National protests against Minneapolis police murderers?

[turtlespeed 212]

6 hours ago, wolfriverjoe said:

That sounds good, but would take a lot of time & effort.

However, if the citizenry knows that everything is recorded, and as long as those recordings are reasonably available (the difficulty in getting the MacDonald shooting video released is a good example of not reasonably available), then I don't think it would be a big issue.

If every cop (and every arrestee) knew that they were on camera, and that whatever they did would be 'used in court against them', then the problem would be reduced by a decent amount.

Cities that put body cams on their officers have already found this out.

My guess is that you would have more cops standing back and not keeping crime at bay at all, in fear of this litigious society we have built.

[yoink 321]

5 hours ago, ryoder said:

Unbelievable. After the Buffalo (NY) PD was caught on camera throwing a 75yo man to the ground and splitting his head open, 2 of the thugs were suspended.

Now, five dozen of the other cops have resigned in protest over the suspensions.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/buffalo-officers-shoving-75-year-old-ground-decried-governor-where-n1225776

 

This is a perfect example of the problem.

 

This solidarity even in the face of brutal behavior is what needs to be broken.

 

[turtlespeed 212]

8 hours ago, yoink said:

This is a perfect example PART of the problem.

 

This solidarity even in the face of brutal behavior is what needs to be broken.

 

Fixed that for ya.

This is the part you are seeing right now.

The other parts of the problem are not as visible.

Edited June 6, 2020 by turtlespeed

[kallend 1,623]

10 hours ago, yoink said:

This is a perfect example of the problem.

 

This solidarity even in the face of brutal behavior is what needs to be broken.

 

If anyone other than a cop had deliberately put a 75 year old non-violent man in hospital, they would be arrested for battery.

[Phil1111 910]

32 minutes ago, kallend said:

If anyone other than a cop had deliberately put a 75 year old non-violent man in hospital, they would be arrested for battery.

IMO the video is prima facie of assault. There were few other protestors around. The line of police were advancing, acknowledged elsewhere as acting under orders to move protesters farther away. The one officer who appeared to bend over to assist the man was stopped by another officer.

[ryoder 1,384]

Interactive map keeping score on police attacks on the press:

https://dktaylor916.github.io/

[jakee 1,254]

58 minutes ago, Phil1111 said:

IMO the video is prima facie of assault. There were few other protestors around. The line of police were advancing, acknowledged elsewhere as acting under orders to move protesters farther away. The one officer who appeared to bend over to assist the man was stopped by another officer.

One thing that has really struck me about a lot of incidents during these protests is that, far from acting as checks on their fellow officers, a lot of them will rush to join in any show of force.

Like this poor guy pushed over - he was already being moved back by two officers when the came in from several yards away to give him the shove that resulted in his serious injuries. Why did he need to do it? In what way was the situation not being sufficiently dealt with?

Another that really stands out is the bike messenger being batoned for no reason. He's not resisting in any way except trying to get away from the cop who's wailing on him but what do the next two cops who come over do? Do they try and restrain him, arrest him, put him on the ground, ask the first thug cop what's going on, do anything to de-escalate the situation? No, they both join in the beating. Why? For what purpose? 

[kallend 1,623]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/06/06/police-protester-incidents-video/

Amazing how the cops' accounts are at variance with video evidence when it surfaces.  One might wonder how often the cops lie when no video is available.

"In violent protest incidents, a theme emerges: Videos contradict police accounts"

[Phil1111 910]

Evidently the two cops involved in pushing the man to the ground in Buffalo have now been charged with 2nd degree assault.

I'd suggest that all of the cops that resigned the Buffalo Police Department's Emergency Response Team. Need some sort of retraining with regards to their duties as officers to the public, the constitutional right to protest and how not to be douches in uniform.

[turtlespeed 212]

18 minutes ago, Phil1111 said:

Evidently the two cops involved in pushing the man to the ground in Buffalo have now been charged with 2nd degree assault.

I'd suggest that all of the cops that resigned the Buffalo Police Department's Emergency Response Team. Need some sort of retraining with regards to their duties as officers to the public, the constitutional right to protest and how not to be douches in uniform.

Are we actually better off without them?

 

[wmw999 2,121]

Well, maybe they can be replace en masse, kind of like how all of the air traffic controllers were replaced en massed in 1981.

Wendy P.

[nigel99 143]

5 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

Well, maybe they can be replace en masse, kind of like how all of the air traffic controllers were replaced en massed in 1981.

Wendy P.

Most organisational change is not possible without changing the leadership team. Cut the head off the snake. Seeing tank and file members disciplined and or resigning may make people feel good, but with systemic problems it doesn’t resolve them.

From international news it does seem like a few mayors have sacked and replaced police leaders

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

45 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

Well, maybe they can be replace en masse, kind of like how all of the air traffic controllers were replaced en massed in 1981.

Hi Wendy,

Those folks drank the union kool-aid & paid the price.

One of my rare 'Good for Reagan' moments.

Jerry Baumchen

[ryoder 1,384]

49 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

Well, maybe they can be replace en masse, kind of like how all of the air traffic controllers were replaced en massed in 1981.

Wendy P.

The Emergency Response Team members have not quit the police department, but have stepped down from the tactical unit, according to the sources. Spectrum News first reported the resignations on Twitter, along with WIVB-TV.

Source: https://buffalonews.com/2020/06/05/57-members-of-buffalo-police-riot-response-team-resign/

[wmw999 2,121]

I was being a little subtle; my thoughts as I posted that was "every problem has an obvious and simple solution." So if they all leave, just replace them. Little is ever that simple.

Wendy P.

[Phil1111 910]

There are no bad teams only bad leaders. Those 57 are certainly a cohesive bunch but its surprising that none would recognize the fatal flaw in their collective thinking.

I'd suggest that there is too much of the thin blue line and not enough of the protect the public, protect the rights of everyone out there, empathy for those we serve reinforced at every meeting.

[wmw999 2,121]

The key difference between the police and the military is that -- the police exist to serve the public they come in contact with, and the military exist to serve the country, rather than the individual people. 

The police should never consider the people they serve to be their enemies. As individuals, yes, there are bad guys, and ones who need to be removed. But as a collective, they are the people you serve, not the enemy. Including the smelly ones, they angry ones, the asshole who calls in his neighbors for loud music, and the neighbors who really do play their music too loud. Even the college students who party late at night and puke all over the street.

Wendy P.

[ryoder 1,384]

Federal judge orders police not to use chemical weapons, projectiles against peaceful Denver protesters

A federal judge issued an extraordinary ruling late Friday ordering police not to use chemical weapons — such as tear gas and pepper spray — and less-lethal projectiles against peaceful protesters in Denver.

“The Denver Police Department has failed in its duty to police its own,” Judge R. Brooke Jackson wrote in his sweeping ruling.

Source: https://coloradosun.com/2020/06/05/denver-george-floyd-protests-federal-order/

And for a typical example of the SOP of the Denver PD, just look at the photo above the article.

Edited June 6, 2020 by ryoder

[nigel99 143]

4 hours ago, ryoder said:

Federal judge orders police not to use chemical weapons, projectiles against peaceful Denver protesters

A federal judge issued an extraordinary ruling late Friday ordering police not to use chemical weapons — such as tear gas and pepper spray — and less-lethal projectiles against peaceful protesters in Denver.

“The Denver Police Department has failed in its duty to police its own,” Judge R. Brooke Jackson wrote in his sweeping ruling.

Source: https://coloradosun.com/2020/06/05/denver-george-floyd-protests-federal-order/

And for a typical example of the SOP of the Denver PD, just look at the photo above the article.

From that article. Who would have thought de escalation techniques worked! These protests are sure highlighting systemic problems in policing

Police in recent nights have been less confrontational with demonstrators, which has mostly eliminated clashes between officers and protesters. Last weekend, officers and demonstrators were hurt in the skirmishes, which surrounded the Capitol for hours.
 

[wmw999 2,121]

Next thing you know they’ll be saying that vaccines help. Who’d a thunk it?

(and I love that autocorrect just changed “think” to “thunk” in there — who’d a thunk that AI shit works? 

Wendy P. 

[billvon 2,400]

6 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

Are we actually better off without them?

 

If they supported what those cops did - yes, we are.

[ryoder 1,384]

21 minutes ago, nigel99 said:

From that article. Who would have thought de escalation techniques worked! These protests are sure highlighting systemic problems in policing

Police in recent nights have been less confrontational with demonstrators, which has mostly eliminated clashes between officers and protesters. Last weekend, officers and demonstrators were hurt in the skirmishes, which surrounded the Capitol for hours.
 

I have lived in CO for 24 years, and the Denver PD has been known for thuggery ever since I moved here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denver_Police_Department#Controversies_and_criticisms

[nigel99 143]

WTF!!’ A morally bankrupt country. Honestly the FCC should be fining or sanctioning Fox News for that

https://thehill.com/media/501508-fox-news-apologizes-for-graphic-displaying-stock-performance-after-death-of-george#

[turtlespeed 212]

 

11 hours ago, billvon said:

If they supported what those cops did - yes, we are.

I think Minneapolis should be a litmus test.

Let the protestors have what they want.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/07/us/minneapolis-mayor-police-abolition/index.html

Defund the police.

....

My remarks are not 100% a smart-assed comment -  There may be something to their claims.

The deescalation of authoritarianism has seen a decrease in violence from both sides of the protests.

Maybe this will transfer to the general population as well.

Edited June 7, 2020 by turtlespeed
Clarification

[kallend 1,623]

3 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

 

I think Minneapolis should be a litmus test.

Let the protestors have what they want.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/07/us/minneapolis-mayor-police-abolition/index.html

Defund the police.

....

My remarks are not 100% a smart-assed comment -  There may be something to their claims.

The deescalation of authoritarianism has seen a decrease in violence from both sides of the protests.

Maybe this will transfer to the general population as well.

Newton's 3rd Law may apply to more than just mechanical systems.