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BMAC615

When Can I Do That Thing I Want To Do?

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(edited)
13 minutes ago, nwt said:

I don't know, I'm just starting to learn it myself.

e: I'll add that I'm on a Katana.

I’d rather see someone’s piloting progression improve on a specific low performance canopy w/ a WL of 1 (Let’s use a Sabre as an example). After they can consistently land that canopy within seven feet of a target area, (and preferably have done some proximity flying) and have demonstrated basic high performance landing techniques and everyone agrees they are ready to move to a higher performance canopy, stay on a WL of 1 and move to a Katana.

It’s MUCH safer to do that then go from a Sabre w/ a WL of 1 to a Katana w/ a WL of 1.3 and THEN learn basic high performance landing techniques. Everything is basically the same, but, it just happens faster with a higher WL.

Edited by BMAC615

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14 minutes ago, BMAC615 said:

I’d rather see someone’s piloting progression improve on a specific low performance canopy w/ a WL of 1 (Let’s use a Sabre as an example). After they can consistently land that canopy within seven feet of a target area, (and preferably have done some proximity flying) and have demonstrated basic high performance landing techniques and everyone agrees they are ready to move to a higher performance canopy, stay on a WL of 1 and move to a Katana.

It’s MUCH safer to do that then go from a Sabre w/ a WL of 1 to a Katana w/ a WL of 1.3 and THEN learn basic high performance landing techniques. Everything is basically the same, but, it just happens faster with a higher WL.

I'm just giving you the feedback on your video that you asked for. Like I said, I'm just learning high performance landings myself and I can't really discuss nuanced differences in teaching practices.

I am curious though how you would find Katanas that most of your students can load at 1.0, as they only go up to 170.

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5 hours ago, nwt said:

I'm just giving you the feedback on your video that you asked for. Like I said, I'm just learning high performance landings myself and I can't really discuss nuanced differences in teaching practices.

I am curious though how you would find Katanas that most of your students can load at 1.0, as they only go up to 170.

Yes, I appreciate the feedback! Sabre @ WL of 1 -> Katana @ WL of 1 was an example  that wasn’t using exact numbers, but was directionally correct.

I’d rather see someone with an exit weight of 190 consistently land within seven feet of a target center and then become proficient at  proximity flying and then learn basic high performance landing techniques on a Sabre 190 and THEN move to a Katana 170 instead of someone on a Sabre 190 not be able to consistently land within seven feet of a target center move to a Sabre 170 and still not be able to consistently land within seven feet of a target center and not do any proximity flying and not learn any basic high performance landing techniques then downsize to a Sabre 150 and still not get the basics down and then go to a Katana 150 and THEN start learning high performance landing techniques.

Frankly, best case example scenario is someone with an exit weight of 190 and ~200 jumps can begin to learn basic high performance landing techniques on a Sabre 190 and after 400+ jumps begin to learn some advanced high performance landing techniques on that same Sabre 190 and get over 500+ jumps before moving to a Katana 170. (Those jump numbers are guidelines as some people will pick up on it faster and some slower [or never]).

Of course, nothing is set in stone or linear. I’ve noticed people who do CRW are almost ALWAYS better/safer canopy pilots after 10-20 CRW jumps and can move to a Lightning @ 1.3 pretty quickly and could probably safely move to a Katana @ 1.2+ much sooner than someone with zero CRW experience.

Also, WL is not exactly linear either. A 170 @1.1 WL is not the same as a 135 @1.1 WL.

Here’s a great article that may help: https://uspa.org/Portals/0/files/misc_downsizechecklist.pdf

Edited by BMAC615

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(edited)
On 5/22/2021 at 10:18 PM, faulknerwn said:

That video is definitely long and I couldn't sit through it.  But as in most disciplines in skydiving - are you doing a solo angle jump or a 10way?  Are you trying to do CRW with your 50 jump buddy or the guy with 5000 CRW jumps?  Are you trying to sitfly with 4 friends when none of you can keep it for a whole skydive?  

So much depends on the experience of everyone involved.  I have done a ton of CRW jumps with people who had less than 50 jumps but they were simple 2 ways with me who has world records in the discipline.  Them doing a 2-way with another 50 jump wonder would be a completely different thing.

Trying to sitfly with your friend who also has 50 jumps is a completely different beast than doing a sitfly with someone who has a thousand freefly jumps..

 

 

@faulknerwn and/or @wmw999 What’s your recommended progression path for someone wanting to get into CRW? I looked at the threads in CRW Forum, but, they are a little old. What canopy do you start with and what WL? When do you move them to a WL of 1.3?

Let’s say they show up to their FJC and the AFFI says, “Why are you here?” And the student says, “I saw a video of people doing canopy formations and I want to do that.”

What would you tell them to expect to do from jump zero all the way to being able to be on some CRW Big Ways (9-way diamonds+).

Edited by BMAC615

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12 hours ago, BMAC615 said:

Yes, I appreciate the feedback! Sabre @ WL of 1 -> Katana @ WL of 1 was an example  that wasn’t using exact numbers, but was directionally correct.

I’d rather see someone with an exit weight of 190 consistently land within seven feet of a target center and then become proficient at  proximity flying and then learn basic high performance landing techniques on a Sabre 190 and THEN move to a Katana 170 instead of someone on a Sabre 190 not be able to consistently land within seven feet of a target center move to a Sabre 170 and still not be able to consistently land within seven feet of a target center and not do any proximity flying and not learn any basic high performance landing techniques then downsize to a Sabre 150 and still not get the basics down and then go to a Katana 150 and THEN start learning high performance landing techniques.

Yeah, that makes sense. I think a lot of people start high performance landings on a Sabre2 at first and that seems completely reasonable and accepted. Though, it *might* be a bad idea though to start swooping on something less or much less performant than a Sabre2 and that's what I was getting at in response to your video. Mostly because of the shorter recovery arc, but like I said, I'm just starting to dabble in this.

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49 minutes ago, nwt said:

Yeah, that makes sense. I think a lot of people start high performance landings on a Sabre2 at first and that seems completely reasonable and accepted. Though, it *might* be a bad idea though to start swooping on something less or much less performant than a Sabre2 and that's what I was getting at in response to your video. Mostly because of the shorter recovery arc, but like I said, I'm just starting to dabble in this.

I wouldn’t mind seeing someone begin doing proximity flying and straight in front riser approaches and even 60-90* carving front riser turns to fronts on a Silhouette or Pulse @ a WL of 1 before moving to a Sabre @ 1.

Edited by BMAC615

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4 minutes ago, BMAC615 said:

I wouldn’t mind seeing someone begin doing proximity flying and straight in front riser approaches and even 60-90* carving front riser turns to fronts on a Silhouette or Pulse @ a WL of 1 before moving to a Sabre @ 1.

Well, maybe you're right. I honestly have no idea.

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39 minutes ago, BMAC615 said:

I wouldn’t mind seeing someone begin doing proximity flying and straight in front riser approaches and even 60-90* carving front riser turns to fronts on a Silhouette or Pulse @ a WL of 1 before moving to a Sabre @ 1.

I don't know if you've seen this:

 

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On 5/25/2021 at 8:08 AM, BMAC615 said:

@faulknerwn and/or @wmw999 What’s your recommended progression path for someone wanting to get into CRW? I looked at the threads in CRW Forum, but, they are a little old. What canopy do you start with and what WL? When do you move them to a WL of 1.3?

Let’s say they show up to their FJC and the AFFI says, “Why are you here?” And the student says, “I saw a video of people doing canopy formations and I want to do that.”

What would you tell them to expect to do from jump zero all the way to being able to be on some CRW Big Ways (9-way diamonds+).

A lot will depend on your dropzone and the people who are there.  I have thousands of CRW jumps and have done lots of intro 2-way CRW jumps with people on 1.0 loaded Triathlons when they had 25-50 jumps.

If they are at a dropzone with no experienced CRWdogs like me - they need more experience before jumping with other beginners.  Jumping Lightnings - they are a bit more challenging to land than Triathlons or Spectres.  I would say at least a hundred jumps before jumping a lightly loaded Lightning - most of the beginner CRW camps around have the beginners on 1.0-1.1 loaded Lightnings...

 

 

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