hard openings dome slider?

[Elpnor 5]

Does anyone know if someone still makes dome sliders? I'm having hard openings, and need to slow them down a bit. I've read all the info out there that I could find, including John Leblancs bit, and I don't think it's my packing technique. It's happened when I pack, and a packers pack job as well. I'm kicking around getting a bigger slider, and I've contacted pd about it and am waiting to chat with them, but I thought I'd try herd wisdom as well. It's a sabre 2 230. I'm a bigger guy with a faster fall rate, but not horrific. I double wrap all my stows, and replace the locking stows that show even a little wear. I have 700 jumps, so I don't think it's body position.

[peek 20]

Unlike the original Sabre, the Sabre 2 is noted for opening well if packing is done well, and I have not heard of one needing a larger slider. Line trim will need to be checked first. You might need to send it to PD to test jump.

To all: Does anyone know someone who has installed a larger slider on a Sabre 2?

[billvon 2,690]

>To all: Does anyone know someone who has installed a larger slider on a Sabre 2?

Nope. I went through a lot of funky sliders for a few Sabre 1's (dome slider, pocket slider, bigger slider) but I've never seen one on a Sabre 2 or its relations by other manufacturers (Safire, Pilot.)

[JerryBaumchen 1,249]

Hi Elpnor,

Quote

Does anyone know if someone still makes dome sliders?

The last that I knew, Mark Lancaster ( MEL on here ) still makes them. Give him a try,

Jerry Baumchen

[Westerly 61]

I think it's more complicated than just adding a larger slider. I am not an expert so I could be wrong, but I was speaking to a canopy manufacturer (specificaly, the guy who designs canopies), and he mentioned that there are several factors that affect opening shock, the slider only being one of them. The position of the brakes and even the length each of the individual lines can have an effect. The trim of the canopy can have a large effect. There was a post on here about someone getting slammed under a Safire 3, and they found out just one group of lines was out of trim a bit which was causing the hard openings.

As it was explained to me, while a larger slider does have more surface area to keep the slider up, it also allows the canopy to expand more while snivling so it might not yield a softer opening. It depends on the types of hard openings we're talking about. Is it the type where the opening is hard because the slider is coming down way too soon and you're getting slammed, or the type where the canopy just opens hard while snivling?

If slider size was the only thing that affected opening shock, then hard openings should be completely non-existent on tandem canopies and extremely common on tiny crossbrased canopies, but neither of those statements are necessarily true.

[Elpnor 5]

I don't think it's the trim of the lines. This is a fairly new sabre 2 with maybe 30 jumps. Not all openings are hard, but most are hardish. The reason a dome slider is appealing is it would seem to give more surface area for the air to push up against, but not allow a the lines to spread out more that a significantly larger slider would. I think the main cause is larger body, faster speeds, equal more force on the lines and that just shoots the slider down. I need that little piece of life saving fabric to hang up there for a moment and give me some love.

[DBCOOPER 1]

Just curious as to how fast your falling and what is the wing loading?

Replying to: Re: Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? by billvon

If the plane is unrecoverable then exiting is a very very good idea.

[RMURRAY 1]

actually 'masterrigger1' here. a true expert.

[fluffyduckie 6]

Given that the canopy is that new, and giving you consistent hard openings, you should contact PD. Even though their manufacturing procedures are exceptionally consistent, some times a canopy simply doesn't perform to the correct standard.

There is no reason to turn yourself into a test jumper. Contact the repairs department and explain the issue. If they can't resolve the issue with a repair, they will replace the canopy.

If you ask nicely, they may even help you out with a demo while they are evaluating your main.

PD prides themselves on their customer service. Take advantage of that fact.

"I love when humans fly,"

[JerryBaumchen 1,249]

Hi Rob,

Quote

actually 'masterrigger1' here.

You are correct; my bad.

Here is his contact info:

Mark Lancaster
Skyworks Parachute Service
2222 Buffalo – West Springs HiWay
Buffalo, SC 29321
864-429-8428
[email protected]

Jerry Baumchen

[glh 4]

I have had a brand new canopy sent back to the manufacturer for hard openings that was condemned by them and I was giving another new canopy in exchange.

[BIGUN 1,229]

billvon

>To all: Does anyone know someone who has installed a larger slider on a Sabre 2?

Nope. I went through a lot of funky sliders for a few Sabre 1's (dome slider, pocket slider, bigger slider) but I've never seen one on a Sabre 2 or its relations by other manufacturers (Safire, Pilot.)

I am one. When the Safire 2's first came out; I was having hard openings (189). They said they knew exactly what was wrong and had me measure the slider's length/width/diagonal just to make sure and exchanged my slider for a larger one. Problem Solved.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[Elpnor 5]

I just looked at my viso 2. It says fall rate was 134. Fast, but not ungodly. I was doing a sitfly and had transitioned to belly and tracked away from the guy I was jumping with. I flattened out for maybe 4 seconds before pulling. Wing loading is 1.25

[Westerly 61]

Elpnor

I just looked at my viso 2. It says fall rate was 134. Fast, but not ungodly. I was doing a sitfly and had transitioned to belly and tracked away from the guy I was jumping with. I flattened out for maybe 4 seconds before pulling. Wing loading is 1.25

Here is a video for you. Take from it what you want.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCM-eAekMCg

[betzilla 56]

Quote

There is no reason to turn yourself into a test jumper. Contact the repairs department and explain the issue. If they can't resolve the issue with a repair, they will replace the canopy.

PD prides themselves on their customer service. Take advantage of that fact.

This right here.

[LeeroyJenkins 2]

Westerly

***I just looked at my viso 2. It says fall rate was 134. Fast, but not ungodly. I was doing a sitfly and had transitioned to belly and tracked away from the guy I was jumping with. I flattened out for maybe 4 seconds before pulling. Wing loading is 1.25

Here is a video for you. Take from it what you want.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCM-eAekMCg


Dammmnnnn those Safire openings were slow and crappy.

[finchaos 0]

Can someone comment on the impact of line length and hard openings?

[Elpnor 5]

So PD is sending me a dome slider. I am surprised they make them. I thought it would be more likely that they'd try a larger slider. But first they are going to have a test jumper jump that sized sabre 2 with what my loading would be. Some poor schlub will have to put on like maybe 40 pounds of lead and take it to terminal, and hope it's a nice opening. I hope I don't make him shorter. I'm very impressed with PD on this one, and look forward to softer openings with my one cup brassiere of a slider

[Elpnor 5]

I finally jumped my dome slider today. Huge improvement. Three ff jumps, all 130 mph or so openings, all soft as a high pull. I'm thrilled. Any big guys out there experiencing hard openings might want to look into it. Same sized slider, but more surface area, and it cups the air a bit. Opening seemed about as long, maybe a touch more. The other problem I have is the slider coming down over my toggles on a standard riser. No one makes the pilgrim hats for normal risers. I wished they did. I'm thinking about having a local sew shop make me some.

[gowlerk 2,076]

Quote

No one makes the pilgrim hats for normal risers.

Just use regular Slink hats mounted upside down.

[riggerrob 598]

I have installed PD “pilgrim hats” on wide(1 23/32”) Type 8 risers. It took a bit of wiggling, but they worked fine.

[Elpnor 5]

Really? they don't look like they'd fit, but I'll try it.

[skydiverek 60]

gowlerk

Quote

No one makes the pilgrim hats for normal risers.

Just use regular Slink hats mounted upside down.

I did that. Has worked great for over 1000 jumps !

[flyboy6554 3]

Thanks for the update.....Just borrowed a domed slider from Aerodyne for my Nitron 170 but haven't tried it out yet.

[flyboy6554 3]

OK...made three jumps today on a domed slider from Aerodyne (thanks Marcia!!).....it was sized for a Pilot 188 and just slightly larger in both dimensions than my current slider that came with my Nitron 170....but it was a domed version.....had significantly slower and buttery soft opening subterminal and a somewhat softer than normal opening at terminal....not a scientific study and no velocity data to back it up but think it was a winner for me.