Opiates

[skybytch 259]

My parents are 80. They recently moved across the state. Both have chronic conditions that require the use of opiate pain medication.  Getting them set up with new primary care doctors has been a nightmare, but getting a doctor who will prescribe the meds they need is nearly impossible.  They ran out of meds in January and we managed to find an urgent care with a nice doctor who wrote a 30 day script but will not write another. 

They now have a primary care doctor... and three days worth of meds left. The doctor "doesn't" prescribe them, but did give them a list of pain doctors they can call for an appointment.  Specialists have appointments available within a few days, right?  

My 80 year old parents are going to be in opiate withdrawals on Wednesday and I can't find anyone who will help. I guess they assume I am using my parents to source the meds for myself... which is very very much not the case as I am allergic to that shit.

I understand that kids are dying and so there has to be all these rules, but what the fuck is someone who legitimately NEEDS these meds supposed to do?!? Shop urgent cares and ERs? Head to the streets and find someone selling them? Or just go straight to a heroin dealer?  

Why is it okay for doctors to refuse to help people because of the medication they need? How do they sleep at night knowing that these people, their patients, are suffering,  and it all could be avoided with the stroke of a pen?  

Can anybody explain? Can anybody help? If so, you'll find me down on the corner looking for Paul the Pill Pusher. 

[lippy 765]

I don't know what the solution is, but I'm sorry that you're in this situation and it sounds like your folks are lucky that they've got you advocating for them.  

It sucks that there has been so much abuse that doctors are over-compensating on the CYA and people who genuinely need these drugs are struggling to get them.  

Good luck!

[sfzombie13 307]

sadly, that is your best option temporarily in order to stop the withdrawal.  if you haven't noticed, we are a society of knee jerk reaction and feel good legislation rather than finding and solving problems.  more money in selling a pill, and making everyone feel like they need them than cure the reason for the pain and encourage their responsible use.  they call it capitalism, but it is really nothing more than greed. 

[BIGUN 1,049]

17 minutes ago, skybytch said:

Can anybody explain?

My suspicion is that with your parents age; doctors are less receptive to prescribing opioids due to the aging body's renal sufficiency. My experience with the VA is - the PCP's don't do the opioids because the pain management guys have to do a full battery of tests to see which course of treatment will be best at preventing renal failure. The cure shouldn't cause death in another way. 

My recommendation would be to make the appointment with the Pain Management team first. Then, take that appointment to the PCP and explain the number of years your parents have been taking them and they will be in withdrawal on Wednesday. Need enough until the PM appointment. 

[skybytch 259]

17 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

My recommendation would be to make the appointment with the Pain Management team first. Then, take that appointment to the PCP and explain the number of years your parents have been taking them and they will be in withdrawal on Wednesday. Need enough until the PM appointment. 

Unfortunately they have yet to find one accepting new patients.  I get to take that task on tomorrow.  Along with finding Paul the Pill Pusher. Maybe if I call the police department they can point me towards the right neighborhood to look in. I mean, since I am being forced to go illegal,  might as well get a referral from those who know the market best.

The new PCP has their records from their doctors and pain specialists down south.  I guess I'm just stupid cuz I don't understand why that isn't enough to prescribe enough to get them through til they can see a specialist.

 

[riggerrob 558]

Yes, it is a bit silly for doctors to worry about elders getting addicted to opiates. A few years back, I was in a lot of pain after knee surgery, so the surgeon prescribed Oxycondone. I weaned myself off Oxycondone as soon as pain subsided enough to sleep through the night.

This reminds me of the last week of my mother's life, when she ingested massive amounts of morphine to dull the pain. She insisted that she never got "high" on morphine, but it did dull the pain for a few hours, allowing her to get a bit of sleep.

I still have a few Oxycondone pills left. Would you like me to mail them to you?

Hah!

Hah!

[NewGuy2005 51]

It is inevitable that your parents will run out at some point.  Anything you do to prolong the situation is not helpful and puts you at  risk of jail time.

I suggest that you let them begin withdrawing and take them to the emergency room.  I expect that they deal with this situation every day.

There are no good outcomes here.  That train left the station years ago.

Edited March 1, 2021 by NewGuy2005

[timski 80]

On 2/28/2021 at 10:15 AM, skybytch said:

My parents are 80. They recently moved across the state. Both have chronic conditions that require the use of opiate pain medication.  Getting them set up with new primary care doctors has been a nightmare, but getting a doctor who will prescribe the meds they need is nearly impossible.  They ran out of meds in January and we managed to find an urgent care with a nice doctor who wrote a 30 day script but will not write another. 

They now have a primary care doctor... and three days worth of meds left. The doctor "doesn't" prescribe them, but did give them a list of pain doctors they can call for an appointment.  Specialists have appointments available within a few days, right?  

My 80 year old parents are going to be in opiate withdrawals on Wednesday and I can't find anyone who will help. I guess they assume I am using my parents to source the meds for myself... which is very very much not the case as I am allergic to that shit.

I understand that kids are dying and so there has to be all these rules, but what the fuck is someone who legitimately NEEDS these meds supposed to do?!? Shop urgent cares and ERs? Head to the streets and find someone selling them? Or just go straight to a heroin dealer?  

Why is it okay for doctors to refuse to help people because of the medication they need? How do they sleep at night knowing that these people, their patients, are suffering,  and it all could be avoided with the stroke of a pen?  

Can anybody explain? Can anybody help? If so, you'll find me down on the corner looking for Paul the Pill Pusher. 

THE PROBLEM begins before the problem. Narcotics don't belong AT HOME.  Narcotics are given out like candy and this is the end result. Plain and simple.

I'm not down playing the problem you currently face, My heart goes out to you and your loved ones. I hope you find relief. 

I also hope the medical system and individuals start demanding change and seek other methods than just popping pills without question, because "the doctor knows better than me"...  

[wmw999 2,116]

It's not that easy. You don't know what people went through before starting on opiates, and you don't know what their pain, and their perception of pain, is. That said, yeah, pain pills are way overprescribed. And pain sometimes is way overtreated.

The medical establishment & insurance system pays for drugs; therefore drugs are used. Other things that can address (without necessarily entirely fixing) pain include lots of alternative things like PT, exercise, meditation, even yoga and massage. But those get a FAR more limited coverage, and aren't nearly as fast.

Wendy P.

[BIGUN 1,049]

7 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

pain include lots of alternative things like PT, exercise, meditation, even yoga and massage. But those get a FAR more limited coverage, and aren't nearly as fast.

Yep, we have a long way to go in the field of pain management, rather than just cutting people off from what their doctors can prescribe and what the insurance will pay for. 

[gowlerk 1,903]

The problem these people are facing and the addiction and deaths of literally 100s of thousands are the result of the greed of the billionaire Sacklers and their drug pushing ilk.  I said God damn, God damn the pusher man. And to tie two threads together it is another, and very extreme example of white privilege.  None of the drug company criminals are in jail.

[wmw999 2,116]

They probably even started out with good intentions; in the 80’s and 90’s pain management was a huge topic of discussion. But power (in the guise of a game-changing drug) sure corrupted. 
Wendy P. 

[timski 80]

5 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Yep, we have a long way to go in the field of pain management, rather than just cutting people off from what their doctors can prescribe and what the insurance will pay for. 

 ALL  IN   BED  TOGETHER.  .  .  The "problem" is clear. The solution IS the problem...  GREED is at the root...  

[skybytch 259]

20 hours ago, timski said:

THE PROBLEM begins before the problem. Narcotics don't belong AT HOME.  Narcotics are given out like candy and this is the end result. Plain and simple.

I'm not down playing the problem you currently face, My heart goes out to you and your loved ones. I hope you find relief. 

I also hope the medical system and individuals start demanding change and seek other methods than just popping pills without question, because "the doctor knows better than me"...  

So what is someone with an incurable excruciatingly painful condition supposed to do if they cant have narcotics at home? Or someone with cancer? Or even just recovering from major surgery? Live in the hospital? Suffer until they cant take anymore and off themselves?  

Be realistic.  People need heavy duty pain relief when they are in severe pain, and they can't be kept in the hospital for weeks and months on end while they need it. 

These people are not "popping pills without question".  Ever been in severe pain for more than a few days?  Try a broken leg without pain meds. Bet you'd last less than an hour before you would be begging for a Vicadin.

Yes, the prescription drug lords got us here. Fuck them the most.  And the government kneejerking regulations have helped out tremendously. Fuck them too.

But the doctors that won't prescribe what a patient legitimately NEEDS or who assume that a person advocating for one of those patients is trying to get pills illegally... yeah they can go fuck themselves as well.

How about applying some common sense and compassion to the situation... do they teach that shit in medical school?  Nah, better to refuse to help anybody in pain. Yeah, fuck that whole helping people thing. The guvmint will totally come after ya for prescribing a painkiller to an 82 year old with neuropathy...

Sorry if this is rambling... it's 4 am, no sleep, mind won't stop trying to figure out how to find Paul the Pill Pusher.... 

Edited March 3, 2021 by skybytch

[JoeWeber 2,294]

3 hours ago, skybytch said:

So what is someone with an incurable excruciatingly painful condition supposed to do if they cant have narcotics at home? Or someone with cancer? Or even just recovering from major surgery? Live in the hospital? Suffer until they cant take anymore and off themselves?  

Be realistic.  People need heavy duty pain relief when they are in severe pain, and they can't be kept in the hospital for weeks and months on end while they need it. 

These people are not "popping pills without question".  Ever been in severe pain for more than a few days?  Try a broken leg without pain meds. Bet you'd last less than an hour before you would be begging for a Vicadin.

Yes, the prescription drug lords got us here. Fuck them the most.  And the government kneejerking regulations have helped out tremendously. Fuck them too.

But the doctors that won't prescribe what a patient legitimately NEEDS or who assume that a person advocating for one of those patients is trying to get pills illegally... yeah they can go fuck themselves as well.

How about applying some common sense and compassion to the situation... do they teach that shit in medical school?  Nah, better to refuse to help anybody in pain. Yeah, fuck that whole helping people thing. The guvmint will totally come after ya for prescribing a painkiller to an 82 year old with neuropathy...

Sorry if this is rambling... it's 4 am, no sleep, mind won't stop trying to figure out how to find Paul the Pill Pusher.... 

I hear you if no one else does. I can only guess what I'd have done to get my parents the med's they needed. Living with cancers and neuropathy is nothing anyone wants and a hand full of pills to get through the day is no great reward. There simply aren't any real pain management solutions for some afflictions. I truly hope you catch a break on this.

[Phil1111 908]

I take it you've tried these resources.

Find a Pain Management Specialist