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Phil1111

President Biden, critics corner

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9 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

The stimulus was expensive and unnecessary, while 10% was unemployed and needed assistance 90% did not.  There was an EXTRA Trillion dollars stacked up in people’s checking accounts during the pandemic just waiting to be spent. There was no need to stimulate an otherwise sound economy.  We just needed to end the pandemic we did not need to have a money party at our children’s expense.  The oversupply of cash and the under supply of goods and services (due in part to the overly generous unemployment benefits) has, predictably, resulted in inflation.

Giving money to middle to lower class people hurts the economy, but providing money to the richest part of the population helps the economy.

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10 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

 The oversupply of cash and the under supply of goods and services (due in part to the overly generous unemployment benefits) has, predictably, resulted in inflation.

Sounds like supply & demand to me. IOW a free market.

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10 minutes ago, murps2000 said:

Sounds like supply & demand to me. IOW a free market.

When the government supplies the demand with a money party while constraining supply of goods and services, it is a market distortion and we are seeing the results.

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14 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

Giving money to middle to lower class people hurts the economy, but providing money to the richest part of the population helps the economy.

The money should have been concentrated to help the folks who were most impacted by the pandemic.  I don’t see how giving thousands of dollars to people who never missed a paycheck helps anything.  Much of that money ended up in the stock market and gun stores.  That is one of the reasons the market is doing well and why guns and ammunition are in short supply.

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59 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

And yet you were a big supporter of tax reductions and argue they trickle down.

The economy, pre-pandemic, would bear that out. Record low unemployment (especially for minorities) and real wage growth.  AKA trickle down.

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1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

When the government supplies the demand with a money party while constraining supply of goods and services, it is a market distortion and we are seeing the results.

So was the money party the CARES act or the American Rescue plan? And how exactly did the federal government constrain supply? Just trying to follow you here.

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(edited)
47 minutes ago, murps2000 said:

So was the money party the CARES act or the American Rescue plan? And how exactly did the federal government constrain supply? Just trying to follow you here.

When unemployment benefits exceed what workers would have made by working.   
Folks aren’t lazy, they are smart.  Why go back to work when you can make more money sitting on your couch and playing x-box? A friend of mine who manages a Quaker Steak and Lube (it is a restaurant)hired a guy who just informed him that he will not start until his enhanced benefits run out.

Edited by brenthutch

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23 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

When unemployment benefits exceed what workers would have made by working.   
Folks aren’t lazy, they are smart.  Why go back to work when you can make more money sitting on your couch and playing x-box? A friend of mine who manages a Quaker Steak and Lube (it is a restaurant)hired a guy who just informed him that he will not start until his enhanced benefits run out.

Okay I get your point there and I agree that is a problem. In service industries where the workers make low wages the logic is obvious. So you might have to pay a little more to get steaked and lubed now. 
 

That doesn’t explain the rise in prices for consumer goods though. I think that’s more of a supply side issue in the face of pent up demand that was already there. Manufacturers are not able to ramp up production instantaneously.
 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2021/06/01/business/coronavirus-global-shortages.amp.html

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2 hours ago, brenthutch said:

The money should have been concentrated to help the folks who were most impacted by the pandemic.  I don’t see how giving thousands of dollars to people who never missed a paycheck helps anything.  

What did you do with yours?  I donated mine to charities helping the poor make it through the pandemic, since I'm one of your "90% that don't need it."  

 

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2 hours ago, brenthutch said:

When unemployment benefits exceed what workers would have made by working.   
Folks aren’t lazy, they are smart.  Why go back to work when you can make more money sitting on your couch and playing x-box?

Which means that, during the pandemic, a lot of people . . . stayed home.

It's almost as if it worked.

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16 hours ago, brenthutch said:

The economy, pre-pandemic, would bear that out. Record low unemployment (especially for minorities) and real wage growth.  AKA trickle down.

The economy grew faster and more jobs were created pre tax-cut than post tax-cut. Trump slowed the economy down by giving lost of money to already rich people.

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16 hours ago, brenthutch said:

When unemployment benefits exceed what workers would have made by working.   
Folks aren’t lazy, they are smart.  Why go back to work when you can make more money sitting on your couch and playing x-box? A friend of mine who manages a Quaker Steak and Lube (it is a restaurant)hired a guy who just informed him that he will not start until his enhanced benefits run out.

The interesting part is that you seem to think the issue is the benefits and ot the compensation offered to work and that the solution is to make people more miserable so they go to work for wages below poverty levels.

Of the more than 250,000 jobs listed in Tennessee, only about 3% offer a wage above $20,000 per year. I don't blame people for not wanting to work for that.

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1 hour ago, SkyDekker said:

The economy grew faster and more jobs were created pre tax-cut than post tax-cut. Trump slowed the economy down by giving lost of money to already rich people.

Well let’s just have a massive tax increase and see how well that works out.  BTW it is hard to create lots of new jobs when everyone has a job and we are at full employment.

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1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

Well let’s just have a massive tax increase and see how well that works out.

The opposite of not giving a tax break is NOT a massive tax increase.

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

BTW it is hard to create lots of new jobs when everyone has a job and we are at full employment.

Sounds like no economic incentive was required then. So why give a tax break to the rich and run up the deficit and debt even further?

 

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4 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

Sounds like no economic incentive was required then. So why give a tax break to the rich and run up the deficit and debt even further?

 

I agree, the tax cut should have been offset by cuts in spending.  OTOH spending should be fully paid for by wide base tax increases. 

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(edited)
14 hours ago, brenthutch said:

I agree, the tax cut should have been offset by cuts in spending.

Weird you think that, since trickle down fantasy also assumes tax cuts to the rich will be offset by increased taxation revenue overall. So, I guess you don't really support trickle down and just want tax cuts for yourself.

Edited by SkyDekker

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17 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

Weird you think that, since trickle down fantasy also assumes tax cuts to the rich will be offset by increased taxation revenue overall. So, I guess you don't really support trickle down and just want tax cuts for yourself.

Like many people who prefer that their children and grandchildren do the paying.

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1 hour ago, gowlerk said:

Like many people who prefer that their children and grandchildren do the paying.

At a high level, the breakdown in political orientation here really rests on the question "who's responsible for the results of your actions?"  If you think you are responsible for your actions, you're a liberal.  If you think that your kids/some other country/someone else is responsible, you're a conservative.

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58 minutes ago, billvon said:

At a high level, the breakdown in political orientation here really rests on the question "who's responsible for the results of your actions?"  If you think you are responsible for your actions, you're a liberal.  If you think that your kids/some other country/someone else is responsible, you're a conservative.

And the opposite when it comes to responsibility for other people. If you think that as a society we should try and help those less fortunate, then you are a liberal. if you think those less fortunate are just lazy and they need to work harder, then you are a conservative.

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2 hours ago, gowlerk said:

Like many people who prefer that their children and grandchildren do the paying.

Somebody else's kids and grandkids can do the paying, I don't have any.

I didn't need the stimulus checks so I donated most of my first one and plan to donate most of the second one.

Almost every business I go to has a help wanted or now hiring sign. 

I live in a busy tourism area and businesses are having a hard time finding staff for the summer.

I agree, too much unemployment payout and little incentive to work.

 

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