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gowlerk

covid-19

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2 minutes ago, ryoder said:

So now Jim Jordan has decided the GOP position is not just pro-Covid-19, but pro-all-diseases:

 

 

Freedom to infect. Is it not in the Bill of Rights somewhere? Is this not covered by the right to bear arms?

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1 hour ago, gowlerk said:

Freedom to infect. Is it not in the Bill of Rights somewhere? Is this not covered by the right to bear arms?

IMO Abbot, Jordan and the other politicians condemning vaccine mandates may be pandering to their base, but the fact is; they are making technically illegal statements. If the US Government came out and said that everyone will get a vaccine - there's case law that stands behind it. We do not have the right to infect our fellow citizens and parents cannot choose for their children in a situation like this. I think this article will provide a path to more information if one chooses to research it more, but it is one of the best summaries of the vaccine mandate situation. 

https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/25/opinions/unvaccinated-cant-use-constitutional-rights-excuse-hamilton-offit/index.html

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(edited)
11 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

IMO Abbot, Jordan and the other politicians condemning vaccine mandates may be pandering to their base, but the fact is; they are making technically illegal statements. If the US Government came out and said that everyone will get a vaccine - there's case law that stands behind it. We do not have the right to infect our fellow citizens and parents cannot choose for their children in a situation like this. I think this article will provide a path to more information if one chooses to research it more, but it is one of the best summaries of the vaccine mandate situation. 

https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/25/opinions/unvaccinated-cant-use-constitutional-rights-excuse-hamilton-offit/index.html

I believe that you are correct. I was really just making fun of the attitude these people have. Although I am pretty sure that the government in either the USA or Canada can not actually legally force vaccination upon anyone except possibly prisoners or military personnel. But it can certainly impose restrictions on the unvaccinated. I also believe that this battle will be largely behind us in about a year. Only a small number of holdouts will remain and the virus will be limited to small isolated outbreaks. 

Edited by gowlerk

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In some instances TV Hollywood already has already portrayed it and moved beyond it. I was flipping through channels last Thursday and saw a caption at the start of Grey's Anatomy that the show is now set in a "Post Pandemic" world. I guess they got tired of filming with the masks. :rofl:

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My employer: Coast Mountain Bus Company just announced that all employees must be vaccinated by the end of November. Better than 90 percent are already double-vaccinated. If employees are not double-vaccinated by the dead-line, they will be suspended without pay.

Similar announcements have been made about gov't and medical employees.

The British Columbia provincial gov't has told doctors not to issue vaccination-waivers except for rare cases of pre-existing medical problems.

 

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2 hours ago, kallend said:

https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/brief/covid19-and-other-leading-causes-of-death-in-the-us/

90,000 preventable deaths.  Mostly thanks to the Pro-Virus party.

 

The Isreali Booster shot program seems to be paying off. From a Bloomberg article: "Confirmed infection rates were ~10-fold lower in the booster versus non-booster group,” the authors wrote. The benefit was even greater for older Israels. Infections dropped by a factor of 19 for people over 60, and by a factor of 22 for the 40-60 age group."

They now also require a third shot to qualify for a vaccine passport. Based on their data we got our third shot at 5 months after the prime shots. Still don't have a tail, still believe in the moon landing.

 

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It now appears that the land border with Canada will open for non essential travel for fully vaccinated people on November 8. Essential travelers (truckers) will need to be vaccinated by sometime in January. The new reality is starting to take shape. Canada is still requiring testing before crossing right now, but I imagine that rule will soon be relaxed. 

 

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22 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

Canada is still requiring testing before crossing right now, but I imagine that rule will soon be relaxed. 

Seems like the test could be as simple as:

"So who won the 2020 presidential election?"

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19 minutes ago, ryoder said:

Seems like the test could be as simple as:

"So who won the 2020 presidential election?"

But we are also requiring testing for returning Canadians. That is causing a problem for all those single day trips.

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1 hour ago, gowlerk said:

But we are also requiring testing for returning Canadians. That is causing a problem for all those single day trips.

Do you have to be tested when you return as a trucker? Are the "home tests" conducted live at customs acceptable?

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This came from the interwebz so it has to be true:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1448936949012578304

I think my biggest problem with all things COVID is the religious fervor it bring out.  I noted at the outset that Bad Craziness would be the norm in short order - I wish I'd been wrong.

Like the holy grail of systems theory, in which a transform that yields a Single Input - Single Output (or at least Jordan form, with a single derivative at most) is the ideal - ideologies associated with Big Problems for Humanity coalesce around simplistic solutions.

Eliminating Atmospheric Carbon will save us from Global Warming/Climate Change/whatever!

The Vaccine will save us from the scourge of COVID-19!

Anybody that questions these TRUTHS is a heretic and must be eliminated!

Of course the Deniers (tm) may not be much better.

As a confirmed skeptic I like closed-form solutions where they exist but am happy to use a stochastic approach when appropriate.  I am leery of any approach the relies on The Truth, regardless of how convenient it may be; if I use it, it is not a matter of 'belief.'

 

YMMV,

Winsor

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Meanwhile, North of the 49th parallel:

New Brunswick pastor jailed for a week as judge considers COVID-19 contempt charge

The Crown has alleged Philip James Hutchings, the pastor of His Tabernacle Family Church in Saint John, is in contempt of court for not abiding by a consent order signed on Oct. 8 requiring congregants to follow health orders such as masking.

...and...

Anti-mask activists ordered by Calgary judge to preach science, too

A Calgary-based street pastor, his brother and an anti-mask cafe owner have been fined, put on probation and ordered by a judge that they must also preach science if they continue to rail against COVID-19 public health rules.

 

Nice to see irrational idiocy cloaked in "religious belief", held accountable.

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(edited)
On 10/16/2021 at 2:57 AM, winsor said:

This came from the interwebz so it has to be true:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1448936949012578304

I think my biggest problem with all things COVID is the religious fervor it bring out.  I noted at the outset that Bad Craziness would be the norm in short order - I wish I'd been wrong.

Like the holy grail of systems theory, in which a transform that yields a Single Input - Single Output (or at least Jordan form, with a single derivative at most) is the ideal - ideologies associated with Big Problems for Humanity coalesce around simplistic solutions.

Eliminating Atmospheric Carbon will save us from Global Warming/Climate Change/whatever!

The Vaccine will save us from the scourge of COVID-19!

Anybody that questions these TRUTHS is a heretic and must be eliminated!

Of course the Deniers (tm) may not be much better.

As a confirmed skeptic I like closed-form solutions where they exist but am happy to use a stochastic approach when appropriate.  I am leery of any approach the relies on The Truth, regardless of how convenient it may be; if I use it, it is not a matter of 'belief.'

 

YMMV,

Winsor

The ‘my uneducated skepticism is just as valid as truth presented by experts’ is yet another bullshit argument by people trying to empower their own ignorance.

I’m sorry - but if 100s of thousands of trained experts around the globe say one thing, and someone calls it The ‘Truth‘’ like it’s even possible to be some sort of conspiracy theory then they’re not a thinking skeptic - They’re an arrogant asshole.
Equating their own ignorance of a subject with the weight of not only numbers, but years of specific and dedicated training and experience in the subject.

It would be like me stating that my take on aircraft safety procedures are just as valid as every check-captain because I’ve taken one lesson. See? That would be me being an arrogant Asshole.

 

Dressing that arrogance up in language to make your argument appear smarter is nothing more than a con-trick. An old one.

You want to explain your position and get numbers of normal people behind it then you explain in the simplest terms because not everyone is an expert… 

 

Yes. Humans suck at complex problems. That’s why we invented computers. They also suck at generational planning of projects. Both are a function of our biology.

But sometimes simple solutions are the best because either ‘they’re just the best’, or even if they’re not them it’s a hell of a lot easier to roll out a simple process and have some benefit than it is to roll out a mathematically perfect one that has no chance of adoption because it’s so complicated.

It’s the same argument second amendment fans use - if you can’t come up with a single solution that fixes everything in one go, even fringe cases, then it’s best to do nothing.

 

If the covid vaccine and lockdowns had been implemented properly then there was a very good chance we could have beaten covid - at least temporarily and nationally which would have bought time for further research. 
It wasn’t, and over 700,000 people in the US are dead because of it.

 

The reason heretics should be burned is BECAUSE THIS SHIT MATTERS. It’s not philosophy - people are dead because people like you weaken the arguments for safety and you might convince others which can potentially end up hurting me and mine.

 

 

 

Edited by yoink
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2 minutes ago, yoink said:

 

If the covid vaccine and lockdowns had been implemented properly then there was a very good chance we could have beaten covid - at least temporarily and nationally which would have bought time for further research. 
It wasn’t, and over 700,000 people in the US are dead because of it.

 

 

"When a polarizing national figure decides that he didn’t want to let a crisis go to waste (ie downplay it to gain short-term favor), it’s not surprising it would turn into a bone of contention. "

A wise person wrote that.

 

Some 10% of the deaths were avoidable, had proper measures been taken early enough.

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50 minutes ago, ryoder said:

"What are you suggesting I do?  Google?"

Of course!  The Google knows all.  And it comes from authoritative sources.

Here's what Dr. Steve Beito posted recently: (remember he's a REAL DOCTOR) -

"So you want to mandate a vaccine aimed at the Alpha variant (which is now only 7% of COVID) that doesn't stop infection/transmission of SARS COV2 for which natural immunity is better than vaccine acquired immunity?  Madness."

That's a REAL DOCTOR saying that, not a fake doctor with a degree in Imam-ology.  (I mean, Dr. Beito died of COVID, but it's the meme that counts.)

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