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Cocowheats

Butt padding?

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We experimented with protectors with rubber like these for tandem harness, and it turned out to be a bad design.JWJmOW8KAgM.jpg.962dace29f5bd2f512a2d98b2a156600.jpg

And decided to continue with the monolithic butt pad included non-Newtonian gel.

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18 hours ago, sfzombie13 said:

you just fucked up the stand up landing, what makes you think you're gonna get the next part right?  fuck up the slide and there goes your spine, fuck up a plf and you femur or break an ankle.  i know which one i'd prefer."

I think it's important to distinguish an intentional slide vs. a botched run-out. I think most of us have been talking about intentional slides. I agree a slide is usually not the best recovery when standing up is intended.

When you get to a certain point in canopy piloting (which I'm nowhere close to), it becomes physically impossible to run out a landing in some scenarios like intentional downwinders / distance runs. If Curt Bartholomew does it, it isn't wrong. I'll just continue doing what he tells me.

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37 minutes ago, nwt said:

I think it's important to distinguish an intentional slide vs. a botched run-out. I think most of us have been talking about intentional slides. I agree a slide is usually not the best recovery when standing up is intended.

When you get to a certain point in canopy piloting (which I'm nowhere close to), it becomes physically impossible to run out a landing in some scenarios like intentional downwinders / distance runs. If Curt Bartholomew does it, it isn't wrong. I'll just continue doing what he tells me.

that was also back in '98 with a different attitude and i was a student. 

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(edited)
On 4/22/2021 at 10:44 AM, eric.fradet said:

Seriously? 

I'm really not sure what to say about this. Have we gotten to the point where we can no longer land our canopies on a dime? Just how small will we go, how long will we continue to accept the lack of canopy control that we need to really add an air bag to our ass. We have gotten to the point where we accept that its OK for a tandem Instructor to need this?

C'mon. Upsize your canopies and learn to fly them and anything other than the "occasional" butt-slide from a TI is unacceptable.  And, don't give me any shit about it. I've done 14 Tandems in a day and not butt-slid one of them. 

Edited by BIGUN
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3 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Seriously? 

I'm really not sure what to say about this.

Fair enough if it was implied that the airbag was to be used for normal civilian application. But it looks like it is being marketed more to the military, for heavy loads / night / crappy landing areas. Some of the pics show a military tandem, trailing a kit bag on a line.

Looks like the airbag is like a paragliding airbag, which have been around for a long time, self inflating from an opening at the front, but with the added design feature to be held closed in freefall.

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1 hour ago, pchapman said:

Looks like the airbag is like a paragliding airbag, which have been around for a long time, self inflating from an opening at the front, but with the added design feature to be held closed in freefall.

Didn't they try something like that with a Mars lander that crashed and burned in?

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On 4/22/2021 at 2:19 AM, gowlerk said:

What skydivers do instead is learn to stand up landings. 

For many people, perhaps, but I see very few people swooping small crossbraced canopies trying to stand up their landings.

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18 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Seriously? 

I'm really not sure what to say about this. Have we gotten to the point where we can no longer land our canopies on a dime? Just how small will we go, how long will we continue to accept the lack of canopy control that we need to really add an air bag to our ass. We have gotten to the point where we accept that its OK for a tandem Instructor to need this?

C'mon. Upsize your canopies and learn to fly them and anything other than the "occasional" butt-slide from a TI is unacceptable.  And, don't give me any shit about it. I've done 14 Tandems in a day and not butt-slid one of them. 

any tandem pilot can make an error of judgment which will cost the passenger to be injured, not to mention when the conditions becomes bumpy and sometimes the TI (probably not you but some) has the reflex to use the passenger to cushion the shock !

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24 minutes ago, eric.fradet said:

any tandem pilot can make an error of judgment which will cost the passenger to be injured, not to mention when the conditions becomes bumpy and sometimes the TI (probably not you but some) has the reflex to use the passenger to cushion the shock !

I’ve seen a TI who makes a perfect stand up landing every single time. The problem is the passenger is always bent in half in front of him. Asking for a spinal one of these days.

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53 minutes ago, base615 said:

I’ve seen a TI who makes a perfect stand up landing every single time. The problem is the passenger is always bent in half in front of him. Asking for a spinal one of these days.

the fact is that the passenger is not always sporty and the passenger harnesses are ALL uncomfortable due to the proximity of the TI so that their position does not always allow them to land properly

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8 hours ago, base615 said:

I’ve seen a TI who makes a perfect stand up landing every single time. The problem is the passenger is always bent in half in front of him. Asking for a spinal one of these days.

I'd need to ask you to paint a verbal picture for me.  The student is attached to the TI's harness at the shoulders. If the TI is standing, then the student can't be bent in half. The only way for the student to be bent in half is at the waist with their legs lifted up (The side harness connectors are loosened to max extension).  

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12 hours ago, BIGUN said:

I'd need to ask you to paint a verbal picture for me.  The student is attached to the TI's harness at the shoulders. If the TI is standing, then the student can't be bent in half. The only way for the student to be bent in half is at the waist with their legs lifted up (The side harness connectors are loosened to max extension).  

Standing but bent at the waist so he's on his feet, the student is sitting on the floor but because the TI is bent over, he's essentially bending over the student. Difficult to explain but it's super awkward and IMO could easily end in tears one day. I don't like it at all

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On 4/25/2021 at 10:11 AM, BIGUN said:

I'd need to ask you to paint a verbal picture for me.  The student is attached to the TI's harness at the shoulders. If the TI is standing, then the student can't be bent in half. The only way for the student to be bent in half is at the waist with their legs lifted up (The side harness connectors are loosened to max extension).  

Well, remember that not every TI is taller than their passenger... And when they're shorter, a butt slide may well be less risky than trying to coordinate a standup landing when they're not in control of who reaches the ground first.

Wendy P.

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2 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

Well, remember that not every TI is taller than their passenger... And when they're shorter, a butt slide may well be less risky than trying to coordinate a standup landing when they're not in control of who reaches the ground first.

Mandy at Skydive Dallas was shorter than most of her tandem students. Can't remember her sliding any of them in. 

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(edited)
25 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

Mandy at Skydive Dallas was shorter than most of her tandem students. Can't remember her sliding any of them in. 

I'm not sure where all this pride in standing up tandem landings is coming from. Several large DZs that I have been to, including SDAZ forbid standing them up unless there is enough wind. Standing up no wind landings is quite risky.

Edited by gowlerk

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29 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

 Several large DZs that I have been to, including SDAZ forbid standing them up unless there is enough wind.

Yeah, I've been at a big Ontario DZ that mandates sliding landing (although accepts standups in high winds). But it does depend on the canopy a lot too -- Sigma canopies tend to be suited to sliding landings rather than standups.

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5 hours ago, gowlerk said:

I'm not sure where all this pride in standing up tandem landings is coming from.

I'm really not sure how to address this. Perhaps it comes from being taught properly and butt slides were frowned upon. 

 

5 hours ago, gowlerk said:

Standing up no wind landings is quite risky.

According to whom? I used an Icarus 365 and didn't have any problems with it. 

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