20_kN 0 #1 January 30, 2018 I bought my first rig, a Mirage G4 M6 (yea, big I know). Anyway, I was thinking of going with their semi-stowless bag. I think the M6 still has four locking stows, but the rest of the line is figure-8ed into the pouch. Is it worth it to get the Mirage semi-stowless or go with one of the fully stowless magnetic bags? Or just stick with a standard D bag? I am pretty novice to packing at this point, but overall find that having to double-stow a crap load of stows takes me all day and I find it hard to keep all the lines of equal lengths when I have to double stow a ton of stows (single stowing is much easier for me). As such, I figure a semi stowless will make things a lot easier as I'll have four stows instead of eight or nine. Ideas? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lyosha 48 #2 January 30, 2018 DO NOT get a fully magnetic stowless bag. They cause out of sequence be deployments. Semi stowless is definitely the way to go. Also not all semi stowless bags are equal. The rigging innovations, chutingstar and aerodyne varieties have a built in failure mode because they use magnets. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9XOUTOF10 1 #3 January 30, 2018 I would have to go with iyosha. In my opinion the semi-stowless is the way to go. I would NOT recommend other than mirage manufactured items in your mirage. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,097 #4 January 30, 2018 Mirage main containers have a somewhat unique shape. Their bags are sewn to fit that space correctly. Third party bags are not. This goes for all containers. If you want a bag that fits get it from the maker who has the pattern. Generic bags will often work fine but they are "one shape fits all." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ste87 0 #5 January 30, 2018 Would a UPT U-Stow bag be ok? I ask because I have a Mirage, I'm thinking of going semi-stowless as well and deciding which bag to purchase. UPT bags obviously have slightly different shapes, but should fit well enough. Have heard great things about the UPT bags in all sorts of containers, but never really heard anything about the Mirage ones. Mirage's higher price and sub-par customer service play a role as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,097 #6 January 30, 2018 QuoteWould a UPT U-Stow bag be ok? Probably. But what size would you order? If you want to do that you should find someone with a similar canopy to yours in a Vector and see how it fits. You can do this without disconnecting anything. But the Mirage definitely has a different shape from a Vector. You should also be aware that UPT changed the design of their stowless back recently. If you order one you might not get what you think you will get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ste87 0 #7 January 30, 2018 Fair enough. For me specifically it would be a Sabre 2 135, in a container made for a 150. With the original bag it fits well, with the UPT one not sure. Having spoken to UPT they would like to know the internal measurements of the Mirage bag, so they can determine which U-Stow would be the most appropriate. They also have all of them in stock, while Mirage would have to make it specifically. Anyone has any experience with the Mirage semi-stowless? I'm sure it's great, but never really heard any comment, good or bad, about it while everyone seems to rave about the UPT one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ste87 0 #8 January 30, 2018 gowlerk You should also be aware that UPT changed the design of their stowless back recently. If you order one you might not get what you think you will get. That is a good point actually, made also by UPT themselves over the phone. Not sure about the new design as I haven't really seen one yet. Thoughts? (use it a lot for wingsuiting) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydiverek 61 #9 January 30, 2018 lyosha DO NOT get a fully magnetic stowless bag. They cause out of sequence be deployments. Semi stowless is definitely the way to go. Everybody - watch this in full: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdR47kcMRz8 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,230 #10 January 30, 2018 gowlerkQuoteWould a UPT U-Stow bag be ok? Probably. But what size would you order? If you want to do that you should find someone with a similar canopy to yours in a Vector and see how it fits. You can do this without disconnecting anything. But the Mirage definitely has a different shape from a Vector. You should also be aware that UPT changed the design of their stowless back recently. If you order one you might not get what you think you will get. I have a question for your Rigger's hat... Can anyone put a different bag in a manufacturer's container without violating some manufacturer or master rigger type rule?Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,097 #11 January 30, 2018 QuoteI have a question for your Rigger's hat... Can anyone put a different bag in a manufacturer's container without violating some manufacturer or master rigger type rule? Ha! I don't know and I don't care. Probably some rigger will jump in and say it's against some rule unless a Master Rigger does it. But is is a very common practice. Use common sense and if you are not sure it's compatible ask someone who knows. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,230 #12 January 30, 2018 gowlerkQuoteI have a question for your Rigger's hat... Can anyone put a different bag in a manufacturer's container without violating some manufacturer or master rigger type rule? Ha! I don't know and I don't care. Probably some rigger will jump in and say it's against some rule unless a Master Rigger does it. But is is a very common practice. Use common sense and if you are not sure it's compatible ask someone who knows. Sorry, your profile says you have a Rigger's ticket, so I "assumed." Anyway, I did get a PM saying that its not against the rules.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeeroyJenkins 3 #13 January 30, 2018 They CAN cause them, good bags with more magnets do not. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,097 #14 January 30, 2018 BIGUN***QuoteI have a question for your Rigger's hat... Can anyone put a different bag in a manufacturer's container without violating some manufacturer or master rigger type rule? Ha! I don't know and I don't care. Probably some rigger will jump in and say it's against some rule unless a Master Rigger does it. But is is a very common practice. Use common sense and if you are not sure it's compatible ask someone who knows. Sorry, your profile says you have a Rigger's ticket, so I "assumed." Anyway, I did get a PM saying that its not against the rules. Oh, I am an active rigger. That does not mean I know the implications of all the rules. I'm not a lawyer! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
20_kN 0 #15 January 31, 2018 lyosha DO NOT get a fully magnetic stowless bag. They cause out of sequence be deployments. Semi stowless is definitely the way to go. Also not all semi stowless bags are equal. The rigging innovations, chutingstar and aerodyne varieties have a built in failure mode because they use magnets. Cause out of sequence deployments or are susceptible to them? I get what you are saying though. That was a question I had actually. It seems like a hard yank via the PC with a large canopy in a magnetic bag could cause bag strip. How do the magnets on the semi-stowless bags reduce their safety? They still have standard locking stows. If the flap were to come open in deployment, the bag would still be secured closed by the locking stows until line tension, correct? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lyosha 48 #16 January 31, 2018 "Reduce safety" is not necessarily the proper wording to use, since we're being picky of exact wording. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDpCSxErk_E Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unstable 8 #17 January 31, 2018 QuoteDO NOT get a fully magnetic stowless bag. +1 We see a fair number of fully magnetic bags around here, many of which are taken out of service. Suffice it to say there is a reason manufacturers still keep at least 2 locking stows on their designs.=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AlexanderA 1 #18 January 31, 2018 I really like the Mirage semi stowless. Mirages and especially G4s have a sort of tear drop shape and a sort of weird different bag shape. A bag from another manufacturer would not fit that well. Link to few pictures of my mirage and semi stowless bag. https://photos.app.goo.gl/3bve4S8YMfcGK6JP2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
20_kN 0 #19 February 1, 2018 lyosha"Reduce safety" is not necessarily the proper wording to use, since we're being picky of exact wording. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDpCSxErk_EThat did not look like a semi-stowless bag. It looked like a full mag bag completely stowless. My question was about magnets on the semi-stowless bags since Lyosha said that the semi-stowless bags with magnetic cover flaps have built in failure modes. I am wondering how magnets vs tuck tabs on the stow cover/ flap has a built-in failure mode. I ended up ordering the Mirage since it's made for my rig, it's just more curiosity at this point. There are some people at my DZ that have semi-stowless bags with the magnetic flaps. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lyosha 48 #20 February 1, 2018 That was the rigging innovations semi stowless bag... The failure mode is in the video. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unstable 8 #21 February 1, 2018 Quote That was the rigging innovations semi stowless bag... Shooting from memory here, but doesn't he Rigging Innovations Semi-stowless bag have the line stow pocket sewn closed on the bottom and both side, similar to a reserve freebag? A gentleman with a Curve had a bag with that configuration. Basically took the same amount of time to stow the remaining lines as packing a reserve. =========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fall0ut 3 #22 February 1, 2018 I put more than 400 jumps on my Mirage semi-stowless bag so far. No problems whatsoever and always good openings. I do recommend it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
albashian 0 #23 February 1, 2018 The design of this fully magnetic deployment bag nearly eliminates any potential for an out-of-sequence deployment. Has been jumped in nearly every discipline including wingsuiting and subterminal with no issues. Packs fast.....packs simple....works simple. Unmatched quality. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
timski 80 #24 February 2, 2018 20_kN I bought my first rig, a Mirage G4 M6 (yea, big I know). Anyway, I was thinking of going with their semi-stowless bag. I think the M6 still has four locking stows, but the rest of the line is figure-8ed into the pouch. Is it worth it to get the Mirage semi-stowless or go with one of the fully stowless magnetic bags? Or just stick with a standard D bag? I am pretty novice to packing at this point, but overall find that having to double-stow a crap load of stows takes me all day and I find it hard to keep all the lines of equal lengths when I have to double stow a ton of stows (single stowing is much easier for me). As such, I figure a semi stowless will make things a lot easier as I'll have four stows instead of eight or nine. Ideas? My .02 for what is it worth. Someone with your experience or lack there of should be focusing on getting better packing with ALL the stows, and yes, DOUBLE stow them all. once you've got a firm grasp of packing consistently then maybe perhaps take the game to the next level... And by no means am I any type of packing wizard or sky god. I only have 475 jumps with almost half of them with a WS. Flying the dress kind of makes you refine your packing game! Among other aspects of flight. Happy Packing and remember, it's not a race Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,097 #25 February 2, 2018 Sigh...d-bag wars. Must be winter. Bored skydivers need something to argue about. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
