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DJL

US Baghdad Embassy Attacked by Protesters

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2 hours ago, DJL said:

They know what's good for them and Soleimani wasn't exactly popular with everyone in Iran.  That guy had a lot of control and was gaining more, he was well on his way to increasing his control of a regional military that wasn't even part of the Iranian State.  He was going to be the next Saddam Hussein.

If I'm not mistaken, he was part of this as well, right?

https://www.jewishpress.com/news/middle-east/iran-news/irans-mullahs-killed-400-wounded-4000-detained-10000-in-fight-for-their-lives/2019/11/24/

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Trump policies on Iran:

Tear up the JCPOA Iran was complying with.

Apply crippling sanctions on Iran, triggering escalating hostilities & destabilization.

Retaliate to Iranian hostilities by killing Soleimani.

Apply even more sanctions.

Seek a nuclear deal like the one he tore up.

Blame Obama.

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1 hour ago, turtlespeed said:

 

I hope he is wise enough to accept the gesture for what it was.

From his press conference it sounds like he was aware of it.  Also, he looked like he could barely keep it together enough to make it through the press conference.  I don't think he's in good shape.

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4 hours ago, ryoder said:

Saw a New York Times article that said Trump admits his order was done to appease GOP senators that he needs for the impeachment

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(edited)
49 minutes ago, kallend said:

Why are we an occupying power in their country anyway?

I blame the W administration, and the neo-cons with their crusader agenda. But really it goes back to Churchill and and the Anglo-Persian Oil Company  Someone had to take up the white man's burden.

Edited by gowlerk

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On 1/9/2020 at 1:19 AM, normiss said:

Trump policies on Iran:

Tear up the JCPOA Iran was complying with.

Apply crippling sanctions on Iran, triggering escalating hostilities & destabilization.

Retaliate to Iranian hostilities by killing Soleimani.

Apply even more sanctions.

Seek a nuclear deal like the one he tore up.

Blame Obama.

So Trump said that after the missile strike everything was fine, I forget what words the idiot used. 

Traumatic brain injury is apparently nothing to be concerned over...
 

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/478713-11-us-troops-injured-in-iran-missile-strikes-on-iraqi-bases-report

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(edited)
32 minutes ago, nigel99 said:

So Trump said that after the missile strike everything was fine, I forget what words the idiot used. 

Traumatic brain injury is apparently nothing to be concerned over...
 

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/478713-11-us-troops-injured-in-iran-missile-strikes-on-iraqi-bases-report

So we should have bombed them back, not de escalated.  gotcha.

I'm sure the American people would have been perfectly fine with just a few injuries.

Edited by turtlespeed

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1 hour ago, turtlespeed said:

So we should have bombed them back, not de escalated.  gotcha.

I'm sure the American people would have been perfectly fine with just a few injuries.

Just a few injuries and 176 dead, small price to pay for deflecting attention from impeachment.

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3 hours ago, nigel99 said:

Just a few injuries and 176 dead, small price to pay for deflecting attention from impeachment.

I'm sorry - Did Trump's order to eliminate a really really bad guy cause you go out and kill anyone?

I know it didn't cause me to do anything.

The responsibility of the decision made to do any killing sits squarely on the one that gave the order.

Trump ordered a horrible human being to be removed from the planet.

Ali Khamenei gave the order to eliminate the rest of those that you speak of, unless you believe that Trump pulls his strings like a puppeteer.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

I'm sorry - Did Trump's order to eliminate a really really bad guy cause you go out and kill anyone?

I know it didn't cause me to do anything.

The responsibility of the decision made to do any killing sits squarely on the one that gave the order.

Trump ordered a horrible human being to be removed from the planet.

Ali Khamenei gave the order to eliminate the rest of those that you speak of, unless you believe that Trump pulls his strings like a puppeteer.

 

 

I think what we're all getting at it the fact that actions in the Middle East cause things to go haywire and if you take those actions you need to also be ready for the consequences in human and civilian lives.  That said, what the fuck was anyone doing flying into, out of or over Iran five hours after they'd launched a missile strike against US targets?  This is one of the most volatile countries in the world and they had just attempted to escalated a fight with the most well armed military on the planet.  Cancel all flights.

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1 minute ago, DJL said:

I think what we're all getting at it the fact that actions in the Middle East cause things to go haywire and if you take those actions you need to also be ready for the consequences in human and civilian lives.  That said, what the fuck was anyone doing flying into, out of or over Iran five hours after they'd launched a missile strike against US targets?  This is one of the most volatile countries in the world and they had just attempted to escalated a fight with the most well armed military on the planet.  Cancel all flights.

Don't blame the victims. ( I realize that wasn't your intention).  

Hopefully, the reason it was allowed is that there was little, to no communication.

Unless they were ordered to allow the plane - so they had a target.

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Just now, turtlespeed said:

Don't blame the victims. ( I realize that wasn't your intention).  

Hopefully, the reason it was allowed is that there was little, to no communication.

Unless they were ordered to allow the plane - so they had a target.

I don't blame the victims but I do blame everyone from the cockpit to each country's equivalent of the FAA.  Remember, this was 5 hours after Iran shot missiles at US targets.  I only wonder how there were not more planes getting shot down.  

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20 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

I'm sorry - Did Trump's order to eliminate a really really bad guy cause you go out and kill anyone?

I know it didn't cause me to do anything.

The responsibility of the decision made to do any killing sits squarely on the one that gave the order.

Trump ordered a horrible human being to be removed from the planet.

Ali Khamenei gave the order to eliminate the rest of those that you speak of, unless you believe that Trump pulls his strings like a puppeteer.

 

 

Something I intensely dislike about the USA is the way they try and circumvent international law by ‘inventing’ new classes of enemy. Bush did it with Iraq and Afghanistan and the same goes for designating an arm of Iran’s security forces as terrorists and ordering a hit on the leader. 
 

Was he a bad man? Certainly he was, 

Trump did something that was questionable in terms of strategy and legality and owns the consequences. No he did not shoot down the airliner, but he triggered the events leading to it happening. 

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5 minutes ago, DJL said:

I don't blame the victims but I do blame everyone from the cockpit to each country's equivalent of the FAA.  Remember, this was 5 hours after Iran shot missiles at US targets.  I only wonder how there were not more planes getting shot down.  

I agree. Not a good time to be in the air. I know QANTAS diverted their flights around the Middle East at that time.

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38 minutes ago, nigel99 said:

Was he a bad man? Certainly he was, 

Trump did something that was questionable in terms of strategy and legality and owns the consequences. No he did not shoot down the airliner, but he triggered the events leading to it happening. 

No one did anything with a trigger except Ali Khamenei.  He ordered the trigger pulled.  NO ONE forced his decision, just like NO ONE forced Trump to do what he did.

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