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winsor

Woke is a Joke

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1 hour ago, billvon said:

Y'know, reading Winsor's posts reminds me of my own path of learning about race/gender/orientation.

I started out about as ignorant as they come.  I went to an all-boys catholic high school where there were four black students (because if they had at least four they qualified for some federal something-or-other) and four non-catholic students.  Gay bashing was pretty much a given.  I was once in the dean's office (wound up there a lot) when two kids were hauled in for fighting.  The kid who swung first said "but he called me gay!"  The dean asked "Is that true?"  Other guy said "Yes, but . . . ."   They both got the same detentions, because "gay" was the worst insult imaginable.  Nothing was worse.

Then I got to college and learned a whole lot quickly about other races (Indian and Asian primarily) sexual orientations (she's WHAT?) and other religious options (of  which "none" was a very popular choice.)  Had to re-evaluate a lot.

Then I graduated and went into industry.  I worked with people of all genders and races.  Even knew a gay woman!  I understood. Gay people might have problems, and might be gross, but they did their own thing.  Transgender people had mental problems (it was right there in the DSM IV as a dysphoria) but I understood that they wanted to be seen as the opposite sex.  I finally understood women because I was finding it easier and easier to find girlfriends. And I could safely ignore everything else, because now I knew what was important, and I happily told people about my enlightenment.  I was race blind!  I had no problem with gays.  I thought women were equal.  I was woke.  On that now-famous Dunning-Kruger curve, I was at the top of that first peak.

Then I found myself managing a trans woman, and realized I knew nothing about trans people.  I discovered my best friend from primary school was gay and hadn't come out for a long time because of . . . people like me.  I talked to a man I worked with for years at a defense contractor and learned about what it was like to be perceived as black when it came to social situations.  Did camera for an all women 8 way team where most of the members were not straight.  I talked to an old friend I had known for years and found out she had been raped while I was seeing her.  And when I talked about that with some other friends of mine who were women, a good half the time there would be a long pause - and then I would hear about their rape, and how they felt like they couldn't tell anyone.

And I started realizing that I really knew very little about any of that, because I just didn't have the background, and I was relying on baseless assumptions.  I am now learning, slowly.  I've hit the bottom of that DK valley and am slowly starting to climb the other side.  I definitely don't have it all figured out, but I know the direction to go, and I know the importance of DEI programs and strong policies on non-discrimination and anti-harassment.   Even helped start the DEI program at my last company, and got a few parts of the sexual-harassment program training changed because I disagreed with its approach.

Winsor is traversing the same curve now.  I will leave it as an exercise for the reader to determine what point on the curve he currently occupies.

 

I'm sure you think you know what you are talking about, which is fine when you limit your observations to yourself.

I can only guess whether your goal is to be offensive when you pretend to have a clue regarding my level of awareness, but I suppose it does not matter in the long run.  It is not my goal to sway your opinion one way or another.

 

Bless your heart,

Winsor

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6 hours ago, wmw999 said:

After a point, it becomes clear that most topics are more complicated than they appear. Just as an expert at any job, no matter how “simple,” can make your jaw drop with the elegance of their execution. 
Wendy P
 

Dunning and Kruger's work is based on the idea that, given how effortlessly the pros do it, how hard can it be?

It strikes me that the complexity behind any really good religion serves the purpose of "baffle them with bullshit."  In some cases a religious ideology is backed up by marvelous feats - "you doubt Ra?  Let's see YOU make a pyramid..."

By and large, however, ideologies that engender religious adherence are usually based on claims that are easily shown to be nonsense.  The Book of Mormon is a wonderful example, since it makes specific claims that are belied by verifiable data.  The Hebrew Scriptures aren't much better; the Bronze Age lore of a big, dysfunctional family got pretty weird with the retelling before being put to parchment.

Woke ideology, as well as Communism and various right-wing isms (Fascism was copyrighted by Mussolini), follows a standard pattern of systems of belief.  There's the narrative, victimhood, the defined enemy and the concept of heresy for anyone who disputes the 'truth' contained therein.

Depth and complexity are no indication of veracity.  A study of history will show many cultures that were rich and vibrant in their heyday, but fell to the wayside in the end along with the 'truths' they considered self-evident.

There is much that appears unlikely at first blush but is actually spot on, and other things appear true but are complete fiction.  Having said that, the distortions and doublespeak behind Woke ideology reveal it to be nonsense at the level of Scientology.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

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2 minutes ago, winsor said:

Woke ideology, as well as Communism and various right-wing isms (Fascism was copyrighted by Mussolini), follows a standard pattern of systems of belief. 

You get offended at Bill assuming things about your 'level of awareness', but you go spouting off this bullshit about 'Woke ideology' and assuming that anybody giving any credence to 'wokeism' rolls with the caricature of it that Fox and the like have created...you and your pals on the right do this shit all the time:

take an idea that's embraced by 'the enemy libtards', create a caricature of it and then hold that up as evidence that the whole idea is absurd....you say Woke is a Joke; your definition of woke is a caricature...OF COURSE IT'S A FUCKING JOKE! The rest of the world outside of your right-wing echo chamber doesn't necessarily share that definition.

I'm not some social justice warrior and I take a lot of pride in the things I've accomplished in my life and professional career, but I do recognize that some of the doors that have been opened for me (or not closed to me) to allow me to have those successes might have been inched open, at least in part, just because I had the sheer dumb luck to be born in North America with a white penis attached to me.  I try to appreciate the fact that some others have a tougher road to hoe for no fault of their own, and do bits to help out where I can.  I consider that 'being woke', even if I'm sometimes too tired/lazy/distracted to do it to the level I'd like.  If you consider that a mental illness, then I'm not going to finish this sentence as it'd get me banned.

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2 hours ago, lippy said:

but I do recognize that some of the doors that have been opened for me (or not closed to me) to allow me to have those successes might have been inched open, at least in part, just because I had the sheer dumb luck to be born in North America with a white penis attached to me. 

Yep.  For a long time I had these long explanations as to why I was not privileged, because if I had these privileges it meant the big accomplishments in my life were less meaningful.  It was hard to give them up.

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8 hours ago, lippy said:

You get offended at Bill assuming things about your 'level of awareness', but you go spouting off this bullshit about 'Woke ideology' and assuming that anybody giving any credence to 'wokeism' rolls with the caricature of it that Fox and the like have created...you and your pals on the right do this shit all the time:

take an idea that's embraced by 'the enemy libtards', create a caricature of it and then hold that up as evidence that the whole idea is absurd....you say Woke is a Joke; your definition of woke is a caricature...OF COURSE IT'S A FUCKING JOKE! The rest of the world outside of your right-wing echo chamber doesn't necessarily share that definition.

I'm not some social justice warrior and I take a lot of pride in the things I've accomplished in my life and professional career, but I do recognize that some of the doors that have been opened for me (or not closed to me) to allow me to have those successes might have been inched open, at least in part, just because I had the sheer dumb luck to be born in North America with a white penis attached to me.  I try to appreciate the fact that some others have a tougher road to hoe for no fault of their own, and do bits to help out where I can.  I consider that 'being woke', even if I'm sometimes too tired/lazy/distracted to do it to the level I'd like.  If you consider that a mental illness, then I'm not going to finish this sentence as it'd get me banned.

News flash - I listen to NPR to and from work, and tune in CBS News in the evening.  Most of what I know from Fox is by reference, since I very rarely watch it.  Same thing went for Rush Limbaugh while he was alive - I must have listened to a solid 20 or 30 minutes of his stuff in total.

I base my take on the Woke ideology from such right wing sources as Mother Jones as I base my take on Islam by reading the Koran and by serious interviews with practicing Muslims.  I'm pretty much spared the neurotypical susceptibility to religion; Buddhism's okay, but you lose me with the reincarnation thing.

As an Eagle Boy Scout minus the 'reverent' requirement, I'm as likely to stop to help change a tire if it's an old pickup truck or a new Benz.  I personally don't give a rat's ass what is the skin tone of the driver in either case.

I could easily outdo billvon's Wokelogue qualification ("some of my best friends are..."), but consider that to be up there with Godwin's Law - cross that line and your credibility is shot (not that I expect you to find me credible).

Sure, it's a hell of a lot easier to be born with a silver spoon in your mouth.  Having said that, I've worked with people from a spectrum of ethnicities that came from the humblest of origins and did wonderfully, and I've also known Mensa qualified trust fund babies that crashed and burned.

The best circumstances I have seen include equality of opportunity and equality of resources. Army/Air Force/Navy brats have identical schooling, housing and so forth, whether their parents are from barefoot hillbilly origins or the barrio or suburbia.  Often they have lived most of their lives in places where the general view is "you Yanks are all the same..." and locals are oblivious to their perceived social status in the U.S.. 

Per Poe's Law (thanks SkyDekker), I don't need to resort to AltRightWingers.com to get a parody of Woke ideology, since the Woke liturgy may well have come from Monty Python.

I hope never to fully understand the susceptibility of neurotypicals to 'systems of belief,' and am comfortable being a confirmed skeptic. Your assumption that I adhere to a competing system of belief to yours could not be wider of the mark.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

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1 hour ago, winsor said:

News flash - I listen to NPR to and from work, and tune in CBS News in the evening.  Most of what I know from Fox is by reference, since I very rarely watch it.  Same thing went for Rush Limbaugh while he was alive - I must have listened to a solid 20 or 30 minutes of his stuff in total.

I base my take on the Woke ideology from such right wing sources as Mother Jones as I base my take on Islam by reading the Koran and by serious interviews with practicing Muslims.  I'm pretty much spared the neurotypical susceptibility to religion; Buddhism's okay, but you lose me with the reincarnation thing.

As an Eagle Boy Scout minus the 'reverent' requirement, I'm as likely to stop to help change a tire if it's an old pickup truck or a new Benz.  I personally don't give a rat's ass what is the skin tone of the driver in either case.

I could easily outdo billvon's Wokelogue qualification ("some of my best friends are..."), but consider that to be up there with Godwin's Law - cross that line and your credibility is shot (not that I expect you to find me credible).

Sure, it's a hell of a lot easier to be born with a silver spoon in your mouth.  Having said that, I've worked with people from a spectrum of ethnicities that came from the humblest of origins and did wonderfully, and I've also known Mensa qualified trust fund babies that crashed and burned.

The best circumstances I have seen include equality of opportunity and equality of resources. Army/Air Force/Navy brats have identical schooling, housing and so forth, whether their parents are from barefoot hillbilly origins or the barrio or suburbia.  Often they have lived most of their lives in places where the general view is "you Yanks are all the same..." and locals are oblivious to their perceived social status in the U.S.. 

Per Poe's Law (thanks SkyDekker), I don't need to resort to AltRightWingers.com to get a parody of Woke ideology, since the Woke liturgy may well have come from Monty Python.

I hope never to fully understand the susceptibility of neurotypicals to 'systems of belief,' and am comfortable being a confirmed skeptic. Your assumption that I adhere to a competing system of belief to yours could not be wider of the mark.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

Ah yes, how could we forget the Mother Jones article you cited in the rambling rant with which you started this thread? 

 

 

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21 hours ago, billvon said:

...that is true of every single course of study out there.  Science is evolving.  So is math.  It is taught very differently today in primary schools.  Even history is taught differently today, now that we know more about the past. 

If you're equating maths & science with CRT, as to the degree of accuracy in how each can be defined (in Crenshaw's own wording), then we should agree to disagree on that. 

I would agree that history is taught differently today, although it remains my opinion that's less attributable to new discoveries of fact and more attributable to politics as the sheer volume of recorded history requires a selection regarding what should be included. The education syllabus is indeed decided, or at least approved, by the ruling members of government in most countries.  If you think the teaching of utterly fabricated 'history' cannot be initiated by woke politics, then you might acquaint yourself with Dark Emu , a publication permitted in Australian schools yet roundly debunked by actual historians and criticized by at least one prominent Aboriginal human rights advocate as “misleading and offensive to Aboriginal people and culture”.

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1 hour ago, metalslug said:

If you're equating maths & science with CRT

Nope, not equating.  That's silly.  Math is different than social studies.

What I am doing is comparing them as courses of study.  History, math, science and social studies changes with time as we discover more and more about the past.  Consider how the Rosetta Stone, the discovery of Pompeii and the revelations about the Gulf of Tonkin incident have changed the teaching of history.  Consider how quantum theory has changed the teaching of physics.  Consider how evolution has changed the teaching of biology.

Quote

 If you think the teaching of utterly fabricated 'history' cannot be initiated by woke politics . . .

I agree.  Everyone tries to change history so it better supports their agenda.  Right after the Civil War, several politicians argued that slavery had been a good thing, that slaves really liked being enslaved, and that it had been, as a whole, a good thing for the people enslaved.  More recently, the Jan 6th insurrection has seen attempts to re-spin the insurrection as some tourists who got lost, or a police plot to embolden and assist the mob in their vandalism and violence at the Capitol.

Should we study these attempts to change history, and why people would want to?  Or ignore them and pretend they never happened?

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1 hour ago, billvon said:

Nope, not equating.  That's silly.  Math is different than social studies.

What I am doing is comparing them as courses of study.  History, math, science and social studies changes with time as we discover more and more about the past.  Consider how the Rosetta Stone, the discovery of Pompeii and the revelations about the Gulf of Tonkin incident have changed the teaching of history.  Consider how quantum theory has changed the teaching of physics.  Consider how evolution has changed the teaching of biology.

I agree.  Everyone tries to change history so it better supports their agenda.  Right after the Civil War, several politicians argued that slavery had been a good thing, that slaves really liked being enslaved, and that it had been, as a whole, a good thing for the people enslaved.  More recently, the Jan 6th insurrection has seen attempts to re-spin the insurrection as some tourists who got lost, or a police plot to embolden and assist the mob in their vandalism and violence at the Capitol.

Should we study these attempts to change history, and why people would want to?  Or ignore them and pretend they never happened?

Hi Bill,

Re:  Should we study these attempts to change history, and why people would want to?  Or ignore them and pretend they never happened?

That probably depends on if your are a Republican or a Democrat?

Jerry Baumchen

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From the French standpoint, the mental illness that is Woke is nothing less than suicidal:

https://kiosque-valmonde.immanens.com/detail/publication/330/20?issue_id=75774

They blame the "Woke Dictatorship" for the impending collapse of the "American empire" (which is either good or bad, depending on one's standpoint), and excoriated U.S. academia for its culture of censorship.

'Free exchange of ideas?'  I don't think so...

 

BSBD,

Winsor

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1 hour ago, winsor said:

From the French standpoint, the mental illness that is Woke is nothing less than suicidal:

https://kiosque-valmonde.immanens.com/detail/publication/330/20?issue_id=75774

They blame the "Woke Dictatorship" for the impending collapse of the "American empire" (which is either good or bad, depending on one's standpoint), and excoriated U.S. academia for its culture of censorship.

'Free exchange of ideas?'  I don't think so...

 

BSBD,

Winsor

With such a shit argument, one must look far and wide for evidence to support it.

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2 hours ago, winsor said:

From the French standpoint, the mental illness that is Woke is nothing less than suicidal:

https://kiosque-valmonde.immanens.com/detail/publication/330/20?issue_id=75774

They blame the "Woke Dictatorship" for the impending collapse of the "American empire" (which is either good or bad, depending on one's standpoint), and excoriated U.S. academia for its culture of censorship.

'Free exchange of ideas?'  I don't think so...

 

BSBD,

Winsor

Couldn’t get to the article itself without a paywall. Any way to copy it out (with attribution)? Based on its Wikipedia entry it’s a restart of a conservative journal/analysis organ. The titles I can see on their website don’t seem too apologist in either direction, except for the one saying Hungary is “misunderstood.” But titles aren’t content. 
Wendy P. 

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22 minutes ago, winsor said:

Given the deft rebuttal, I am further impressed by the toxicity of the mental illness that is 'Woke.'

You consider actively attempting to understand the plight of others to be a mental illness.  

You apparently think that a single sensationalized book cover represents 'the French standpoint'?  Is that all French, or just some of the French?  Does it include French Canadians?  Anglos who speak a bit of French?  Is your summary of 'the French standpoint' based on anything more than the blurb on the cover jacket?   

At the end of the day, I'm just glad I could impress!

 

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1 hour ago, lippy said:

You consider actively attempting to understand the plight of others to be a mental illness.  

I think it's more that Winsor sincerely believes that he knows all he needs to know about the plight of others, and that any attempt/course of study that would teach him more is a waste of time, since he has no need to learn anything more on the topic.

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3 hours ago, wmw999 said:

Couldn’t get to the article itself without a paywall. Any way to copy it out (with attribution)? Based on its Wikipedia entry it’s a restart of a conservative journal/analysis organ. The titles I can see on their website don’t seem too apologist in either direction, except for the one saying Hungary is “misunderstood.” But titles aren’t content. 
Wendy P. 

I'm trying to track down the English version, but in the meantime here's some content from Zerohedge.com:

"Twelve voices were shouting in anger, and they were all alike. No question, now, what had happened to the faces of the pigs. The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which."

- George Orwell, "Animal Farm"

What were we to make of multimillionaire Barack Obama's 60th birthday bash at his Martha's Vineyard estate, and the throng of the woke wealthy and their masked helot attendants?

Was socialist Representative Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez (D-N.Y.) suffering for the people when she wore a designer dress to the more than $30,000-a-ticket Met gala? Her entourage needs were certainly well-attended to by masked Morlock servants.

Did the leftist celebrities at the recent Emmy awards gather to discuss opening Malibu beaches to the homeless when the (unmasked) stars virtue-signaled their wokeness?

For answers about these hypocritical wokists, always turn first to George Orwell.

l.jpg?itok=WXh-Q76K

In his brief allegorical novella, "Animal Farm," an array of animal characters -- led by the thinking pigs of the farm -- staged a revolution, driving out their human overseers.

The anti-human animal comrades started out sounding like zealous Russian Bolsheviks ("four legs good, two legs bad"). But soon they ended up conned by a murderous cult of pigs under a Joseph Stalin-like leader. And so, the revolution became what it once had opposed ("four legs good, two legs better").

Our own woke, year-zero revolution is now in its second year. Yet last year's four-legged revolutionaries are already strutting on two legs. They are not just hobnobbing with the "white supremacists" and "capitalists," but outdoing them in their revolutionary zeal for the rarified privileges of the material good life.

The Marxist co-founder of BLM, Patrisse Cullors, is now on her fourth woke home. She has moved on from the barricades to the security fences of her Topanga Canyon digs in a mostly all-white, all-rich rural paradise--the rewards for revolutionary service.

Professor Ibram X. Kendi has evolved from the edgy revolutionary work of flying all over the country, hawking his Orwellian message of "All racism bad! But some racism good!" Now he has mastered the art of zooming the wannabe woke for his $20,000 an hour avant-garde hectoring.

What of Colin Kaepernick, the mediocre second-string quarterback turned sudden firebrand? He refused to stand for the national anthem and spread his "take a knee" kitsch throughout professional sports.

Kaepernick became a boutique revolutionary multimillionaire. For $12 million a year, he pitches Nike sneakers, often made in Chinese forced-labor camps.

Woke NBA star LeBron James, from his $23 million Brentwood mansion, blasts America for its endless unfairness--in service to his totalitarian Chinese paymasters who will ensure his good life with an eventual lifetime $1 billion payout for hawking their goods.

Our other elite wokists navigating around the revolution are even more cynical. The corporate and Wall Street capitalists feel that a little virtue signaling, showy diversity coordinators, and woke advertising will more or less buy off the latest version of Al-Sharpton-like shake-down artists.

Then there are the trimmers and enablers. These are the wealthy, rich, and the professional classes. They feel--in abstract--absolutely terrible about inequality, but hardly enough in the concrete to mix with the unwashed.

For them, wokism is like party membership in the late ethically bankrupt Soviet Union. It is necessary for peace of mind and good income, but otherwise not an obstacle for the continuance of the privileged, comfortable life.

The more TV news hosts rant about "systemic" this and "supremacy" that, and the more college presidents write stern penance memos to their faculty about "that's not who we are," the more they feel not just good about themselves, but relieved of any real obligation to live and socialize with the Other.

As for the self-declared non-white Other, wokism is also a top-down revolution of celebrities, intellectuals, actors, activists, academics, grifters, lawyers, and the upper-middle class and rich. And they are not calling for a Marshall Plan to bring classical education to the inner city. They themselves have little desire to move in or spread their wealth. They rarely mentor others on their shrewd capitalist expertise that made themselves rich.

They are far more cynical than that. The regrettable violence of the street, the 120 days of 2020 looting, death and arson, are the levers of the woke professionals. They fight with the various tribes of the same class and mindset over the slices of the same coveted elite pies. But they bring to the scrap the unspoken cudgel that without greater non-white de facto quotas in comic books, TV commercials, Ivy League faculties and students, symphonies, and sit-coms, then "systemic racism" could once again ignite downtown Portland or Seattle or Baltimore.

Orwell would say of the woke Obamas, Nancy Pelosi, AOC, Bernie Sanders, LeBron James, or Ibram Kendi--and their supposedly unwoke, but similarly rich and privileged enemies -- "It was impossible to say which was which.

 

I hasten to point out that there is much with which I agree with a variety of religions, but that the process whereby religions exist is pathological by its very nature.  Woke is no exception.

The shrill condemnation of those viewed as heretics is unworthy of serious consideration.  Any casual perusal of the subject will reveal various highly esteemed experts in a field reviewing the same data and reaching different conclusions.  Science is like that - it is never "settled."

It is hard to review Woke ideology in light of historical precedent without recognizing its pathology.  Put simply, Woke is evil.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

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My contention over the years that 'Orwell was an optimist' is entirely serious.

Here's another bit from zerohedge.com:

The Definitive List Of How We're Living In '1984'

BY TYLER DURDEN
FRIDAY, OCT 01, 2021 - 04:20 PM

While some may think we're living more of an Animal Farm existence (pigs hatch a coup and overthrow the humans, only to end up in worse shape thanks to a dictator named Napoleon who uses propaganda to obscure his incompetence), Sarah A. Downey - operating partner at Accomplice VC (and Dune fan, gamer and cosplayer) has assembled a comprehensive Twitter thread on why we're actually living in Orwell's other notable work - 1984, a cautionary tale of life under communism.

54d113a50c21d_-_1984.jpg?itok=JZmbB6IY

Presented for your edification (and click here or scroll to the bottom for Downey's July 2020 interview with Benjamin Boyce where she opines on free speech, cancel culture and more):

Continued via Threadreader

Note that I’m not saying that the dystopian, totalitarian hellscape of 1984 is exactly what’s happening today. However, the last couple of years have seen some disturbing parallels emerge.

* * *

Discouraging good relations between the sexes by only allowing unattracted people to marry; weaponizing sexual frustration into political rage

Labeling stereotypically masculine behavior "toxic;" the all-time low rate of having sex, particularly in Millennials/Gen-Z

* * *

Changing the meaning of common words/phrases instantly and punishing those who do not adapt

The redefinition (literally) overnight of phrases like "sexual preference" (used to be fine; suddenly "bigoted" and rewritten in the dictionary)

https://reclaimthenet.org/sexual-preference-websters-rewrite/

* * *

Tactical language changes, continued

Changing definitions of “racism” (to pretty much anything where there are disparate outcomes among races) and “white supremacy” (to…pretty much anything involving white people)

https://newdiscourses.com/tftw-white-supremacy/

* * *

The ubiquitous presence of technology that delivers you content but mainly serves to spy on you (primarily the Telescreen but also cameras, mics, etc.)

Amazon Echos, Google Homes, smart TVs, mobile apps that covertly monitor you (ahem, Facebook)

* * *

The attack on objective reality as a way to demoralize and control people; “2+2=5”

People saying 2+2=4 is some sort of “racist math washingtonexaminer.com/news/math-prof… Statements that everyone knows are true (e.g., men and women are biologically different) have become “unsayable"

* * *

Newspeak, the Party language in 1984, designed to eliminate critical thinking, free will, personal identity, self-expression, and descriptions of objective reality

Political correctness, resulting in dehumanizing language like “bodies with vaginas” for “women”

* * *
The Newspeak tactic of renaming words/phrases so that disagreement is hard (e.g., removing "bad" as a word & replacing w/ "ungood")

Slogans like "black lives matter," where the broadness of the phrase makes it difficult to state any disagreement with its methods

* * *

"Memory-holing," where the controlling government effectively erases a person, word, or event from history

Government-led "disappearing" of uncooperative individuals (e.g., the CCP memory-holing actress Fan Bingbing) businessinsider.com/fan-bingbing-c…

* * *

The Party changing the status quo in real time, then acting like it's always been this way ("we've always been at war with Eurasia")

E.g., Biden saying in 2020 that vaccines won't be mandatory (bbc.com/news/world-us-…), then making them mandatory for millions in 2021

* * *

Another example of “we’ve always been at war with Eurasia" below:

The sudden shift in summer 2020 from “if you’re out in big groups, you’re literally killing people” to “if you’re not out protesting in big groups, you’re a bad person cbc.ca/radio/asithapp…

* * *

Another example of “we’ve always been at war with Eurasia" below:

E.g., the current administration expressing hesitance about *certain shots* under Trump, and now behaving as though such hesitancy is inconceivable

* * *

Tiered society: the elitist Inner Party on top, then the Outer Party, then the Proles; the Inner Party have special privileges and exemptions from rules

"Rules for thee but not for me;" e.g. @GavinNewsom's French Laundry dinner; only staff wearing masks at the Met Gala

* * *

Doublethink/speak (phrases that are obviously false but stated as true): “FREEDOM IS SLAVERY; IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH.”

E.g., CNN reporting on “mostly peaceful protests” in front of burning buildings thehill.com/homenews/media…
“2 weeks to slow the spread” lasting 563 days

* * *

Doublethink, continued

My body, my choice applying to abortion rights but not vaccine mandates; feminists who “support women’s sports” but see no problem with people who’ve lived 30+ years as biological males competing in said sports apnews.com/article/2020-t…

* * *

The Ministry of Truth, “which concerned itself with news, entertainment, education and the fine arts” & puts out propaganda

The too-close relationship between big tech, the media, and the government and their fight against “misinformation,” AKA whatever ideas they dislike

* * *

The Ministry of Truth, continued

The media/big tech declaring that story about Hunter Biden’s laptop wasn’t true when it was; the same declaring Russiagate was true when it wasn’t, at least in part greenwald.substack.com/p/the-indictme…

* * *

The mandate that there’s only one “correct” political party and set of opinions (The Party's)

Many people’s repeated insistence that they’re “on the right side of history” and the increasing lack of tolerance for any diversity of opinion washingtontimes.com/news/2016/oct/…

* * *

Vaporization:” “Your name was removed from the registers, every record of everything you had ever done was wiped out, your one-time existence was denied and then forgotten.”

Severe cancellations where one becomes an “unperson:” fired, socially isolated, etc.

 Indoctrination of children so that they become spies who turn in their parents for “wrongthink”

The increasingly political stance of many teachers who take it upon themselves to transfer political beliefs to children rather than educate them neutrally/factually

* * *

The Thought Police who surveil the population looking for the slightest indication that a person doesn’t fully support The Party

Scanning of social media, e.g., police showing up to people’s houses in Australia to question them about their posts reclaimthenet.org/australia-poli…

* * *

Controlling speech to control (and prevent) thought

Social media platforms silencing people (like @NICKIMINAJ), applying “misinformation” warnings, blocking hashtags/link-sharing around convos they don’t want to exist

* * *

Using citizens to spy on each other and report “ungood behavior”

E.g., the Texas 6-week abortion law encouraging citizens to report anyone in violation newsweek.com/texas-abortion…
Encouraging citizens to turn in others who aren’t following lockdowns police.vic.gov.au/palolr

* * *

Tribalism: The Party vs The Brotherhood

Tribalism: vaccinated vs unvaccinated, Left versus Right, Republicans versus Democrats, etc. How about we focus on something we can all agree on: avoiding a future like 1984?

* * *

 

I wish all this was in jest.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

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I don’t have time for a point-by-point rebuttal (and some of the points are valid exactly as they stand). However, one filter to use about many of what I saw early, about the “changing” rules around behavior and language seems to me to be a fairly natural long-term offshoot of living in an equal-protection democracy, itself an offshoot of the uprising of the barons etc in medieval England. 
What you describe as changes are sometimes just the need for more-powerful segments of society to actually have to pay attention to what the traditionally less-powerful and marginalized segments have been thinking all along. 
Most women don’t like to be assaulted, either verbally or physically. Most minorities don’t like to be automatically disparaged or marginalized. And forcing them to self-isolate causes things like the emergence of a subculture. So then punishing them for having developed a subculture is a pretty blatant exercise of “heads I win, tails you lose.” 
Each person deserves, as much as possible, the right to determine how they are addressed. 
Wendy P. 

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12 hours ago, wmw999 said:

Each person deserves, as much as possible, the right to determine how they are addressed. 

I recall a dorm-mate of mine who, after graduation, refused to refer to a friend of ours by her married name.  "Her name on her birth certificate is X!" he would exclaim.  "Why should I call her by some other name she just decided to be called?"

He was a bit of a dick.

 

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21 hours ago, wmw999 said:

 So then punishing them for having developed a subculture is a pretty blatant exercise of “heads I win, tails you lose.” 
Each person deserves, as much as possible, the right to determine how they are addressed. 

It's no longer a subculture if attempts are being made to change mainstream English language and definitions in absurd ways, to push onto the majority. I have no problem with any person adopting any name they like; I've already known quite a few women with unisex names or male nicknames that they prefer. It's more of an issue when one is able assert pronouns and titles for anything that one "chooses to identify as", as this allows transgenderism to be faked and there are undoubtedly public spaces in which women would rightly prefer to feel safe from potential male predators, or having various '..woman of the year' awards usurped by men, or claiming gender-specific rights or privileges that were never intended.

I'm also not overly concerned by transgender persons competing in sports; it's the prerogative of the sporting body to adjudicate that and the choice of the athletes to either accept a transgender opponent or refuse to compete. I have no stake in that. However; when a female Olympian bags 3 gold medals and loses out on 'sportswoman of the year' in her own country (NZ) to a transgender who didn't place in any event , some reflection may be required on what defines sporting merit over woke culture.

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9 hours ago, billvon said:

I recall a dorm-mate of mine who, after graduation, refused to refer to a friend of ours by her married name.  "Her name on her birth certificate is X!" he would exclaim.  "Why should I call her by some other name she just decided to be called?"

He was a bit of a dick.

 

Name changes are pretty common from a historical standpoint. 

Hannah Ulysses Grant went by his middle name.  When he got to the USMA he gave his name as 'Ulysses' and his mother's maiden name as 'Simpson,' and was Ulysses S. Grant thereafter.  Good luck trying to correct a military typo.

V. I . Lenin started out as Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov.

Ho Chi Minh was born Nguyễn Sinh Cung, and went variously by Nguyễn Tất Thành, Nguyễn Ái Quốc and carried a passport as Chen Vang.

Muhammad Ali was born Cassius Clay ("his momma still call him Cassius, and so do I." - Joe Frazier).

Flo (the Phlorescent Leech) and Eddie were Mark Volman and Howard Kaylan before they encountered contractual disputes with their former record label.  Prince had similar issues, and changed his name to a symbol that, when pronounced, sounded something like 'prince.'

Going into the Legion Etrangere typically involves taking a Nom de Guerre, which helps to distance ones self from the liabilities of a former life.

Various social organizations (e.g. outlaw biker clubs0 often rely entirely on club aliases (road names, etc.).

Some names carry legal connotations.  There are places where adding a 'de,' 'van,' or 'von' prefix to one's family name is a big deal.  Joachim von Ribbentrop arranged to be adopted by his aunt in 1925 in order to add the 'von' to his name.

Joseph Heller's character 'Major Major Major Major' is an instance of mixing name with title.  I always figured that putting 'Admiral Chester W. Nimitz' on a birth certificate would make the kid's time in Navy Boot Camp interesting,

The issue of nomenclature vs identity is where things can get blurry.  You have Johnny Cash's 'Boy Named Sue" with its story line for one example.  'Bradley Manning' going to 'Chelsea Manning' is another story.  Terry Gilliam now identifies as a black lesbian, IIRC.

Gender is a grammatical construct, while sex is biological.  When you switch languages, the gender of a noun can switch between masculine, feminine and neutral, apparently at random.

I suppose people are free to get all strung out about it if they wish, but if I tell a group of young females "you guys get on the bus" it carries no particular implications. 

A social acquaintance has made slightly more money than God transitioning people between 'male' and 'female,' and I don't see it as a big deal.  The line that I draw on taking to 'non-binary' pronouns is that it's too much like work, and that I don't care enough one way or another.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

 

 

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