House passes USD 1 Trillion infrastructure bill

[JoeWeber 2,299]

In an embarrassing snub to Brent Hutchings, and his Progressive Caucus friends, and with a bi-partisan vote the House advanced President Biden's agenda to improve the quality of life for all Americans. 

So far there has been no comment from Ilhan Omar, AOC, Brent Hutchings, Cori Bush, or Jamaal Brown.

[Phil1111 910]

As compared to others who also promised to rebuild America:

"As a presidential candidate in 2016, Donald Trump promised a $1 trillion infrastructure plan that would use tax incentives to spur private investment in public works projects.

He has so far failed to persuade Congress to pass anything like that."

In fact the GOP and trump really made no effort to prepare America for the future. Their interests solely in passing and immediately taking advantage of tax reductions, tax credits to personally benefit.

[GeorgiaDon 340]

2 hours ago, Phil1111 said:

In fact the GOP and trump really made no effort to prepare America for the future.

The whole point of "make America great again" was to turn the clock back to the 1940s and 1950s (which King Trump personally identified as the time when  America was great).  IOW, back to when everyone except white uneducated males knew their place, which was at the back of the bus.

[wmw999 2,121]

52 minutes ago, GeorgiaDon said:

The whole point of "make America great again" was to turn the clock back to the 1940s and 1950s (which King Trump personally identified as the time when  America was great).  IOW, back to when everyone except white uneducated males knew their place, which was at the back of the bus.

And since they were all children at most then, they weren’t aware of the level of taxation it took for all that middle class growth and infrastructure. 
Wendy P. 

[billvon 2,400]

1 hour ago, GeorgiaDon said:

The whole point of "make America great again" was to turn the clock back to the 1940s and 1950s (which King Trump personally identified as the time when  America was great).  IOW, back to when everyone except white uneducated males knew their place, which was at the back of the bus.

And when top marginal tax rates were over 80%.  They forget that part.

1940: 81%
1945: 94%
1950: 84%
1955: 91%
1960: 91%

A large part of what "made America great" for those people were the policies that transferred wealth from the wealthiest Americans to them.

 

[Phil1111 910]

2 hours ago, billvon said:

And when top marginal tax rates were over 80%.  They forget that part.

1940: 81%
1945: 94%
1950: 84%
1955: 91%
1960: 91%

A large part of what "made America great" for those people were the policies that transferred wealth from the wealthiest Americans to them.

 

Those were all times before the GOP declared Washington and the government as the enemy. That politicians were out to line their pockets, that taxes was theft, benefits from the state all unnecessary. Entitlements corrosive to the work ethic that only White God fearing Americans possess.

[gowlerk 1,912]

4 hours ago, GeorgiaDon said:

The whole point of "make America great again" was to turn the clock back to the 1940s and 1950s (which King Trump personally identified as the time when  America was great).  IOW, back to when everyone except white uneducated males knew their place, which was at the back of the bus.

I believe tax rates were much higher then.

 

edit I see others have already made that point.

Edited November 6, 2021 by gowlerk

[BIGUN 1,053]

4 hours ago, billvon said:

A large part of what "made America great" for those people were the policies that transferred wealth from the wealthiest Americans to them

So, do we blame the Democrats for stopping that? 

Kennedy & Johnson tax cuts in '64.

The point being that we need to wrap some historical context around the raising or cutting of taxes and both parties bear responsibility in each situation AND we've seen some of our best times when both worked together - for the US economy. We need to stop the loud voice anti - other party for taxes. Both raise and cut taxes. 

Quote

 

In the interest of simplicity, this analysis ignores a lot of legislative context. Reagan’s tax cuts were partly a response to the slow growth and sky-high inflation of the 1970s. Obama’s 2010 tax cuts were part of an effort to stimulate the economy in the aftermath of the Great Recession. Many of these bills had effects on taxes at other levels of income, and on different types of taxes altogether, like the estate tax and the capital gains tax.

It also bears pointing out that the top marginal tax rate is very different from the effective tax rate that most wealthy people actually pay. The effective rate for the top 1 percent of earners, for instance, has hovered around 30 percent for most of the period under consideration in the analysis above because of various write-offs, exceptions and loopholes top earners are able to take advantage of.

But still, focusing on the top marginal tax rate in isolation is useful because of its relationship to inequality. While wealthy people have many ways to arrange their finances to avoid paying the top rate, the rate nevertheless sets the baseline for how taxes of the wealthy are calculated in any given year.

While Republicans are typically seen as the party of tax cuts for the rich, the analysis above shows that Democrats have played a significant role in reductions in the top marginal tax rate, too: They provided 30 percent of the total House and Senate votes in support of the five bills that have lowered the top rate since the 1980s.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/us-policy/2019/02/27/top-tax-rate-has-been-cut-six-times-since-usually-with-democrats-help/

 

It's not a "Demoncrats" "Repubicans" are the antichrist discussion. "WE" need to work together. Period.  

 

Edited November 6, 2021 by BIGUN
cause I got wordy

[billvon 2,400]

1 hour ago, BIGUN said:

So, do we blame the Democrats for stopping that? 

Not too interested in which party to "blame" - I am sure both of them worked to change that.  I am more interested in understanding the narrative.  The "make America great again" group doesn't really want to return to the time when they claim America was great, and I suspect its adherents would be horrified if we returned to the taxation of those times.  It's more of an umbrella phrase that means whatever people want it to mean.

[BIGUN 1,053]

15 hours ago, billvon said:

Not too interested in which party to "blame"

Apologies. The thread tone was anti-GOP. 18 members of the GOP voted for the infrastructure bill. On a similar note - I don't think the news media did a good job of explaining the 1T infrastructure bill when compared to the annual 798B military budget. 

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

17 hours ago, BIGUN said:

So, do we blame the Democrats for stopping that? 

Kennedy & Johnson tax cuts in '64.

The point being that we need to wrap some historical context around the raising or cutting of taxes and both parties bear responsibility in each situation AND we've seen some of our best times when both worked together - for the US economy. We need to stop the loud voice anti - other party for taxes. Both raise and cut taxes. 

It's not a "Demoncrats" "Repubicans" are the antichrist discussion. "WE" need to work together. Period.  

 

 

15 hours ago, billvon said:

Not too interested in which party to "blame" - I am sure both of them worked to change that.  I am more interested in understanding the narrative.  The "make America great again" group doesn't really want to return to the time when they claim America was great, and I suspect its adherents would be horrified if we returned to the taxation of those times.  It's more of an umbrella phrase that means whatever people want it to mean.

Much more of a "that was then, this is now" sort of thing.

Similar (but not as extreme) as the former platform of the Ds embracing slavery before the Civil War and opposing Civil Rights for minorities until the late Sixties. 
Don't forget that Robert Byrd was a Grand Dragon of the KKK. Strom Thurmond was a blatant racist back in the day too.

While it may have been the Ds who took apart the tax structure that 'Made America Great" back in the 50s, they didn't do so in order to 'own' the Rs. 
I don't recall any D in power saying anything close to 'we will oppose any agenda of the Rs, even if it isn't in the best interests of the country'.

The Ds keep reaching out to the Rs for cooperation on lots of things. 
The Rs (mainly McConnell) keep biting at the hand reaching out.

Not too surprising that the Ds are reaching out less and less.

[BIGUN 1,053]

1 hour ago, wolfriverjoe said:

While it may have been the Ds who took apart the tax structure that 'Made America Great" back in the 50s, they didn't do so in order to 'own' the Rs. 
I don't recall any D in power saying anything close to 'we will oppose any agenda of the Rs, even if it isn't in the best interests of the country'.

I obviously missed the mark. My point was intended to reflect on the historical context regarding the cutting or raising of taxes. It was Keynes theory that pulled us out of the depression. With that - it was Keynesian theorist who recommended to Kennedy to cut taxes. My point was it's really not a D or R issue; it's an economic necessity at times no matter which D or R are in power. Hence, the Washington Post article. Hell, even Obama cut taxes.  It's all about expanding or contracting the flow of money.. 

[JoeWeber 2,299]

2 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Apologies. The thread tone was anti-GOP. 18 members of the GOP voted for the infrastructure bill. On a similar note - I don't think the news media did a good job of explaining the 1T infrastructure bill when compared to the annual 798B military budget. 

Yep, some bipartisanship would be nice. I guess Rep. Nicole Malliotakis (R) of New York gave it a go by voting for the infrastructure bill if only, by her admission, to "own" AOC and make the Squad ineffectual. Slightly less nuanced is the guy at the highway intersection down the street with the giant FUCK BIDEN flag. 

I'd just like to know what gives anyone hope the Republicans will ever again be honest brokers. We're now one year since Trump lost in a fair election and Republican obstructionists and enablers in the House and Senate still refuse to make statements of truth that might help heal the growing divide in our country. Worse, they see enormous political value in a divided United States. Unbelievably, talk of further insurrection and even civil war is, and for good reason, being taken seriously and that is not because Democrats want it. Sure, the economic and social policies of the Democrats are often ill formed and, for many, downright offensive. However, if you'll just give us enough time we'll fight amongst ourselves until we have no tail feathers so no worries there. The thing is, there is not a Democratic Mitch McConnell or Marjory Greene, not a comprehensive list by dozens, doing their level best to avoid any semblance of bipartisanship. Sometimes step one is identifying what is causing the actual problem.

[wmw999 2,121]

I think for too many people and politicians any more, the priorities are:

1. You lose
2. I win
3. We get something done

Wendy P.

[JoeWeber 2,299]

2 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

I think for too many people and politicians any more, the priorities are:

1. You lose
2. I win
3. We get something done

Wendy P.

I would posit that numbers 1 and 2 are more applicable to current Republican politicians than Democrats. 

[wmw999 2,121]

Some of the discussions on dz.com seem to follow that pattern, too

Wendy P.

[JoeWeber 2,299]

4 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

Some of the discussions on dz.com seem to follow that pattern, too

Wendy P.

Somedays the face of Jesus is found in every grilled cheese sandwich.

[BIGUN 1,053]

9 hours ago, JoeWeber said:

The thing is, there is not a Democratic Mitch McConnell or Marjory Greene, not a comprehensive list by dozens, doing their level best to avoid any semblance of bipartisanship. Sometimes step one is identifying what is causing the actual problem.

You can start here:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/28/us/politics/pelosi-infrastructure-house-vote.html

[JoeWeber 2,299]

1 hour ago, BIGUN said:

You can start here:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/28/us/politics/pelosi-infrastructure-house-vote.html

And stop there, too. Pelosi and others did a work around members of their own party to get something done. That isn't laudable? For certain it in no way equates to the Grim Reaper. Surely I'm missing your actual point.

(Oh, and you can relax, I found a firing pin for my BRNO RV85 Launcher. You wouldn't have any 28.5mm armor piercing tear gas rounds laying around, would you?)

Edited November 8, 2021 by JoeWeber

[brenthutch 383]

On 11/6/2021 at 1:23 AM, JoeWeber said:

In an embarrassing snub to Brent Hutchings, and his Progressive Caucus friends, and with a bi-partisan vote the House advanced President Biden's agenda to improve the quality of life for all Americans. 

So far there has been no comment from Ilhan Omar, AOC, Brent Hutchings, Cori Bush, or Jamaal Brown.

Actually I am not against the infrastructure bill, I just wish it was paid for.  It does take the wind out of the progressives’ sails and in my book that is a win.

[wmw999 2,121]

Quote

It does take the wind out of the progressives’ sails and in my book that is a win.

Yep; who is more important than what.

Wendy P.

[brenthutch 383]

4 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

Yep; who is more important than what.

Wendy P.

No Wendy, I honestly think a massive tax and spend socialist boondoggle is not good for the US.  Especially when, according to a recent pool, most Americans want government to do less, not more.

[JoeWeber 2,299]

16 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

No Wendy, I honestly think a massive tax and spend socialist boondoggle is not good for the US.  Especially when, according to a recent pool, most Americans want government to do less, not more.

What pool and whose pee? My understanding is that free shit remains wildly popular amongst just about everyone except the chattering class.

[BIGUN 1,053]

1 hour ago, JoeWeber said:

Pelosi and others did a work around members of their own party to get something done. That isn't laudable? For certain it in no way equates to the Grim Reaper. Surely I'm missing your actual point.

The point being that even the D's seem to have their issues. 

1 hour ago, JoeWeber said:

I found a firing pin for my BRNO RV85 Launcher. You wouldn't have any 28.5mm armor piercing tear gas rounds laying around, would you?

I do not, but perhaps we can rub penis heads and the first one to smile loses. :) 

[JoeWeber 2,299]

1 minute ago, BIGUN said:

The point being that even the D's seem to have their issues. 

I do not, but perhaps we can rub penis heads and the first one to smile loses. :) 

I know I have issues, that's certain. And I'm already smiling so you win.