What's a little masturbation between friends??!

[Nataly 38]

Am I the only one experiencing cognitive dissonance with this whole Louis CK sexual misconduct thing?? It's not that I like his comedy so I don't want to condemn the man... I just really saw him as a person who has empathy and who championed women in all their (flawed) glory.

I can believe that comedy is a cesspool of gross, inappropriate, stupid male behaviour... Having worked in male-dominated environments, I have seen first-hand the kind of shit that goes on... Burping, farting, and yes, pulling your dick out... You would think that a *grown man* would not have to be told not to whip out his cock AT WORK or in front of work colleagues or in a work context, but there ya go... It happens... A lot. And whilst I think that sort of thing is *mostly* harmless and just funny or indeed rather pathetic, it's NOT so harmless/silly/funny when there is a power imbalance that means you cannot say anything if it makes you uncomfortable. And BELIEVE me - when you are alone with a semi-naked man, it quickly becomes scary/uncomfortable. I guess maybe it's hard for a man to fully grasp how frightening/awkward/unpleasant those situations are from our point of view... I guess the fact that Louis asked before pulling out his dick made him feel like it was ok...

I guess a lot of stuff happens that shouldn't because people fundamentally do not really understand what the experience feels like from the other person's point of view.

I like Louis. A lot. I am a huge fan of his. I am glad he finally fessed up to this. Perhaps it will raise people's consciousness. To be honest part of me feels more sorry for him than for the women... He's not a particularly handsome guy... He is funny as hell, and he used this as his currency to try and get *some* kind of sexual release. If people had less hangups about sex in general, the experience would be "icky" at most but for sure not traumatising...

Ahhhh... I dunno... It's complicated. And sad. I sincerely hope Louis learns from this and has some insight into how he made those women feel... I hope those women have a bit of empathy for Louis as well... I am surprised by the dialogue that is happening in light of this... I was worried he would be crucified on the same level as a rapist but it seems people are looking deeper into it and trying to be fair in their analysis of the situation. I bet he feels relieved he finally owned up to it... Will be interesting to see what comes of this in the long run.

"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse."
- Chris Hadfield
« Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. »
- my boss

[Bob_Church 7]

Nataly

Am I the only one experiencing cognitive dissonance with this whole Louis CK sexual misconduct thing?? It's not that I like his comedy so I don't want to condemn the man... I just really saw him as a person who has empathy and who championed women in all their (flawed) glory.

The nudity part does get complicated, but the masturbation was seriously screwed up. The most difficult part of my job at the Art School was to put on a professionally detached look when standing next to some of the most beautiful young women in the world while they weren't wearing a stitch. (one of my frequent questions to one of the Fashion shooters was "how is it fashion if she isn't wearing anything") but one thing for sure is that the frequent nudity didn't make for a locker room attitude, if anything, the opposite. I'm not sure if that's a good explanation or not. As far as him asking I think that made it worse because I don't get the impression that he said "would it be ok" then waited. It comes across more as "I'm going to do this." And frankly, having some guy meet you for a supposed business meeting with no clothes on while jerking off is not normal, so what's next?
I think he needs help.
The head of the photojournalism department went too far, having young women meet him alone in the small private studio then pressuring them to get topless. If handled correctly students being models and posing nude was an every day thing. But it wasn't handled properly and he was not only fired but it was national news because he'd been somewhat famous. He went from King of the Hill to lower than snake shit.

[Nataly 38]

I really want to be clear that I don't think what he did was ok. And as a grown man he FOR SURE should know better. And as a person who *does* appear to have a great deal of empathy, the fact that he denied it for so long is pretty horrible. The thing I find most disappointing is that this behaviour is so freakin far from what knd of human being I thought he was... It's hard for me to compute. It really doesn't match the idea I had of him.

Guess we are all flawed... Even our heros...

"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse."
- Chris Hadfield
« Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. »
- my boss

[Bob_Church 7]

Nataly

I really want to be clear that I don't think what he did was ok. And as a grown man he FOR SURE should know better. And as a person who *does* appear to have a great deal of empathy, the fact that he denied it for so long is pretty horrible. The thing I find most disappointing is that this behaviour is so freakin far from what knd of human being I thought he was... It's hard for me to compute. It really doesn't match the idea I had of him.

Guess we are all flawed... Even our heros...

Oh yeh, it's like "Please, not THIS person." It can take a toll. Fortunately the people who got in trouble over the years at Seigfred were people I didn't like. That helps a LOT.

Bob

[Bob_Church 7]

I can't even imagine trying to make a living as a comedian. It has to be maddening in itself. Come to think of it, I don't think anyone who's been caught up in this so far is someone I care about. But at this rate I'm sure it will happen.

[Bob_Church 7]

Sorry, I get nostalgic for the Art School, especially at this time of year and go on about it even if it doesn't fit the topic.

[Phillbo 11]

Who?

[Bob_Church 7]

Phillbo

Who?

Larry Nighswander. From the occasional cover of National Geographic to the crime and shame section of several newspapers.

[ryoder 1,381]

Bob_Church

The most difficult part of my job at the Art School was to put on a professionally detached look when standing next to some of the most beautiful young women in the world while they weren't wearing a stitch.

Damn. I've never had a job like that.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[Bob_Church 7]

ryoder

***The most difficult part of my job at the Art School was to put on a professionally detached look when standing next to some of the most beautiful young women in the world while they weren't wearing a stitch.

Damn. I've never had a job like that.

There were many many times I'd catch myself thinking "I get paid for this?" I worked for the phone company for 11 years, one week I'm on a line crew, the next I'm tech for the photo areas in a School of Art. It was like a tv series. A highly unlikely one. Don't let anyone ever tell you that it's not a matter of who you know.

[Bob_Church 7]

The way they keep canceling shows makes me wonder who they're actually punishing. I wanted to see some of that stuff.

[Bob_Church 7]

One thing I am starting to wonder about is the severity of some of the punishments. A person says "you're right, I screwed up, it won't happen again and I'm really sorry about it" but he loses everything he was living for." Comparing Spacey or Franken with Weinstein doesn't seem right.

[Nataly 38]

Bob_Church

One thing I am starting to wonder about is the severity of some of the punishments. A person says "you're right, I screwed up, it won't happen again and I'm really sorry about it" but he loses everything he was living for." Comparing Spacey or Franken with Weinstein doesn't seem right.

I have not followed very closely the allegations against Spacey but at first glance it seems like he is essentially being denounced for trying to get laid... If the claims against him are more serious, then my apologies... But yeah... There is such a thing as going too far...

I am really glad that all of this is raising awareness about the injustices people face when there are imbalances of power... It's fantastic if vulnerable people have more opportunities to speak out and indeed if predatory behaviour can be discouraged/stopped in the first place.

But some of what is being denounced has more to do with an extremely unhealthy attitude toward sex and some of it is simply witch-hunting... That is not great...

"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse."
- Chris Hadfield
« Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. »
- my boss

[Bob_Church 7]

"I have not followed very closely the allegations against Spacey but at first glance it seems like he is essentially being denounced for trying to get laid... Crazy If the claims against him are more serious, then my apologies... But yeah... There is such a thing as going too far... Unsure "

A gay man being promiscuous towards other gay men. Hold the press!!!!

[tigra 0]

They were much younger gay men and in at least one case a boy who probably should not have been in his apartment at the time.

But yes, Al Franken behaved like a jerk and posed for a stupid picture. Harvey Weinstein raped and sexually assaulted multiple women then bought their silence with threats and cash, in some cases damaged their careers even when they went along with payoffs and non disclosure agreements. Not exactly the same. Most of these other douchebags fall somewhere in the middle of the spectrum.

[Bob_Church 7]

There was another important discussion just getting started and I was wondering if this would boost it or just overshadow it. Unfortunately it looks like the question of whether a woman should have to show her breast to get the job is right has receded again. It was started, this time, by Emilia Clarke, and she seemed to be getting her point across. Then.