Dbag size, how tight is too tight?

[Volare500 0]

I'm looking at picking up a used rig (first rig) from a regular at my DZ. The price is too good to pass up. A concern I have though, I tried packing the thing, and noticed the dbag just barely contains the main chute. Like it's wanting to burst out of there. Getting the S-fold in the bag wasn't a problem, but getting the elastics around to close it was a bit of a challenge. Mind you I still have very little packing experience at this point and know it's always difficult at first. I've packed a few other rental rigs that were a breeze, but this one put up a fight.

Is this something to be concerned about? The rig was inspected and signed off on by a rigger last May and every year before.

Thoughts?

[Blis 1]

Dbag is sized to container and your main should be sized according to container, if the combination is ok (no home rigging!) and you have problems getting everything to fit you need to improve your packing skills...

If your previous experience has been with rentals and you're now packing something newish then 99% it's your packing skills that need brushing.

[Volare500 0]

Makes sense. I still have very little experience packing so it seems difficult for me. Once the the lines are stowed, the bag fits nicely into the container and I have no trouble closing everything up.

[betzilla 56]

There are a couple different makes of equipment that feel this way to me when I pack the recommended max size main into them. The bags just always seem a little smaller than I would like them to be.

Assuming you haven't exceeded the container's capacity, and the d-bag you have is factory original and the same size as the container, I don't think you need to be concerned. You'll develop tricks pretty quickly to manage it better.

Good luck!

[pchapman 277]

Volare500

Getting the S-fold in the bag wasn't a problem, but getting the elastics around to close it was a bit of a challenge.

As long as you can close it...

I've even had elastics strung 2 in a line to close an over-stuffed bag, or later replaced the extra elastics by short loops of binding tape, to act as extensions to the elastic anchors. Or used Tube Stows that can stretch more without constant breaking like overstretched elastics.

The caveats though:
While a little exposed parachute isn't a problem at the speeds we use, you do still want to make sure the canopy isn't going to squeeze out of the bag somehow. One better make sure that overstretched elastics are in good condition and replaced often enough to avoid stripping the bag off during opening. Which is seriously bad.

As others are saying, it is still important that the bag does come out of the container without being jammed in place.

[riggerrob 601]

Pay a local packer to pack it and tell you if it is a good fit.

This is a recurring problem with second-hand year.
The correct sequence is choosing the reserve that you want to land after a skydive gone bad.
Secondly, choose a main parachute comfortably sized to match your skills, weight, etc.
Only then can you start to choose a container that will gracefully accept those canopies.

[councilman24 37]

Volare500

The price is too good to pass up.
Thoughts?

No matter what the final decision is about this rig this sentence needs to be banned from your mind. If it's to small, too old, doesn't fit, etc. etc. you pass it up. "I can deal with a (enter reserve size too small)", "I'll be good with this canopy in a 30 or 40 jumps, I can survive that." The harness is a little small/big but it'll be okay." NO price is to good to pass up. And this isn't any different than anything else. WHY is the price so good?

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[Westerly 61]

pchapman

***Getting the S-fold in the bag wasn't a problem, but getting the elastics around to close it was a bit of a challenge.

As long as you can close it...


I'd disagree with that. I've seen people close rigs that were so small that half the main was literately sticking out of the d bag. That's a serious malfunction just waiting to happen. If the main gets free out of sequence because the d bag is so small it cannot contain it, that's a bag strip malfunction and bag strip can cause lethally hard openings.

My general thought is that if the rubber bands on the closing stows have to stretch across a bunch of canopy material just to close the bag, then the bag is either too small or your packing technique is poor. When the bag is closed, it should contain the entire parachute. If you want to know what a properly fitted main/ d bag combo is, look no further than your rig's user manual.

Page 38 if you need an example: https://www.flyaerodyne.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/IconManual052017_online.pdf

[pchapman 277]

Quote

***As long as you can close it...

I'd disagree with that.

Note that I did then include some warnings and limits.

But yes generally one doesn't want a ton of fabrics ticking out, and many may disagree with me about fabric sticking out in general, as it really isn't 'normal' or the way main bags are planned to be used.

Still, consider the attached example from one manufacturer's reserve packing manual -- there's plenty of canopy sticking out in the official manual for a system certificated to 150 kts.

Having some canopy sticking out isn't the end of the world, even if we can probably agree that in most situations it isn't ideal.

[inline wingsreserve.jpg]

[Volare500 0]

This is what it looks like. It all fits in the container like a glove, no problems there. Closes up just fine and is not overstuffed one bit. Maybe I'm truely horrible at packing, but I swear you could bounce a quarter off this thing. The rig has a 170 main and 170 reserve, giving me a 0.95 wing load. It's older, but in great shape. And the harness was made for someone exactly my hight and weight. Unless my research has lead me wrong, it all sounds like a good starter rig for someone like myself with under 100 jumps.

[pchapman 277]

Yeah that's pretty overstuffed in the bag. At least chain a couple elastics together for the first two stows, so those two aren't overstressed and break too easily?

And follow some of the earlier advice in the thread -- check container vs. canopy volume, and have an experienced packer pack it.

[degeneration 5]

Basic question - are you sure that the canopy is filling all the dbag? All the way into the corners?

If that's a 170 main, are you sure the container is sized suitably for a 170 main?

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[sundevil777 98]

The middle locking stows are likely to break right when the most load is on them, when the bag is lifted, the acceleration of the canopy putting a lot more stress right at the locking stows.

You really should do something to avoid that.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[Volare500 0]

Contacted a local master rigger who will take a closer look at it.

[Westerly 61]

Volare500

This is what it looks like. It all fits in the container like a glove, no problems there. Closes up just fine and is not overstuffed one bit. Maybe I'm truely horrible at packing, but I swear you could bounce a quarter off this thing. The rig has a 170 main and 170 reserve, giving me a 0.95 wing load. It's older, but in great shape. And the harness was made for someone exactly my hight and weight. Unless my research has lead me wrong, it all sounds like a good starter rig for someone like myself with under 100 jumps.

Yea, if the canopy is packed well, then that bag is definitely too small. What brand and size container do you have? It should say on the TSO label that holds your reserve packing card.