Pilot7 canopy

[kallend 1,836]

Has anyone experience with the Pilot7?

And if so, what do you think of it, and the various fabric options?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[faulknerwn 38]

A friend of mine had one with his wingsuit and had some issues with hard openings. I jumped it a couple of times and quite liked how it flew and landed (opened pretty normal - I was not in a wingsuit.)

[dthames 0]

John,

One of my jump buddied has jumped two or three different sizes of the Pilot7, so is a repeat customer. That says a lot.

I have been jumping a Pilot 9 ZPX since I was a student. I don't have any issues with ZPX. I don't know about that newer lower volume fabric.

Dan

Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

[luis 0]

137, zero-p, hma lines. Tried the same size UltraLPV demo but ended up buying zero-p. The opening and flight differences were negligible, so I chose durability
Very happy with the canopy. Perfect for wingsuiting (never actually used it for anything else). My previous ws canopies were Safire1&2 129.

[Skwrl 56]

I like mine a lot! The openings are fantastic, and it's much nicer performance than my prior two canopies (a Storm and a Sabre2).

Skwrl Productions - Wingsuit Photography

Northeast Bird School - Chief Logistics Guy and Video Dork

[DHemer 0]

No complaints with my canopy
137 loaded around 1.3:1, ZPX fapric, ZLX lines
I wanted the smaller pack size but i was not sure on the long term durability of the lpv bottom skin so I went all zp

Packs into a 135 container easily, opening are brisker than my old 140 pilot. Steeper trim than the regular pilot but fun to fly, surprised me how responsive it felt for a 7 cell.

Its fine for both regular freefall and ws jumps.

[repcool 2]

I no longer have an Aerodyne sponsorship but I still decided to purchase a Pilot7. I enjoy it and trust it that much.

[voilsb 1]

Since you have the ZLX lines, can you post some pictures of them and do you have an opinion on how they're different from vectran or HMA?


Unrelated to that, how does the pilot7 fly compared to other popular wingsuit canopies like storms, sabres, and original pilots?

Brian

[Awdpsi 0]

if your interested in trying something else I fly a winx 135 all zp from Atair. It packs the same size as a 120 opens and flies amazingly loaded at 1.6. I've never had any issues with openings or making it back from a long spot. Even surprised myself a few times. I'm pretty sure its also a fair bit cheaper than anything else on the market. Just figured I would throw that into the mix

Belt and Suspenders

[Skwrl 56]

I can compare it to a Storm - I had a Storm for about 1000 jumps. It has *much* more of a glide than the Storm. The Storm feels like it moves at something like a 45 degree angle. Much nicer when you're a little far from where you want to be. Also a much more powerful flare. The landings on my Storm always felt like I was using a CRW canopy.

As for the Sabre2, I had one for about 400 jumps (before the Storm). The glide ratio is similar, but the openings and landings on the P7 were much nicer.

Skwrl Productions - Wingsuit Photography

Northeast Bird School - Chief Logistics Guy and Video Dork

[Fall0ut 3]

I never jumped a Pilot7 myself but heard some people say that it will often open pretty hard on you when you are doing a regular freefall jump without wingsuit. This did not seem very appealing to me.
Any experiences on the Pilot7 without wingsuit?

[wasatchrider 0]

Awdpsi

if your interested in trying something else I fly a winx 135 all zp from Atair. It packs the same size as a 120 opens and flies amazingly loaded at 1.6. I've never had any issues with openings or making it back from a long spot. Even surprised myself a few times. I'm pretty sure its also a fair bit cheaper than anything else on the market. Just figured I would throw that into the mix

how does an all zp 135 pack as small as a 120?

BASE 1519

[Awdpsi 0]

It has to do with the construction methods I believe. Similar to how the flik was offered in an LV version for a while. Same material as the regular one just lighter lines and construction. I'm sure someone at atair can comment on this with more knowledge but it packs super small. You can also get it in a ultralight version that uses PN9 I believe for certain ribs or something to that effect and it packs 2 sizes smaller. If you haven't tried one or thought about one I suggest give it a run. Absolutely love the canopy

Belt and Suspenders

[kleggo 143]

Skwrl

Ihe landings on my Storm always felt like I was using a CRW canopy.

not surprising since the National CReW team was instrumental in development of the Storm.

cheers

[mathrick 2]

Fall0ut

I never jumped a Pilot7 myself but heard some people say that it will often open pretty hard on you when you are doing a regular freefall jump without wingsuit. This did not seem very appealing to me.
Any experiences on the Pilot7 without wingsuit?

I have something like 15 jumps on a demo P7 167 Ultra-LPV. All belly stuff. I had consistent unpleasantly hard openings, very different from what Aerodyne's materials say ("...and great for older jumpers who want the safety of consistently great openings"). It was just short of being too hard to continue jumping, and it made me dread pitching the PC, which is not something you want, really. I have now seen enough other people report the same to believe that I wasn't just a freak -- it seems that while it's not guaranteed to slam you, there's a higher than expected chance of having a P7 that opens consistently hard on you.

As for the flight characteristics, they were excellent. Just as much power as a Sabre2 of a similar size, excellent flare (although deeper in the brakes, it is a 7-cell after all), similar glide ratio to Sabre2 with just as much ability to flatten it out when needed, and much better than the lawn dart also known as Storm. I got the Storm when I knew I wanted to get into WS, and am now a happy owner of a Winx 150 :)

"Skydivers are highly emotional people. They get all excited about their magical black box full of mysterious life saving forces."

[dogdoghowl 5]

Considering the fact that this thread is in the wingsuit forum, I'd hesitate to apportion any real relevance to the criticisms about hard openings on non-wingsuit jumps (which mathrick has already detailed regarding the Pilot7 in two seperate threads).

Contemporary canopies designed for wingsuit purposes (Horizon/Epicene/Pilot7/Winx) are not intended for any discipline other than wingsuiting. In order to fulfil their design brief they need to open faster than is comfortable for most people jumping without a wingsuit. If the opening sequence took longer then the potential for line twists and off headings would be significantly increased. Hence, to list harder openings on non-wingsuit jumps as a negative trait when it is merely the canopy fulfilling its design brief is essentially asking a canopy to perform outside the parameters of its capabilities.

The future may hold the potential for canopies which are effectively able to perform across a range of disciplines whilst simultaneously displaying the superb opening characteristics for wingsuit flight as the above mentioned parachutes. Currently any such capabilities are a trade off in terms of opening suitability for wingsuit usage.

I have flown the Epicene and Pilot7 and enjoyed both canopies. I have chosen to purchase a Pilot7 however as I find it offers sporty flight traits and improved flare whilst having very little trade off in terms of openings. I believe it to be an excellent wingsuit canopy. Any one of the canopies listed above will work well though. If a more sporty canopy that still retains exemplary openings for wingsuit usage is desired I would recommend the Pilot7 without restraint. I believe Squirrel will be releasing a new version of the Epicene in the near future which will compete in this category also.

One last thing I would like to mention is that in these forums i see canopy material choice pertaining mostly to pack volume and longevity. Whilst these are undoubtedly factors the main consideration again is tied to opening performance. Only 0-3cfm (F-111 type) materials offer the consistency to be truly desirable for wingsuit usage (with ZP nose/top skin to prolong lifespan). ZP is not nearly as consistent throughout the opening phase. This is evidenced by its absence in BASE canopy manufacture.

[tommymc 0]

Is it really a quantum leap above the tried and true Triathlon (which can be had in very nice second-hand form for $500 to $600)?
Tom

[repcool 2]

tommymc

Is it really a quantum leap above the tried and true Triathlon (which can be had in very nice second-hand form for $500 to $600)?
Tom

The two really aren't even similar, other than both being 7 cells. I have 100+ wingsuit jumps on a tri and it doesn't compare in handling or landing to the P7. Tri got me on the ground safely, P7 does it with a smile and a swoop.

However, if you are on a budget the then Tri is a great option.

[richoH 6]

wasatchrider

***if your interested in trying something else I fly a winx 135 all zp from Atair. It packs the same size as a 120 opens and flies amazingly loaded at 1.6. I've never had any issues with openings or making it back from a long spot. Even surprised myself a few times. I'm pretty sure its also a fair bit cheaper than anything else on the market. Just figured I would throw that into the mix

how does an all zp 135 pack as small as a 120?

Calling it as small as a 120 is a stretch but it packs down pretty good.

I put my zp 135 in my larger container (i23SN). For comparison this container was full but not uncomfortable wiht a 96 velo or 120 katana. The 135 is noticably more annoying to close but not overstuffed, just right at the limit.

Don't try to put it in a container that's right at the limit unless you know you're a neat packer and good at closing your rig with it pretty full.

[mccordia 74]

The Winx120 is a loose/comfortable fit in my V306, compared to the tighter storm. Its not a full size down, but close.

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

[birdynamnam 28]

+1 I am stoked with the Winx 150. Came from the Storm 150 (the lawn dart). Just one jump in a Pilot7 147, but based on that I much prefer the flight caracteristics of the Winx - that is - everything that is btw the opening and landing. Flarepower seems the same, very good. P7 opens hard and the Winx is surprisingly soft in comparison even at terminal speeds. Atair measure canopies a bit different so the Winx 150 is actually 143 sqft as an example, and the Storm and the p7 147 was visually also larger laying them out

[Awdpsi 0]

I would agree its a bit tight but nothing outrageous. I also have 300+ jumps on mine so its probably a little softer than new but even new it packed pretty darn small. I was flying with someone on a similar sized P7 this weekend opening similar alt and they def sunk out a bit faster than I even though I'm slightly higher loaded.

Belt and Suspenders

[lyosha 48]

birdynamnam

Atair measure canopies a bit different so the Winx 150 is actually 143 sqft

Isn't it the other way? Atair canopies are PIA spec larger than their listed sizes?

See: http://www.basetroll.com/files/1513/9462/6813/ospmanual.pdf Page 10

[birdynamnam 28]

According to Atair's manual of the Winx 150 is 143sqft, and as I wrote that is somewhat verified by seing them layed out on the ground, smaller than e.g. a Storm 150

[DHemer 0]

I have as many freefall jumps on mine as WS jumps

It is faster opening than the normal pilot but the only painful openings were from pitching going too fast in the WS and getting flicked .

If I know the next jump is terminal I push the nose in a bit and give the tail and extra roll or 2. For me it is acceptable. Depending what canopy you are used to it may not be, I don't like my canopy to take 800-1000ft to open.