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4 hours ago, sfzombie13 said:

it is not, nor was it ever, about religion, pro life, or anything else they spout endlessly.  it is, and always was, about control.  control of women, control of minorities, control of the country, the economy, and everything else.  that is the true evil of the gop. 

Eh, both sides want control of everyone, because that enhances their power base.  I agree that currently the GOP is worse - but that's just because they've had power for so long.

The fundamental difference between today's GOP and today's democratic party is that the GOP is resistant to change.  This is based on the fears of many conservatives that the world is changing too fast.  This comes from two sources -

- Big businesses.  Oil companies, coal companies, large Chinese resellers - all these are dependent on the status quo, and change is generally bad.  Renewable energy, for example, directly threatens the business model of energy companies.

- People resistant to change.  I am convinced that most people accept change as a natural part of life, but some can't or won't change.  And some very basic things are changing, like who can get married and what's acceptable in public.  Pronouns are even changing, and people who resist change are going to be driven bonkers by that.  "If it was good enough for us 40 years ago it's good enough for us now!  Why are they trying to shove XXX down my throat?"

Those fears are what the GOP amplifies and weaponizes.  Witness Ron's comments here; multiply those by 1000 and they become an excellent club to hit people with.

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5 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Somebody started typing on dz.com before their first cup of coffee. Look, there is good and bad in both parties. And, when it comes to control - neither party has a monopoly on it - that is the true evil of politics in general. "Folks such as yourself" are in both parties - those that keep the party from going too far right or left. 

Hi Keith,

That is uncalled for.

Jerry Baumchen

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27 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi Keith,

That is uncalled for.

Jerry Baumchen

But this . . .regardless of common sense or the truth.  folks such as yourself. This is not? 

C'mon Jerry; I've called myself out for typing before coffee. 

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2 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

But this . . .regardless of common sense or the truth.  folks such as yourself. This is not? 

C'mon Jerry; I've called myself out for typing before coffee. 

Hi Keith,

If you had made it in the form of a question, I would be OK with it.  However, you made it a statement; which you know nothing about.*

Jerry Baumchen

*  Maybe he does not even drink coffee; I know I'm trying to cut back.

 

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1 hour ago, billvon said:

- People resistant to change.  I am convinced that most people accept change as a natural part of life, but some can't or won't change.  And some very basic things are changing, like who can get married and what's acceptable in public.  Pronouns are even changing, and people who resist change are going to be driven bonkers by that.  "If it was good enough for us 40 years ago it's good enough for us now!  Why are they trying to shove XXX down my throat?"

I would say that most people accept change in some things as a natural part of life, especially if they can see the point of the change. The older they get, the more resistant they get, simply because there's so much more installed base to change from (ask anyone who was just fine with an earlier interface for MS Windows).

And most people resist change they can't see the purpose of, because change requires work, and most people are naturally fairly lazy (it's a good survival instinct not to waste energy).

Wendy P.

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2 hours ago, billvon said:

Eh, both sides want control ... is worse - but that's just because they've had power for so long.

I've had the opinion for quite a while that anything beyond two terms is corrupting. Eight to 10 years and you have to toss a party because they start to think of themselves. With exceptions of course.

Canadian Conservative party votes not to recognize climate crisis as real Mar 20, 2021

Delegates vote 54%-46% against policy change request

Leader O’Toole has sought ambitious climate change agenda

So the conservatives here have handed power to the Liberals for another four years. Because British Columbia, Ontario and Quebec will carry the next election vote on this issue, almost alone.

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8 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Let's park this for a second.

Conversely, the right believes the left is trying to force others to follow their beliefs.

Hence - both sides. And, no. I will not stop from trying to point out that both sides are at fault and that America is worse off for it.  

The right believes or believed that Obama was a Kenyan Muslim. 
That Hilary was responsible for the Americans that were killed in Benghazi.

That male to female trans people are making the transition for the express purpose of gaining access to women's bathrooms.

That Trump won the election.
That the 'main stream media' is complete and total lies.

And a lot more that's equally stupid or outrageous or both.

Again, it's not an equivalent situation.

I won't pretend that the left is perfect. Far from it.

But right now the right is far, far more at fault for the divide than the left.
Trump is a huge part of it.

But, as I've noted previously, he's more of a symptom of the malady than the cause.

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3 minutes ago, wolfriverjoe said:

The right believes or believed that Obama was a Kenyan Muslim. 
That Hilary was responsible for the Americans that were killed in Benghazi.

That male to female trans people are making the transition for the express purpose of gaining access to women's bathrooms.

That Trump won the election.
That the 'main stream media' is complete and total lies.

And a lot more that's equally stupid or outrageous or both.

Again, it's not an equivalent situation.

I won't pretend that the left is perfect. Far from it.

But right now the right is far, far more at fault for the divide than the left.
Trump is a huge part of it.

But, as I've noted previously, he's more of a symptom of the malady than the cause.

The right believes a secret liberal group drinks the blood of children and runs a pedophile ring that needs to be stopped.

The left believes there is systemic racism and law enforcement should be stopped from unnecessarily killing black people.

These for many on the right somehow offset, cause it shows both sides wants the other side to stop doing something.

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2 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

The right believes a secret liberal group drinks the blood of children and runs a pedophile ring that needs to be stopped.

The left believes there is systemic racism and law enforcement should be stopped from unnecessarily killing black people.

These for many on the right somehow offset, cause it shows both sides wants the other side to stop doing something.

Well, I deliberately left out the Q nonsense because it's not all that widespread among the right.

The stuff I listed is.

Something like 60% of Rs believe that there was widespread election fraud and that Trump really won.

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On 3/29/2021 at 4:47 PM, BIGUN said:

Respect for those who believe. Many times on here - Christianity is slandered, but the other religions of the world are defended.    

That's not true. Other religions of the world aren't defended against parody, they're defended against people who claim their adherents should be treated differently by law, or who claim with complete seriousness that all their adherents are amoral members of jihadist death cults etc. It's two very different things.

Quote

Respect is not necessarily agreeing with one's beliefs, but respecting their right to believe as they wish without having to attack it just to get some "Like" cool points. 

Those are, again, two different things. Respecting the right of someone to believe as they wish and making jokes about it are in no way exclusive. 

Hell, from what I see people who are so Christian they regularly moan about Christianity being made fun of are significantly more likely than anyone else to think we shouldn't legally respect the right of non-Christians to believe as they wish.

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14 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Conversely, the right believes the left is trying to force others to follow their beliefs.

Hence - both sides. And, no. I will not stop from trying to point out that both sides are at fault and that America is worse off for it.  

What the right believes is not a legitimate basis for claiming that both sides are actually doing something.

This is particularly true right now when the justification for the right's wave of anti-democratic legislation is that their voters believe there was election fraud. Right after the party spent several months inundating them with false and baseless claims of election fraud.

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(edited)
19 hours ago, billvon said:

Eh, both sides want control of everyone, because that enhances their power base.  I agree that currently the GOP is worse - but that's just because they've had power for so long.

The fundamental difference between today's GOP and today's democratic party is that the GOP is resistant to change.  This is based on the fears of many conservatives that the world is changing too fast.  This comes from two sources -

- Big businesses.  Oil companies, coal companies, large Chinese resellers - all these are dependent on the status quo, and change is generally bad.  Renewable energy, for example, directly threatens the business model of energy companies.

- People resistant to change.  I am convinced that most people accept change as a natural part of life, but some can't or won't change.  And some very basic things are changing, like who can get married and what's acceptable in public.  Pronouns are even changing, and people who resist change are going to be driven bonkers by that.  "If it was good enough for us 40 years ago it's good enough for us now!  Why are they trying to shove XXX down my throat?"

Those fears are what the GOP amplifies and weaponizes.  Witness Ron's comments here; multiply those by 1000 and they become an excellent club to hit people with.

i will use one example to show how it is only control they worry about, abortion.  it is the dems who have the record of reducing abortions, not the gop, yet that is one of their platforms.  edit to add:  i did not check the numbers but the sources are there, feel free.

abortion.jpg

Edited by sfzombie13
clarification

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18 hours ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi Keith,

If you had made it in the form of a question, I would be OK with it.

Morning, Jerry,

So, he directly spikes the ball at me and when I return it, you'd be be OK with it if "I" placed it in the form of a question? He didn't form my lack of common sense or truth as a question. You're inserting yourself where mods or he are not. Moving on to my second cup of coffee - care to join me. I'll be on the veranda watching the sun rise. 

Keith  

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(edited)

if it means anything, i took it as a compliment, not offensively.  it is something i would expect to hear in a conversation in real life, so it is perfectly reasonable to see here.  if we can't resort to light hearted banter, we are doomed and may as well hang it up now and close the forum.  it can get heated sometimes, but this was most certainly nowhere close to that. 

oh, and my friends have taken to calling them "timpliments".  i really do mean well most of the time, but i hate pulling punches and despise dancing around some issues, so sometimes the compliments are barbed, just with the truth and that is offensive to some.  most of the time with some folks. 

Edited by sfzombie13
timpliments

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(edited)

I see complaints about Christianity being slandered. Slander is a term that refers to false claims being made. All the criticism of Christianity that appears here is based on truth. Christians are the ones who engage in slander. We have a regular poster here that compares nonbelievers to the prince of darkness every day on a regular basis. Is that not slander?

Edited by gowlerk

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5 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

We have a regular poster here that compares nonbelievers to the prince of darkness every day on a regular basis. Is that not slander?

?? Not if you don't believe in the prince of darkness.  Right?  It would be like comparing you to Voldemort.

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