Croc 0 #1 Posted February 23, 2019 I'm getting one of these mains. Anyone have experience with both? Anyone own a Crossfire 3? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddingo 21 #2 February 23, 2019 You realise they are in a total different category right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tanj 0 #3 February 24, 2019 I jumped a Sabre 170 (original not 2) for 24 years and just got a Crossfire 3 149. I only have 10 jumps on it so far some and fly rather conservative. The openings on my Crossfire are so soft and on heading. The reason I bought it is because I had a super hard opening on my Sabre and blew up 3 cells. So far I can't say enough good things about it. Flies great, flares great, very stable in turbulence. But the best part is the openings! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #5 February 24, 2019 14 hours ago, Maddingo said: You realise they are in a total different category right? Maddingo, I will test jump the Crossfire 3, of course, but from the descriptions on the NZ Aerosports website I don't see the they are "totally different." How are they totally different? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,102 #6 February 24, 2019 15 minutes ago, Croc said: Maddingo, I will test jump the Crossfire 3, of course, but from the descriptions on the NZ Aerosports website I don't see the they are "totally different." How are they totally different? Looking at the description on that website I agree, it is hard for someone who doesn't already know to understand what an X-fire is all about. But if you dig past the marketing hype about "what a wonderful girl she is" you will see that it is a "fully elliptical" canopy with characteristics that are more like a Stiletto than a Sabre 2. The NZ Aerosports canopy that directly competes with the Sabre 2 is the Safire 3. Marketing these things like they are women just bugs me BTW. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #7 February 24, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, gowlerk said: Looking at the description on that website I agree, it is hard for someone who doesn't already know to understand what an X-fire is all about. But if you dig past the marketing hype about "what a wonderful girl she is" you will see that it is a "fully elliptical" canopy with characteristics that are more like a Stiletto than a Sabre 2. The NZ Aerosports canopy that directly competes with the Sabre 2 is the Safire 3. Marketing these things like they are women just bugs me BTW. Not an X-Fire. Crossfire 3.I have a Safire 3. It is more like a Pilot than a Sabre 2, it seems to me. Sabre 2 flies like my storm and lands like nothing I have ever owned. Edited February 24, 2019 by Croc Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,102 #8 February 24, 2019 Just now, Croc said: Not an X-Fire. Crossfire 3. Sorry, I assumed you would understand. X-fire is often used as shorthand, like X-mas is for Christmas. But of course Icarus World and NZ Aerosports like to confuse everyone, including me. What I said applies to the NZ Crossfire 3 to be more clear. Most people would not consider it to be in the class as a Sabre 2. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #9 February 24, 2019 14 minutes ago, gowlerk said: Sorry, I assumed you would understand. X-fire is often used as shorthand, like X-mas is for Christmas. But of course Icarus World and NZ Aerosports like to confuse everyone, including me. What I said applies to the NZ Crossfire 3 to be more clear. Most people would not consider it to be in the class as a Sabre 2. From the descriptions on the Icarus website the X-Fire seems to be much different than the NZ Aerosports Crossfire 3. Aren't they? I have an email to Julien at NZ Aerosports, so I'll see what he says. And yes, it is confusing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,102 #10 February 24, 2019 The marketing is different and yes, an X-fire is not the same as a Crossfire 3, but it is similar. However, I thought you were choosing between a Sabre 2 and a Crossfire? All the comments here are about making sure you understand that these are very different canopies in very different classes. Like I already said, the Safire 3 competes with the Sabre 2. Crossfires, X-fires, Stilettos, and even Katanas are all elliptical canopies and are share characteristics. You need to decide what you are looking for in a canopy and it is clear that you don't yet understand what each of these designs do. Do not rely on the marketing of the manufacturer. Talk to experienced people who have jumped different types of canopies. That said, all these are very good canopies, but it is important that you understand just what they do before you decide. If you are looking at Sabre 2s you should also be looking at Safire3, S-fire, and even Pilots for comparison. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #11 February 24, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, gowlerk said: The marketing is different and yes, an X-fire is not the same as a Crossfire 3, but it is similar. However, I thought you were choosing between a Sabre 2 and a Crossfire? All the comments here are about making sure you understand that these are very different canopies in very different classes. Like I already said, the Safire 3 competes with the Sabre 2. Crossfires, X-fires, Stilettos, and even Katanas are all elliptical canopies and are share characteristics. You need to decide what you are looking for in a canopy and it is clear that you don't yet understand what each of these designs do. Do not rely on the marketing of the manufacturer. Talk to experienced people who have jumped different types of canopies. That said, all these are very good canopies, but it is important that you understand just what they do before you decide. If you are looking at Sabre 2s you should also be looking at Safire3, S-fire, and even Pilots for comparison. OK. Thanks. I have a Safire 3. Edited February 24, 2019 by Croc Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #12 February 24, 2019 (edited) Quote Edited February 24, 2019 by Croc Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #13 February 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Croc said: Can't figure out how to use this new format! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #14 February 24, 2019 12 hours ago, tanj said: I jumped a Sabre 170 (original not 2) for 24 years and just got a Crossfire 3 149. I only have 10 jumps on it so far some and fly rather conservative. The openings on my Crossfire are so soft and on heading. The reason I bought it is because I had a super hard opening on my Sabre and blew up 3 cells. So far I can't say enough good things about it. Flies great, flares great, very stable in turbulence. But the best part is the openings! Thanks. That's what I was looking for. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maddingo 21 #15 February 24, 2019 I don't know what have you been reading on their webpage but they clearly outline to whom the cf 3 is tailored to quote: At light wingloadings of 1.0 to 1.4, the Crossfire 3 is suitable as a first or second fully elliptical 9-cell for confident intermediate jumpers stepping it up a notch or three from their Safire 2, 3 or equivalent. We recommend a minimum of 500 jumps on a square or semi-elliptical canopy before moving to a Crossfire 3 of an appropriate wingloading for these jumpers. At higher wingloadings of 1.5 and above, the Crossfire 3 is an all new machine for those jumpers already accustomed to flying smaller/higher loaded Crossfire 2's or other elliptical 9-cells. She's a step up in performance. She whips around, dives hard, recovers slow, and eats up the ground in a swoop. She is perfect for advanced pilots who want a fun hassle-free canopy without going crossbraced, and a favorite among team flyers and camera-flyers. From what I heard a Crossfire is an elliptical beast, truly meant for pilots who mastered the fundamentals of canopy flight and are looking for advanced performance. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #16 February 25, 2019 Thanks. I read that also. That does seem to be what I'm looking for. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JumpRu 14 #17 February 25, 2019 not sure what that was new crossfire from NZ or Spain.... But my friend with reasonable wingloading (less then 2) swoop it really well. I was surprized, that new Schuman or whatever it is called design seems really make a difference for that wing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #18 February 26, 2019 It would be my first fully elliptical, and with 1200 jumps and loaded about 1.25 it does not seem to be too radical a move. I will demo it, of course. I have a Safire 3 which seems a bit docile, although I am considering just getting a smaller Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Croc 0 #19 February 26, 2019 Thanks for all the replies. After emailing Julian I will be looking at a Safire 3 149 or a Sabre 2 150. (Currently jumping a Safire 3 169.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites