Nazi's are back!

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

normiss

While it has nothing to do with the discussion of violent racism, exactly what "left wing violence" are you referring to?

Well, when all those women marched all over the country back in January, it sure got violent.

And don't forget all the violence at the Clinton campaign events, where Obama called out for the crowd to attack a man who shouted out from the crowd.

Oh...

Wait a minute...

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[kallend 1,623]

airdvr

***No one could have predicted that white supremacists marching into a city and carrying torches could possibly have led to violence. Everyone is shocked.

You mean like the left wing radicals after the election? Who knew?

Did you learn that two wrongs make a right from your mother?

Mine taught me that two wrongs do NOT make a right.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[gowlerk 1,910]

Quote

Did you learn that two wrongs make a right from your mother?

Mine taught me that two wrongs do NOT make a right.

That's left wing radical thinking John. A good conservative knows the lesson of the Bible. "Do unto others before they do unto you".

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

Hi airdvr,

Quote

LWR were pretty violent after the election.

That is like stealing a loaf of bread and saying that it is equivalent to the Brink's robbery.

Sure, both are illegal; however, the scale difference is substantial.

BTW, who died as a result of the LWR demos?

Jerry Baumchen

Jerry Baumchen

[airdvr 197]

And this is why the SC needs to be renamed Speaker's Corner for Liberals. It's plain to see what happens to a forum when the mods are biased.

If you can't find liberal violent protests after the election you aren't looking very hard. Part of the problem is you guys want to make it seem that the conservatives are violent and the liberals are all peace loving angels. You paint with a broad brush when it works in your favor.

One nutjob who drives his car into protesters does not represent every conservative, or even every NeoNatzi.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

Hi airdvr,

Quote

If you can't find liberal violent protests after the election you aren't looking very hard.

Do you have a problem reading? My question was and is:

"BTW, who died as a result of the LWR demos?"

Jerry Baumchen

[airdvr 197]

JerryBaumchen

Hi airdvr,

Quote

If you can't find liberal violent protests after the election you aren't looking very hard.

Do you have a problem reading? My question was and is:

"BTW, who died as a result of the LWR demos?"

Jerry Baumchen

You're right Jerry. I do have a problem reading. Thanks for pointing it out.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

I have no problem with conservatives, I am one in many ways. I voted "R" for most of my life. I gave up on them when they stopped leading and started acting like 5 year olds throwing a temper tantrum.

But I see no "conservatism" in what we have today.

Trump is a wannabe demagogue.

He is, by any rational measure, utterly incompetent.

He has embraced and been embraced by hateful, bigoted, racist groups.
And there is nothing defensible about being a member of the KKK or being a "NeoNazi." Funny how many of them hide their faces under hoods.

To imply that there is any equivalency between the 'liberal' anti-Trump protests (some of which had some violence and damage) and what happened in the past couple of days is to ignore reality.


I don't think that all Trump supporters are that way, but to continue to support him, and defend him in the face of the information that is coming to light (and it gets worse and worse every day) is foolish.

To ignore the truth of what is coming out (and no, it's not all "fake news) is denial, pure and simple.

Yet so many do this.

And, just out of curiosity, how does the political leanings of the mods dictate what the forum does?

Both Quade and Billvon lean liberal. Yet the posts that disagree with them stay up. PAs are warned on both sides of the spectrum. It may seem like the conservatives get punished more often, but it seems to me like they are the ones being the most offensive (not including the nonsensical trolling of a couple of them).

Perhaps you feel outnumbered because your position has become less and less defensible and is being abandoned by many.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[billvon 2,396]

>And this is why the SC needs to be renamed Speaker's Corner for Liberals.

Because most conservatives are too ashamed of Trump to try defending him?

During the Obama presidency this forum could have been named "Speakers Corner for Conservatives" since more than half the posts were anti-Obama; a little less than half were posts defending him. But Obama was a much more defensible president - with Trump, most of the regulars have simply given up. The only two conservative posters here who try to do so are RushMC and RonD; the rest are (perhaps wisely) not trying to defend what the right wing (both Trump and the GOP) is doing nowadays.

[Phil1111 910]

airdvr

...
One nutjob who drives his car into protesters does not represent every conservative, or even every NeoNatzi.

So there are subtle "Neonatzi"s who chant

"Friday’s protesters shouted anti-Semitic and Nazi-associated slogans, including "blood and soil”: a phrase that references the German ideology of Blut und Boden, or the idea that a person is defined by his or her relationship to ethnic ancestry (blood) and the land they cultivate (soil).

Protesters also shouted “Jews will not replace us” (a more explicitly anti-Semitic take on “you will not replace us,” a white-supremacist alt-right slogan that arose in response to actor Shia LaBoeuf’s anti-Trump performance art piece “He Will Not Divide Us”).

Attendees at the rally also wore Nazi paraphernalia, carried flags with swastikas alongside Confederate flags, and wore shirts with quotations by Adolf Hitler. "
https://www.vox.com/2017/8/12/16138352/this-weekends-charlottesville-rally-shows-how-close-good-old-boys-and-nazis-really-are

[Phil1111 910]

billvon

>And this is why the SC needs to be renamed Speaker's Corner for Liberals.

Because most conservatives are too ashamed of Trump to try defending him?

During the Obama presidency this forum could have been named "Speakers Corner for Conservatives" since more than half the posts were anti-Obama; a little less than half were posts defending him. But Obama was a much more defensible president - with Trump, most of the regulars have simply given up. The only two conservative posters here who try to do so are RushMC and RonD; the rest are (perhaps wisely) not trying to defend what the right wing (both Trump and the GOP) is doing nowadays.

Less and less elected republicans are defending trump.

[winsor 186]

quade

******No one could have predicted that white supremacists marching into a city and carrying torches could possibly have led to violence. Everyone is shocked.

Reverse the races and the same can be said.

Black Lives Matter is every bit as racist as is the Klan, and both are odious. Perhaps the differing opinions on the matter are reflective of the quote falsely attributed to Churchill to the effect that one's own farts smell the sweetest.

You create a false equivalency between people pleading for the end of violence against them and people who would perform the acts of violence. That sort of thing only serves to enable these Nazi/Klan fucks.

Shame on you. Shame on Trump.

Let me be clear here, ANYONE who attempts to defend the position of the Nazis and Klan needs to re-examine their entire lives.

I call bullshit.

The mass majority of violence against blacks is committed by blacks. A disproportionate amount of violence against whites is committed by blacks. A significant number of cases where blacks came to grief at the hands of the police have involved black officers. By and large, the typical cause celebre espoused by BLM was pushing his luck in the first place.

Black Lives Matter is hardly a fair and balanced organization seeking peace and justice. They are a racist organization who bitch about violent people coming to a well deserved end if and only if they are black. Fuck them and anyone who supports them.

The Klan and any variation of Nazi affiliates are beneath contempt, and it is not worth the bandwidth to get into the details.

My point is that anyone who sees a dime's worth of difference between a White Power march and a Black Power march, one way or another, is a racist pure and simple.


BSBD,

Winsor

[winsor 186]

billvon

>You mean like the left wing radicals after the election? Who knew?

Thank you for so perfectly demonstrating my point.

Which left wing protesters murdered right wing protesters again? I forget.

Left wing protesters kill cops.

[winsor 186]

kallend

******No one could have predicted that white supremacists marching into a city and carrying torches could possibly have led to violence. Everyone is shocked.

You mean like the left wing radicals after the election? Who knew?

Did you learn that two wrongs make a right from your mother?

Mine taught me that two wrongs do NOT make a right.

Three lefts do.

[billvon 2,396]

>Black Lives Matter is hardly a fair and balanced organization seeking peace and justice.

Nor is the NRA, or the ACLU, or USPA, or Christianity, or IAVA, or or the Marines, or Exxon, or FOX News. Which is fine; they all have goals other than (or more specific than) "peace and justice."

> They are a racist organization who bitch about violent people coming to a well
>deserved end if and only if they are black.

Yep. And USPA bitches about death-wish thrillseekers coming to their inevitable end if and only if they are skydivers. And the NRA bitches about violent thugs justly losing their property if and only if that property is a gun.

Every group has its cause.

>Fuck them and anyone who supports them.

OK. I support their goal; I think that black lives matter as much as anyone's. Sorry that you don't support that, and sorry that will no longer be talking to me. The skydives were fun.

[winsor 186]

billvon

... OK. I support their goal; I think that black lives matter as much as anyone's. ...

If their goal was that black lives matter as much as anyone's, fine. That is not, however, the case - their point is clearly that black lives matter BECAUSE they're black, which is racist anyway you cut it.

To put it mildly I am not a supporter of the marchers in Charlottesville, but I also find the other end of the spectrum to be equally contemptible.

"Reverse discrimination" is discrimination, and its adherents use rationalization no more compelling than those they oppose. I'm underwhelmed.

[billvon 2,396]

>That is not, however, the case - their point is clearly that black lives matter
>BECAUSE they're black, which is racist anyway you cut it.

That is to counteract the meme that blacks lives are NOT worth as much because they are black. Look at the constant references to "well, look at all the black on black violence; it's not really a civil rights problem" implying that as long as it's just "them" getting killed by "them" it's not as serious a problem.

Do you think "blue lives matter" implies that only police lives matter, and they are only saying that they matter BECAUSE they are police?

>"Reverse discrimination" is discrimination, and its adherents use rationalization no
>more compelling than those they oppose.

I agree. And if the BLM movement came out with a "black lives matter more than white lives" I would agree with your stance.

But saying black lives matter does not mean white lives don't. Saying blue lives matter does not mean that civilian lives don't. Saying gays deserve the same right to marry as straight people does not mean that they are "destroying the sanctity of marriage." Saying women should have the right to vote does not mean that men should not have that right. Saying Muslims should have the same right to practice their religion as Christians does not mean take away rights from Christians. Saying blacks should be able to marry whites does not mean that whites lose their right to marry who they choose.

However, in most of the above, it does take away PRIVILEGE. And to some people (like the white-supremacist protesters in Virginia) that is intolerable. To use your turn of phrase, fuck that.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

winsor

***

... OK. I support their goal; I think that black lives matter as much as anyone's. ...

If their goal was that black lives matter as much as anyone's, fine. That is not, however, the case - their point is clearly that black lives matter BECAUSE they're black, which is racist anyway you cut it...



Seriously?

Do you understand how little black lives seem to matter to some people?

The KKK and NeoNazis for sure. Black lives matter very little to them.

But how about the "Main Stream Media"? There are hundreds of murders of black people every day. Yet unless it's a celebrity, there's no press. Yet when a white person (especially a young white woman) is killed, it goes national.

How about the cops? When a black suspect is killed by the cops, a quick investigation and finding of "justifiable" is typical. Yet when a black man kills a cop, he usually doesn't survive being taken into custody. In the link you posted above about the Dallas shootings, they didn't even really try. They blew up the suspect with a grenade attached to a very expensive bomb squad remotely operated "robot".

It's not that BLM wants black live to matter more than other people's, it's that they want them to matter somewhere near as much as other lives.

And this really isn't new. Black people have been getting the short end of the stick for a long, long time. It used to be pretty common for lynchings to be public, announced well ahead of time, and supported (tacit or active) by both the cops and municipal officials.

Bessie Smith The great Billie Holliday caused a huge controversy with her song "Strange Fruit". Most of that controversy was the fact that she had the gall to publicly state what everyone knew was happening. To 'shine the light' on it, so to speak.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[jakee 1,254]

airdvr

And this is why the SC needs to be renamed Speaker's Corner for Liberals. It's plain to see what happens to a forum when the mods are biased.

And this is the problem with the polarised nature of today's politics where everything is either left or right.

I mean, we're talking about white power fundamentalists and Nazis - honest to god swastika wearing Nazis - and your response is 'well some liberals are bad too!' What? How do you manage to make this an us vs them thing? It comes across like you're claiming them for your side. These guys aren't even (or shouldn't be) part of the conservative vs liberal spectrum. They're floating off on their own in another moral and political dimension entirely. But you feel the need to create an equivalence with liberals?

I honestly don't even know where your thought process is right now...

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[billvon 2,396]

Talk about emboldening white supremacists . .

Daily Stormer: "No condemnation at all,. When asked to condemn, [Trump] just walked out of the room. Really, really good. God bless him.”

Daily Stormer: "Trump comments were good. He didn’t attack us. He just said the nation should come together. Nothing specific against us. He said that we need to study why people are so angry, and implied that there was hate … on both sides! So he implied the antifa are haters. There was virtually no counter-signaling of us at all. He said he loves us all."

David Duke, former KKK head - "I would recommend you take a good look in the mirror & remember it was White Americans who put you in the presidency, not radical leftists."

Daily Stormer: "And to everyone, know this: we are now at war. And we are not going to back down. … We are going to go bigger than Charlottesville. We are going to go huge. We are going to take over the country. … We learned a lot today. And we are going to remember what we learned. This has only just begun.”

More violence and murder! From Trump's favorite groups! Yay.

[winsor 186]

billvon

>That is not, however, the case - their point is clearly that black lives matter
>BECAUSE they're black, which is racist anyway you cut it.

That is to counteract the meme that blacks lives are NOT worth as much because they are black. Look at the constant references to "well, look at all the black on black violence; it's not really a civil rights problem" implying that as long as it's just "them" getting killed by "them" it's not as serious a problem.

Do you think "blue lives matter" implies that only police lives matter, and they are only saying that they matter BECAUSE they are police?

>"Reverse discrimination" is discrimination, and its adherents use rationalization no
>more compelling than those they oppose.

I agree. And if the BLM movement came out with a "black lives matter more than white lives" I would agree with your stance.

But saying black lives matter does not mean white lives don't. Saying blue lives matter does not mean that civilian lives don't. Saying gays deserve the same right to marry as straight people does not mean that they are "destroying the sanctity of marriage." Saying women should have the right to vote does not mean that men should not have that right. Saying Muslims should have the same right to practice their religion as Christians does not mean take away rights from Christians. Saying blacks should be able to marry whites does not mean that whites lose their right to marry who they choose.

However, in most of the above, it does take away PRIVILEGE. And to some people (like the white-supremacist protesters in Virginia) that is intolerable. To use your turn of phrase, fuck that.

We are in wholehearted agreement there.

Perhaps the founders of the movement misstated themselves in the interviews I read, and perhaps I read too much into the roars of dissent when what's her name said "all lives matter!"

I am a staunch advocate of a strict meritocracy, where one's sex and/or ethnicity has zero influence per se regarding hiring, home ownership, college admission and so forth.

I suppose there are some exceptions; for example I worked in a department that was heavily lesbian. The rationale of the person in charge was simple, his preferred employees would go in the field for months at a time without objection, they did not run off to get married and have babies, guys did not hit on them at client sites, their private lives NEVER came up, and the quality of their work was superb. I did not mind working for them on an assignment since I wanted to fly around and skydive on my time off and they would stick around on weekends and work.

In any event, too much has been attributed to Black Lives Matter demanding special treatment for me to be sanguine about it. The last time people like me got Special Treatment it did not turn out well.


BSBD,

Winsor

[Phil1111 910]

winsor

***

... OK. I support their goal; I think that black lives matter as much as anyone's. ...

If their goal was that black lives matter as much as anyone's, fine. That is not, however, the case - their point is clearly that black lives matter BECAUSE they're black, which is racist anyway you cut it.

To put it mildly I am not a supporter of the marchers in Charlottesville, but I also find the other end of the spectrum to be equally contemptible.

"Reverse discrimination" is discrimination, and its adherents use rationalization no more compelling than those they oppose. I'm underwhelmed.

You have difficulties with nuance and circumstance where multiple competing interests, objectives, combine for a common purpose.

Introspection for true self motivations may help you ascertain the most important factors biasing your views.

Good luck.

[gowlerk 1,910]

Quote

Bessie Smith caused a huge controversy with her song "Strange Fruit".

Please, the great Billie Holiday. Words and music by Abel Meeropol.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[ryoder 1,382]

Trae Crowder says it eloquently:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhYiJ4z_v_c

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

gowlerk

Quote

Bessie Smith caused a huge controversy with her song "Strange Fruit".

Please, the great Billie Holiday. Words and music by Abel Meeropol.

Damnit, damnit, damnit.

I even looked it up, considering posting the lyrics.

Duh-huh.

Thanks for pointing out the error in time for me to fix it.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo