More sacrifices to the 2nd Amendment

[billeisele 122]

Good thing this store owner had a gun. One thug disabled and all arrested. 

 https://www.dailywire.com/news/he-shot-my-arm-off-80-year-old-store-owner-unloads-when-armed-suspects-attempt-robbery?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=benshapiro

[kallend 1,621]

2 hours ago, billeisele said:

Good thing this store owner had a gun. One thug disabled and all arrested. 

 https://www.dailywire.com/news/he-shot-my-arm-off-80-year-old-store-owner-unloads-when-armed-suspects-attempt-robbery?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=benshapiro

Wow, that makes three to the "good guys with guns" in the past month.

Bad guys with guns are far far  ahead, however.

[Phil1111 908]

48 minutes ago, kallend said:

Wow, that makes three to the "good guys with guns" in the past month.

Bad guys with guns are far far  ahead, however.

For every single "good guys with guns" it costs America about 150 dead children.

Imagine the uproar if they were fetuses.

The facts are Wednesday, July 20, 2022: "According to the Advanced Law Enforcement Rapid Response Training Center at Texas State University, civilian “good guys” with guns have subdued “bad guys” with guns in 13 separate incidents since 2000."

[JerryBaumchen 1,046]

Hi folks,

IMO there can never be enough financial damage to this piece of shit:  Alex Jones Concedes Sandy Hook Attack Was ‘100% Real’ – NBC New York

Here's hoping the jury makes the award about 5 times what is being asked.

Jerry Baumchen

[SkyDekker 1,121]

1 hour ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi folks,

IMO there can never be enough financial damage to this piece of shit:  Alex Jones Concedes Sandy Hook Attack Was ‘100% Real’ – NBC New York

Here's hoping the jury makes the award about 5 times what is being asked.

Jerry Baumchen

Today was not a good day for Alex Jones, which makes it a great day for most everybody else.

[jakee 1,254]

2 hours ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi folks,

IMO there can never be enough financial damage to this piece of shit:  Alex Jones Concedes Sandy Hook Attack Was ‘100% Real’ – NBC New York

Here's hoping the jury makes the award about 5 times what is being asked.

Jerry Baumchen

That article is well worth a read for the sheer scale of his dishonesty and corruption. While he was in court finally admitting Sandy Hook wasn’t a conspiracy, another host on his network was on tv claiming the trial was a conspiracy.

He was admonished in court for not complying with an order to provide his email records, he responded that he didn’t use emails, and was then shown screenshots of emails sent from his address.

Just incredible.

[JoeWeber 2,294]

On 8/3/2022 at 3:38 AM, billeisele said:

Good thing this store owner had a gun. One thug disabled and all arrested. 

 https://www.dailywire.com/news/he-shot-my-arm-off-80-year-old-store-owner-unloads-when-armed-suspects-attempt-robbery?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=benshapiro

You'll always be able to make that point from time to time. As someone who keeps a defense weapon at home, and who believes high risk retailers should be licensed to have a useful weapon at hand, I say good. But at least for me that isn't the argument and I really wish proponents of assault weapons would cease defaulting to it. This is the argument: an ostensible preacher armed to the teeth with ridiculous weapons is legal to attend a political speech by a Democratic candidate. That is counter conducive to free speech and shouldn't be allowed or, by any thinking person, accepted as normal.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

2 hours ago, JoeWeber said:

You'll always be able to make that point from time to time. As someone who keeps a defense weapon at home, and who believes high risk retailers should be licensed to have a useful weapon at hand, I say good. But at least for me that isn't the argument and I really wish proponents of assault weapons would cease defaulting to it. This is the argument: an ostensible preacher armed to the teeth with ridiculous weapons is legal to attend a political speech by a Democratic candidate. That is counter conducive to free speech and shouldn't be allowed or, by any thinking person, accepted as normal.

Makes you wonder how 'Reverend Rambo' would react if someone wearing, say, a "Church of Satan" t-shirt walked into one of his services carrying the same weapons he has there.

[billvon 2,383]

2 hours ago, wolfriverjoe said:

Makes you wonder how 'Reverend Rambo' would react if someone wearing, say, a "Church of Satan" t-shirt walked into one of his services carrying the same weapons he has there.

Well, then he'd be justified in "standing his ground" and stopping the threat.

[JoeWeber 2,294]

9 minutes ago, billvon said:

Well, then he'd be justified in "standing his ground" and stopping the threat.

"Stand your Ground for Jesus!" Catchy, no? And, for a bonus, guess which Supreme Court would likely see that as entirely reasonable thing to do?

[billeisele 122]

On 8/3/2022 at 9:37 AM, Phil1111 said:

For every single "good guys with guns" it costs America about 150 dead children.

Imagine the uproar if they were fetuses.

The facts are Wednesday, July 20, 2022: "According to the Advanced Law Enforcement Rapid Response Training Center at Texas State University, civilian “good guys” with guns have subdued “bad guys” with guns in 13 separate incidents since 2000."

Facts are a good thing: 

- 90% of gun deaths are with handguns, eliminating assault weapons would have no effect on that

- FBI stats show that for the 10 years that assault weapons were banned there was no reduction in rifle deaths

- rifle deaths were 4.8% prior to the ban, 4.9% during the ban and 3.6% after the ban expired

Congressional Research Service report https://sgp.fas.org/crs/misc/R43004.pdf

CDC report https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/rr5214a2.htm

Rand Corp study on gun policy https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_reports/RR2000/RR2088/RAND_RR2088.pdf

[gowlerk 1,903]

25 minutes ago, billeisele said:

Facts are a good thing:

AR type weapons are the choice of those who want to make a statement and become famous for mass shootings. So they get a lot of attention. They are now symbols, or icons. Easy targets for those who don't want to go after the underlying cause of the problem. Namely the insanity of the 2nd Amendment.

Edited August 7, 2022 by gowlerk

[kallend 1,621]

28 minutes ago, billeisele said:

Facts are a good thing: 

- 90% of gun deaths are with handguns, eliminating assault weapons would have no effect on that

 

Well, that's OK then. What's a few dead schoolkids anyway, just collateral damage..

 

Let's ignore that 10% of US gun deaths are still more than just about any other developed nation 

[Phil1111 908]

14 minutes ago, kallend said:

Well, that's OK then. What's a few dead schoolkids anyway, just collateral damage..

 

Let's ignore that 10% of US gun deaths are still more than just about any other developed nation 

Statistically less significant in the entire carnage scenario. After all over 117,000 Americans are shot every year in the US.

Twenty million guns sold last year and less and less need.

[billeisele 122]

1 hour ago, Phil1111 said:

Statistically less significant in the entire carnage scenario. After all over 117,000 Americans are shot every year in the US.

Twenty million guns sold last year and less and less need.

No doubt that on a percentage basis that's correct. The actual number of hunters has remained fairly stable. They contribute approximately $38 billion to the economy including $12 billion in taxes and license fees toward. Those funds are used for conservation and they perform a critical service in wildlife management. Hunters are not the problem.

The defund the police actions and the increase in crime are two reasons folks have been buying guns. The Obama years were record breaking for gun sales.

 

[lippy 765]

8 minutes ago, billeisele said:

No doubt that on a percentage basis that's correct. The actual number of hunters has remained fairly stable. They contribute approximately $38 billion to the economy including $12 billion in taxes and license fees toward. Those funds are used for conservation and they perform a critical service in wildlife management. Hunters are not the problem.

The defund the police actions and the increase in crime are two reasons folks have been buying guns. The Obama years were record breaking for gun sales.

 

Yeah it was all Obama’s fault….had nothing to do with the most manipulatable among us being incessantly told that ‘they’re coming for your guns, better buy them while you can’

[JoeWeber 2,294]

13 minutes ago, billeisele said:

No doubt that on a percentage basis that's correct. The actual number of hunters has remained fairly stable. They contribute approximately $38 billion to the economy including $12 billion in taxes and license fees toward. Those funds are used for conservation and they perform a critical service in wildlife management. Hunters are not the problem.

The defund the police actions and the increase in crime are two reasons folks have been buying guns. The Obama years were record breaking for gun sales.

 

Well, there we have it sport fans, and from BillE his own self: the solution to gun problems and proliferation is taxes and fees. A big shout out to the gun lobby for lighting the way.

Edited August 7, 2022 by JoeWeber

[billeisele 122]

2 hours ago, kallend said:

Let's ignore that 10% of US gun deaths are still more than just about any other developed nation 

Ignoring that fact would be immensely irresponsible. No rational person would suggest that.

It would be good to focus on the cause of gun deaths and devise reasonable, legal and effective solutions to address it. Of the annual gun deaths: ~2/3rds are suicide. Of the remaining amount 500 are self-defense, 500 are accidental discharge. Of the remaining 10,000, 90% are with a handgun, and 1,000 are with rifles. 

I've asked the question about gun control a couple times and you have consistently failed to provide any reasonable reply.  

[billeisele 122]

7 minutes ago, lippy said:

Yeah it was all Obama’s fault….had nothing to do with the most manipulatable among us being incessantly told that ‘they’re coming for your guns, better buy them while you can’

 

4 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

Well, there we have it sport fans, and from BillE his own self: the solution to gun problems and proliferation is taxes and fees. A big shout out to the gun lobby for lighting the way.

Both of these replies are just childish.

Lippy - you may believe Obama caused it and you are entitled to your opinion. I'm glad I didn't say that.

Joe - great to see that you are predictable. Jumping to a conclusion not supported by facts and erroneously implying that your conclusion was that of the author.

[JoeWeber 2,294]

2 hours ago, billeisele said:

It would be good to focus on the cause of gun deaths and devise reasonable, legal and effective solutions to address it.

Agreed. Except you want no change to the current legal scheme which is 100% responsible for the proliferation, and worse assimilation, of guns of mass destruction in our country. But go ahead and post a graph showing that plinking rabbits with a .22 caliber rifle is as safe as eating cotton candy at the county fair proving once and for all that AR-15 assault style weapons and glock's with ETS 30 round clips are simply harmless wonders of engineering and if you gathered them all up and weighed them it wouldn't amount to a pinch of doo-doo compared to the weight of the universe. 

Edited August 7, 2022 by JoeWeber
forgot to add assimilation

[Phil1111 908]

1 hour ago, billeisele said:

No doubt that on a percentage basis that's correct. The actual number of hunters has remained fairly stable. They contribute approximately $38 billion to the economy including $12 billion in taxes and license fees toward. Those funds are used for conservation and they perform a critical service in wildlife management. Hunters are not the problem.

The defund the police actions and the increase in crime are two reasons folks have been buying guns. The Obama years were record breaking for gun sales.

 

From a pro hunting conservation group: "In relative numbers, the percentage of the U.S. population that hunts has been on a steady decline since at least 1960, when there were 14 million hunters, representing 7.7 percent of the total U.S. population of 180.7 million people.  In 2020, hunters represented only 4.6 percent of the U.S. population. Even at the 1982 peak, hunters only represented 7.2 percent of the U.S. population.

But then there are the underlying reasons as to why some Americans are arming themselves to the teeth:"More than one quarter of US residents feel so estranged from their government that they feel it might “soon be necessary to take up arms” against it, a poll released on Thursday claimed." and "A majority of Americans agree that the government is “corrupt and rigged against everyday people like me,” including 73 percent of voters who describe themselves as a “strong Republican,” 71 percent who called themselves “very conservative” and 68 percent of rural voters." With 30% owning more than five guns.

So its not self protection. Its not hunting. Its to attack other Americans and their collective government. Because for a white, male, republican without a college education. More than 50% believe the government is the enemy.

[JerryBaumchen 1,046]

1 hour ago, Phil1111 said:

From a pro hunting conservation group: "In relative numbers, the percentage of the U.S. population that hunts has been on a steady decline since at least 1960, when there were 14 million hunters, representing 7.7 percent of the total U.S. population of 180.7 million people.  In 2020, hunters represented only 4.6 percent of the U.S. population. Even at the 1982 peak, hunters only represented 7.2 percent of the U.S. population.

But then there are the underlying reasons as to why some Americans are arming themselves to the teeth:"More than one quarter of US residents feel so estranged from their government that they feel it might “soon be necessary to take up arms” against it, a poll released on Thursday claimed." and "A majority of Americans agree that the government is “corrupt and rigged against everyday people like me,” including 73 percent of voters who describe themselves as a “strong Republican,” 71 percent who called themselves “very conservative” and 68 percent of rural voters." With 30% owning more than five guns.

So its not self protection. Its not hunting. Its to attack other Americans and their collective government. Because for a white, male, republican without a college education. More than 50% believe the government is the enemy.

Hi Phil,

There it is in a nutshell.

Bill E just wants to continually confuse the discussion with his red herrings; that have nothing to do with the discussion.  That is the killings from Columbine to Uvalde.

Jerry Baumchen

 

[wmw999 2,116]

What are your thoughts on mandatory trigger guards on pistols? They won't help much with planned action, but might help with suicides where someone takes a parent's gun, or make the suicide think just a little bit more.

The problem with pistols is that they're just so darn easy and clean to kill someone with. You don't have to get all messy, you don't have to get close enough to be punched. I'd be just fine with requiring a license for pistols or their carry, along with larger-capacity long guns (like the AR style), and keeping hunting guns with small capacity (e.g. your average shotgun or rifle) as they are now.

Wendy P.

[kallend 1,621]

1 hour ago, Phil1111 said:

....

So its not self protection. Its not hunting. Its to attack other Americans and their collective government. Because for a white, male, republican without a college education. More than 50% believe the government is the enemy.

Yet it is these same people who want the government to control what women can (and cannot) do with their own bodies, and whom someone can (and cannot) marry. 

Lack of education has consequences.

[JoeWeber 2,294]

18 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

What are your thoughts on mandatory trigger guards on pistols? They won't help much with planned action, but might help with suicides where someone takes a parent's gun, or make the suicide think just a little bit more.

The problem with pistols is that they're just so darn easy and clean to kill someone with. You don't have to get all messy, you don't have to get close enough to be punched. I'd be just fine with requiring a license for pistols or their carry, along with larger-capacity long guns (like the AR style), and keeping hunting guns with small capacity (e.g. your average shotgun or rifle) as they are now.

Wendy P.

Theoretically locking guards make sense, in reality, however, we seem unable to convince people to not leave loaded pistols laying around in a house with kids. Except for law enforcement, the military, and liquor store night shift operators etc. I'm damned if I can see any use for a pistol, except as a collectors investment. If you're hunting with it you're simply increasing the degree of difficulty. That makes no sense. If you think you're going to wake up at 2AM after a normal cocktail hour, pull it from under your pillow, and do other than shoot your foot you're already not thinking clearly.