gowlerk 1,889 #151 April 14, 2021 17 minutes ago, SkyDekker said: Not in GTA or urban areas of Quebec. Rest of Canada, I agree. Yes, living in Winnipeg my perspective may be skewed on that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nwt 131 #152 April 15, 2021 20 hours ago, jakee said: Meanwhile the Chauvin defense is arguing that because he was in the general vicinity of a car exhaust it's more likely that he died of carbon monoxide poisoning than anything that scumbag did. Wow. It comes across as absurd, but it's important to appreciate that the accused is entitled to a trial, and their counsel is obligated to make the strongest case possible. If this is the best they can come up with, that's a reflection on how weak their case is and not necessarily on the competence of their counsel or some kind of problem with our system. If it sounds absurd to you, it probably does to the jury as well. It's okay. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,265 #153 April 15, 2021 31 minutes ago, nwt said: It comes across as absurd, but it's important to appreciate that the accused is entitled to a trial, and their counsel is obligated to make the strongest case possible. If this is the best they can come up with, that's a reflection on how weak their case is and not necessarily on the competence of their counsel or some kind of problem with our system. If it sounds absurd to you, it probably does to the jury as well. It's okay. In all fairness the poor dears are treading new ground. Previously this sort of thing could be handled at the level of the Police union. Now, just like the rest of 2020, it's all fucked up. Ah, the good old days. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,362 #154 April 16, 2021 Derek Chauvin Defense Witness Is Being Sued in Another State for Allegedly Covering Up Black Teen’s Death in Police Custody Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phil1111 896 #155 April 16, 2021 44 minutes ago, ryoder said: Derek Chauvin Defense Witness Is Being Sued in Another State for Allegedly Covering Up Black Teen’s Death in Police Custody When a lawyer scrapes the bottom of the barrel sometimes a few roaches are the result. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,241 #156 April 21, 2021 Guilty on all counts. Even as a white person from a different country, there’s a feeling of relief that finally such an obvious crime is not brushed off simply because the perpetrator was a cop. I can’t imagine what it must feel like for black people in America. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rifleman 61 #157 April 21, 2021 The only real danger now is that the sentence when it comes isn't commensurate with the severity of the offence. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,241 #158 April 21, 2021 1 minute ago, rifleman said: The only real danger now is that the sentence when it comes isn't commensurate with the severity of the offence. I hope that part goes ok. If they were federal charges I’d have put money on him being pardoned during the next Republican Presidential term though. He’d have fit right in with the parade of abhorrent and unrepentant scum that Trump chose to fete. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,029 #159 April 21, 2021 Guilty on all Charges https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZqvslc_ZMc Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,265 #160 April 21, 2021 On 4/16/2021 at 8:16 AM, ryoder said: Derek Chauvin Defense Witness Is Being Sued in Another State for Allegedly Covering Up Black Teen’s Death in Police Custody Now if we can just get the "too many connections" asshat in the docket..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #161 April 21, 2021 2 hours ago, rifleman said: The only real danger now is that the sentence when it comes isn't commensurate with the severity of the offence. He may well only get sentenced on one charge. If someone is convicted of theft and armed robbery as two charges, for example, they only get charged for the armed robbery one as theft is a subset of that and you can’t be charged twice for the same crime. Double jeopardy and all. At least that’s how a lawyer friend explained it to me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,039 #162 April 21, 2021 1 hour ago, yoink said: He may well only get sentenced on one charge. If someone is convicted of theft and armed robbery as two charges, for example, they only get charged for the armed robbery one as theft is a subset of that and you can’t be charged twice for the same crime. Double jeopardy and all. At least that’s how a lawyer friend explained it to me. Hi Will, Get a different 'lawyer friend.' Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,029 #163 April 21, 2021 1 hour ago, yoink said: they only get charged for the armed robbery one as theft is a subset of that and you can’t be charged twice for the same crime. Double jeopardy and all. At least that’s how a lawyer friend explained it to me. Your friend is incorrect. Robbery and theft are two separate commissions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #164 April 21, 2021 (edited) I'm no lawyer. He said it was the 'Merger' doctrine? I'm looking at the message now and he says ' he may or may not get sentenced on all three charges' and 'if one offense is essentially a lesser included offense of another, you can't be sentenced on both' and that it comes down to the statutory elements of the charges which may be something the lawyers and judge hash out during sentencing. If you know the details of why he's wrong let me know and I'll pass it on, but I'm not just going to say 'some dudes on the internet say you're wrong' to him. Edited April 21, 2021 by yoink Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
headoverheels 289 #165 April 21, 2021 Let us not forget how close this came to being covered up from the get go. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkenuXkgfyk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,039 #166 April 21, 2021 51 minutes ago, yoink said: I'm no lawyer. He said it was the 'Merger' doctrine? I'm looking at the message now and he says ' he may or may not get sentenced on all three charges' and 'if one offense is essentially a lesser included offense of another, you can't be sentenced on both' and that it comes down to the statutory elements of the charges which may be something the lawyers and judge hash out during sentencing. If you know the details of why he's wrong let me know and I'll pass it on, but I'm not just going to say 'some dudes on the internet say you're wrong' to him. Hi Will, The sentencing laws very with each state. As do the actual laws vary with each state. Depending upon what state, your lawyer friend may be correct. Here in Oregon we have Measure 15. This was enacted about 15+ yrs ago & took almost all discretion away from any judge during sentencing. I was against this measure & now there is an effort to change it. I am hoping for a success. Usually, sentences for more than one crime are consecutively or concurrently. Let's say you have been convicted of robbery & car-jacking. For the robbery you get 15 yrs & for the car-jacking, you get 10 yrs. Consecutively means the judge sentences you to a total of 25 yrs. Concurrently, means you get a sentence of 15 yrs, the 10-yr sentence in within/at the same time as the 15-yr sentence. Does that make sense to you? Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,241 #167 April 21, 2021 44 minutes ago, headoverheels said: Let us not forget how close this came to being covered up from the get go. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkenuXkgfyk That is a very good point, especially when the flip side to the welcome suprise of having the police testify against Chauvin is that they depicted him as someone completely unrepresentative of the department as a whole. There were three other officers there and they all lacked either the morality or the courage to try and stop what was happening. How many police officers would have had to be in attendance before even one of them was able to stand up to the peer pressure coming from two veterans with a history of violence and thuggery, and display the same sense of justice and the same bravery shown by some random passers by on the street? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rifleman 61 #168 April 21, 2021 4 hours ago, yoink said: He may well only get sentenced on one charge. If someone is convicted of theft and armed robbery as two charges, for example, they only get charged for the armed robbery one as theft is a subset of that and you can’t be charged twice for the same crime. Double jeopardy and all. At least that’s how a lawyer friend explained it to me. I was actually referring to the possibility that the sentencing will be a "Brock Turner" and completely derisory given the fact that Chauvin murdered George Floyd. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,098 #169 April 21, 2021 4 hours ago, jakee said: How many police officers would have had to be in attendance before even one of them was able to stand up to the peer pressure coming from two veterans with a history of violence and thuggery, and display the same sense of justice and the same bravery shown by some random passers by on the street? Wouldn't have made a difference. Case in point: Kawaski Trawick shooting. Link to story Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,265 #170 April 21, 2021 7 hours ago, BIGUN said: Your friend is incorrect. Robbery and theft are two separate commissions. The least he can get is 12.5 years sentences to run concurrently. In Minnesota he'll serve 2/3rds before being eligible for parole. Without focusing on right or wrong we need to understand this is new ground. This is societal change underway. In a very real sense this is baby step number one. I hope the judge tosses the police a bone at a time they must know the past is no longer prologue. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airdvr 196 #171 April 21, 2021 22 minutes ago, JoeWeber said: The least he can get is 12.5 years sentences to run concurrently. In Minnesota he'll serve 2/3rds before being eligible for parole. Without focusing on right or wrong we need to understand this is new ground. This is societal change underway. In a very real sense this is baby step number one. I hope the judge tosses the police a bone at a time they must know the past is no longer prologue. He'll never make it out of prison. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,265 #172 April 22, 2021 10 minutes ago, airdvr said: He'll never make it out of prison. Who knows, man, but how does that address the larger point? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airdvr 196 #173 April 22, 2021 24 minutes ago, airdvr said: The least he can get is 12.5 years sentences to run concurrently. In Minnesota he'll serve 2/3rds before being eligible for parole. Your words. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #174 April 22, 2021 31 minutes ago, airdvr said: He'll never make it out of prison. I don’t envy the job of the prison warden and guards trying to make sure he does. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,265 #175 April 22, 2021 1 hour ago, airdvr said: Your words. Yep. But a day or 8 years doesn't mean he wont leave alive. That's just your add on. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites