Bezos, Gates Your team had the chance to fix it. https://www.forbes.com/sites/giacomotognini/2021/10/29/these-billionaires-might-have-just-dodged-a-333-billion-tax-bullet-thanks-to-revised-tax-proposal/?sh=1532e12a5fbd Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #6 December 18, 2021 1 hour ago, BIGUN said: Your team had the chance to fix it. https://www.forbes.com/sites/giacomotognini/2021/10/29/these-billionaires-might-have-just-dodged-a-333-billion-tax-bullet-thanks-to-revised-tax-proposal/?sh=1532e12a5fbd Unfortunately "our team" has a couple of fifth columnists in its senatorial ranks. DINOs. All the while the Senate has anti-democratic demographics and anti-democratic rules nothing will change. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,120 #7 December 18, 2021 But those DINOs are just as reasonable to the Rs as the so-called RINOs (like McCain) are to us. They're the check, especially now that opposing parties see stopping the opponents as more of a goal than actually helping the country. Pisses me off, too, but it's probably necessary. Wendy P. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #8 December 18, 2021 1 minute ago, wmw999 said: But those DINOs are just as reasonable to the Rs as the so-called RINOs (like McCain) are to us. They're the check, especially now that opposing parties see stopping the opponents as more of a goal than actually helping the country. Pisses me off, too, but it's probably necessary. Wendy P. I am sure you are aware of the great imbalance in votes that resulted in a 50/50 split in the Senate. And the Electoral College is just a joke. Madison fucked up big time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,394 #9 December 19, 2021 2 hours ago, BIGUN said: Your team had the chance to fix it. https://www.forbes.com/sites/giacomotognini/2021/10/29/these-billionaires-might-have-just-dodged-a-333-billion-tax-bullet-thanks-to-revised-tax-proposal/?sh=1532e12a5fbd Which team is that? (I'm not a democrat.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,297 #10 December 19, 2021 2 hours ago, kallend said: I am sure you are aware of the great imbalance in votes that resulted in a 50/50 split in the Senate. And the Electoral College is just a joke. Madison fucked up big time. Yep, and that's why we are screwed. So in the face of things can we now quit pretending we have a reparable democracy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,051 #11 December 19, 2021 11 hours ago, billvon said: Which team is that? (I'm not a democrat.) My Bad. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phil1111 910 #12 December 19, 2021 Y'all forgot the USSC in the equation of blame for the substance of this thread.Then don't forget it's the "teams" that appoint those judges. Whose pens have absolute finality in the absence of congressional action. That argument kinda went in a circle....I guess its congress after all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,051 #13 December 19, 2021 15 hours ago, wmw999 said: Pisses me off, This is the kinda shit that pisses me off - Quote What he didn’t mention is that his heavenly plans are being underwritten by Texas taxpayers. Under a little-known statute that county appraisers say is too vague and permissive, the $7 million mansion owned by Copeland’s Eagle Mountain International Church is considered a parsonage — a clergy residence — qualifying for a 100 percent tax break. That means Copeland’s church gets a pass on what would otherwise be an annual property tax bill exceeding $150,000 — money that other local taxpayers must backfill to cover the cost of schools, police and firefighters. https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/investigations/unfair-burden/article/kenneth-copeland-wealth-pastor-tax-free-mansion-16662283.php Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,120 #14 December 19, 2021 That too. Money should not, in fact, be able to buy everything. Neither should religion Wendy P. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #15 December 19, 2021 27 minutes ago, wmw999 said: That too. Money should not, in fact, be able to buy everything. Neither should religion Wendy P. Once you allow money to buy senators and congresspersons, the rest follows like night follows day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #16 December 19, 2021 28 minutes ago, wmw999 said: That too. Money should not, in fact, be able to buy everything. Neither should religion Wendy P. Aren't you supposed to be heading south today? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,120 #17 December 19, 2021 We’re waiting at the hotel for our late-night flight; flew in from Hartford. We thought we were all going to be in the ballroom area with 100 of our newest friends, but the company sprung for a daytime hotel room, which is nice. An hour of yoga, a nice shower in the afternoon — we might even be ready to sleep on the plane. Wendy P. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #18 December 21, 2021 On 12/18/2021 at 10:55 AM, wmw999 said: Maybe my "articles you might like" mindreader was looking at dz.com... Either way, I just read this article on dynastic wealth, and just how hard it is to avoid setting up an overclass and an underclass. The Great Inheritors (from Propublica) Yes, Propublica is a liberal source, so consider that. But there is some point there, too. The great equalizer in our extended era was probably the great depression -- there were fortunes lost. Not the truly huge (although some very significant ones -- look up Charles Schwab, the steel tycoon), but certainly plenty of rich people had their circumstances change. Since then, the 50's and early 60's did a decent job of not creating too many new empires. But the combination of trickle-down and the tech boom has really skewed things. I'm relatively rich; I have enough money to pretty much do anything I want to, and donate a decent amount of money. And I'm not in the same universe with even the really rich, never mind the oligarchs who can stomp on people, and who think that all of their money was earned by their superior talents, and that the luck of having had the idea that took root at the right time (were Apple and Microsoft really the absolute best technically, or just in the right place at the right time?). It's not whether they deserve to be rich. It's whether their luck means they effectively get to control that much of America or the world. Wendy P. 70% of inherited wealth is lost in the first generation, 90% in the generation after that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,121 #19 December 21, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, brenthutch said: 70% of inherited wealth is lost in the first generation, 90% in the generation after that. Other than "news" articles claiming this, do you have any evidence this is true? Supposedly it is based on research published by the Williams Group, which is a company that coaches families through successful wealth transfers. Edited December 21, 2021 by SkyDekker Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #20 December 21, 2021 (edited) 25 minutes ago, SkyDekker said: Other than "news" articles claiming this, do you have any evidence this is true? Supposedly it is based on research published by the Williams Group, which is a company that coaches families through successful wealth transfers. https://www.yahoo.com/now/5-huge-lies-generational-wealth-181719865.html. It’s worth noting the emotion responsible for antipathy towards the wealthy is envy. Not a good look. Edited December 21, 2021 by brenthutch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dr.SkyFall 28 #21 December 22, 2021 23 hours ago, brenthutch said: https://www.yahoo.com/now/5-huge-lies-generational-wealth-181719865.html. It’s worth noting the emotion responsible for antipathy towards the wealthy is envy. Not a good look. Thats not evidence, that is just someone claiming it.... 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brenthutch 383 #22 December 22, 2021 2 hours ago, Dr.SkyFall said: Thats not evidence, that is just someone claiming it.... If you have evidence to the contrary I would love to see it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
olofscience 420 #23 December 23, 2021 2 hours ago, brenthutch said: If you have evidence to the contrary I would love to see it. Burden of proof is on the one who makes the claim. Also, you can't prove a negative, but it's already clear you didn't remotely get to logic class because of failing so many levels below it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,394 #24 December 23, 2021 On 12/21/2021 at 1:43 PM, SkyDekker said: Other than "news" articles claiming this, do you have any evidence this is true? You are asking this after posting here for how many years? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #25 December 23, 2021 On 12/21/2021 at 3:43 PM, SkyDekker said: Other than "news" articles claiming this, do you have any evidence this is true? Supposedly it is based on research published by the Williams Group, which is a company that coaches families through successful wealth transfers. Are you suggesting that the source might not have the purest of motives? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites