Mr. Bill Question

[Andy_Copland 0]

Quote

Some possibilities for a fun dismount are a canopy transfer to downplane or a pilot chute assist.

Thats a quote from another thread that got me thinking. Would a PC create enough drag to pull the line stows successfully if you literally held the PC until the container opened or would you need to hold until the canopy came out the D-bag itself.

Im thinking holding it until its totally out the bag and the stows are out would be the best option.

Maybe not, anyone know?

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[billvon 2,379]

>Would a PC create enough drag to pull the line stows successfully if you
>literally held the PC until the container opened or would you need to hold
>until the canopy came out the D-bag itself.

I'm not sure what you are asking.

Will the PC provide enough drag to pull the canopy out of the D-bag? Yes, that's what it's designed to do.

Do you need to hold onto it? No. Ask any IAD JM how to deal with a PC during such an exit. Basically your only job is to get it into clean air without entangling on anything or getting in front of anything.

>Im thinking holding it until its totally out the bag and the stows are
>out would be the best option.

DO NOT DO THIS! We tried this at Brown. The canopy came out of the bag and started inflating backwards with its topskin to the wind (since the guy was still holding on to the PC.) Slider was slammed down the lines by the relative wind, so that when he finally let go of the PC, the canopy inflated instantly. Result: one destroyed canopy, one broken femur, one screwed up back.

[Andy_Copland 0]

Quote

DO NOT DO THIS! We tried this at Brown. The canopy came out of the bag and started inflating backwards with its topskin to the wind (since the guy was still holding on to the PC.) Slider was slammed down the lines by the relative wind, so that when he finally let go of the PC, the canopy inflated instantly. Result: one destroyed canopy, one broken femur, one screwed up back.

Well that answers that. I was thinking if you held the PC until the pin came out how long would it take to create enough speed and drag for the PC to start the deployment sequence in a CLEAN manor.

Edit: Remembering the jumper is exiting from a neary static position and needs time to build speed, could it cause the D-bag to trail behind not opening and spinning around

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[billvon 2,379]

>I was thinking if you held the PC until the pin came out how long would it
>take to create enough speed and drag for the PC to start the deployment
>sequence in a CLEAN manor.

If you hold the PC firmly until the pin comes out you may not be able to let it go before you get canopy. Things happen fast. I'd recommend talking to an IAD jumpmaster; they do exactly what you are describing dozens of times a day.

>Remembering the jumper is exiting from a neary static position and
>needs time to build speed . . .

You're talking about an Otter/Cessna exit, right?

An instructive exercise is to get a 3' long strong pole and tie a PC to the end. Have someone drive your car at around 90mph (80kts) and stick the pole and PC outside the window. That will give you a good feel for how much force the PC will exert on the d-bag right after exit. (Make sure there's no one behind you when you try this!)

[Andy_Copland 0]

Thats where we are confused mate.

I'm talking about the guy hanging on, after everything has gone smoothly on the Mr Bill.

So 2 guys, 1 canopy and an eager person to hop of into the still air.

Could the guy under canopy hold the other guys PC and hop off.

Edit: My fault, should of made it clearer

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[CSpenceFLY 1]

I think he is talking about when Mr. Bill leaves the other jumper but he is a fucking brit and it is very confusing.

[Andy_Copland 0]

Even a dude who spent his time riding a fucking bicycle around the dropzone understands me.. Its not that hard if you read the top line of the quote "dismounting" is the clue

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[billvon 2,379]

Oh! Sorry. I've never considered deploying the guy dropping off. Why would you do that? I've found that on Mr. Bill's I've had my hands full just dealing with hanging onto the other jumper!

If you did want to, I think I'd drop the PC a fraction of a second after he lets go. Let him tow the PC until it gets enough drag to pull the pin; that will serve as a bit of a "delay" to get his speed up.

OTOH if you really want to "static line" him, then disconnect the link between the bag and canopy and just hang on. You will extract the canopy completely and the bag will then release. If you drop it, it will still deploy - you just might lose the bag/PC.

[Andy_Copland 0]

So not a good idea with a regular set up? Like a crew dog pack job?

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[Glitch 0]

Andy,

I've done what your speaking of, as both Sluggo and Mr. Bill. It's no big deal. I think it's more fun experiencing the near zero launch speed (Keep brakes stowed). YMMV

As Sluggo, the most fun I had launching was being launched and flipped by Mr. Bill via him cupping his hands, me placing my foot in his hands, and together launching up and out doing backflips (think launching kids in a pool...).

If your feeling real manly, you can climb up onto Mr. Bills shoulders and turn around, 'sorta' standing on his shoulders much like a CRW plane. Note...stand with your feet ON and IN the risers, not his shoulders or you'll crush him. Standing on the risers takes all the pressure off his shoulders. Both front and rear risers should be on the outside of your feet, with all lines and the slider behind you. To launch, just lean forward and fall away.

...and of course, in the interest of safety and to keep the safety nazi's off my ass... I don't recommend you, or anyone else, do this as it is entirely too dangerous and you'll most likely die a horrible death in attempting such an outlandish feat of stupidity. Besides, there's no fun in it at all...

Randomly f'n thingies up since before I was born...

[Andy_Copland 0]

I wouldnt dream of it. I started skydiving so i could join in with the health and safety crowd.

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[diablopilot 2]

Quote

Oh! Sorry. I've never considered deploying the guy dropping off. Why would you do that? I've found that on Mr. Bill's I've had my hands full just dealing with hanging onto the other jumper!

If you did want to, I think I'd drop the PC a fraction of a second after he lets go. Let him tow the PC until it gets enough drag to pull the pin; that will serve as a bit of a "delay" to get his speed up.

OTOH if you really want to "static line" him, then disconnect the link between the bag and canopy and just hang on. You will extract the canopy completely and the bag will then release. If you drop it, it will still deploy - you just might lose the bag/PC.

It would be akin to a BASE PCA.

----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[TomAiello 25]

Quote

Oh! Sorry. I've never considered deploying the guy dropping off. Why would you do that?

Very low altitude. I've done it, but not from an airplane.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[base283 0]

Sorta splitting the thread, my apologies.
The best Mr. Bill that I ever witnessed was at a Mardi Gras boogie in Covington, La. 1988 roundabouts.
We did an 8way from Mr.Douglas I think, and 2 of the 8way, at breakoff did a terminal Mr. Bill and landed it. As I was reeling in my canopy, I noticed one of the guys on the 8way walking past me fully packed. He gave me a BS story about a haybale...
take care,
space

[Andy_Copland 0]

Thanks for the story, thats awesome.

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[base283 0]

Saw your sig.
take care, space
#64 Muff

[cosmicgypsy 5]

I remember around that same time frame a Mr. Bill out of Mr. Douglas, so probably around 14K. One of the guy's canopy blew up. He didn't pull his reserve instead he docked on the formation that went out before him. On the ground someone from that formation asked why he didn't pop it. He said, "If it doesn't work up here it won't work down there. So I might as well have fun."

[DougH 270]

cosmicgypsy

I remember around that same time frame a Mr. Bill out of Mr. Douglas, so probably around 14K. One of the guy's canopy blew up. He didn't pull his reserve instead he docked on the formation that went out before him. On the ground someone from that formation asked why he didn't pop it. He said, "If it doesn't work up here it won't work down there. So I might as well have fun."

Damn lol! Brass balls!

Sounds a bit like a tall tale, almost Point Breakish in terms of timing and likelihood.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[cosmicgypsy 5]

I saw it happen, to include the conversation.

[JohnMitchell 14]

Wow!

[sundevil777 93]

cosmicgypsy

I remember around that same time frame a Mr. Bill out of Mr. Douglas, so probably around 14K. One of the guy's canopy blew up. He didn't pull his reserve instead he docked on the formation that went out before him. On the ground someone from that formation asked why he didn't pop it. He said, "If it doesn't work up here it won't work down there. So I might as well have fun."

Extra cool points to be awarded if he still had the cutaway handle in hand.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[BMFin 0]

sundevil777

Extra cool points to be awarded if he still had the cutaway handle in hand.

The loose cable will beat you in the face (or so I heard.)

For a mister bill:

How about if Mr. Bill turns 180 degrees haf a twist on risers. This way the sluggo will be travelling face forward and may toss the PC. In case Mr. Bill has a slow canopy, just add some rotation and things should take off from there