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piisfish

Amarillo, TX, hostages taken in a Walmart

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UPDATE: shooter is believed to have taken hostages at a Walmart in Amarillo, Texas, police responding


Ok so this is Texas, in a Walmart. Where are the gun owners to save the situation ?

Edited to add : I hope that no innocents will be hurt and that the perp will be taken out.
scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

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normiss

Walmart is on private land.



What difference does that make?

BL's don't M on private property?
I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

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normiss

I'm just unsure how the BLM organization could in anyway be involved in this at all.



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Suspect is black male, police call it 'workplace violence'



And now he is dead.
I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

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piisfish

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UPDATE: shooter is believed to have taken hostages at a Walmart in Amarillo, Texas, police responding


Ok so this is Texas, in a Walmart. Where are the gun owners to save the situation ?

Edited to add : I hope that no innocents will be hurt and that the perp will be taken out.



Walmart allows customers to carry in their stores wherever state and local laws allow. And this was in Texas.

So your question is very valid.

How come it took a SWAT team to deal with the situation, rather than a manly "good guy with a gun" customer. Could Wayne Lapierre be wrong?
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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>How come it took a SWAT team to deal with the situation, rather than a manly "good
>guy with a gun" customer.

Indeed - we have heard time and time again that you can't afford to wait for the police; they are too far away, take too long etc.

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billvon

>How come it took a SWAT team to deal with the situation, rather than a manly "good
>guy with a gun" customer.

Indeed - we have heard time and time again that you can't afford to wait for the police; they are too far away, take too long etc.



Everything is situational.
I suppose it is also a judgement call.
If he was threatening me or mine - I would respond accordingly.

My willingness to carry doesn't guarantee your protection, or mine for that matter, it gives me the advantage though.
I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

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kallend

***

Quote

UPDATE: shooter is believed to have taken hostages at a Walmart in Amarillo, Texas, police responding


Ok so this is Texas, in a Walmart. Where are the gun owners to save the situation ?

Edited to add : I hope that no innocents will be hurt and that the perp will be taken out.


Walmart allows customers to carry in their stores wherever state and local laws allow. And this was in Texas.

So your question is very valid.

How come it took a SWAT team to deal with the situation, rather than a manly "good guy with a gun" customer. Could Wayne Lapierre be wrong?

Do you have video of the incident with expert analysis?

No one but the shooter was killed, so you have to wonder if he was actively menacing customers, or if he came in and ordered everyone down to the ground, but didn't pose I direct threat as the incident unfolded.

I have a carry permit, I am not SWAT. Unless you point a gun directly at me and my family, or you are actively shooting, I am going to comply and not escalate.

The claim isn't that good guys with guns will stop all threats, the claim is that having good guys with guns is better than having all unarmed helpless victims.

This incident doesn't disprove this argument. If you assume there were people carrying concealed it does help support the narrative that most gun owners can read a situation, and act responsibly. The proof is right there in the body count, 1 dead only, the aggressor.

Just admit it, you are disappointed the assumed gun carrying individuals there didn't over react and shoot up the place and hurt someone other than the shooter.

Sorry for your loss. :P
"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

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No one but the shooter was killed, so you have to wonder if he was actively menacing customers, or if he came in and ordered everyone down to the ground, but didn't pose I direct threat as the incident unfolded.



I thought they only picked gun-free zones?

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SkyDekker

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No one but the shooter was killed, so you have to wonder if he was actively menacing customers, or if he came in and ordered everyone down to the ground, but didn't pose I direct threat as the incident unfolded.



I thought they only picked gun-free zones?



Who is "they"?

This was described as work place violence. People normally commit workplace violence at places that are their current or previous workplace. That is why the phrase "work place" is used in conjunction with the word "violence" to describe such events. Work places are normally the location or business where some one works or has worked.

If this shooter excluded his workplace because it wasn't a gun free zone, and selected another persons workplace that was, it wouldn't exactly be workplace violence anymore, would it?
"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

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SkyDekker

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That is why the phrase "work place" is used in conjunction with the word "violence" to describe such events.



Careful now.....depending on the gun free workplace and the religion of the shooter, workplace violence quickly becomes terrorism.



I suppose the shootings in San Bernardino were just workplace violence. The guy was an employee and all.

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winsor

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That is why the phrase "work place" is used in conjunction with the word "violence" to describe such events.



Careful now.....depending on the gun free workplace and the religion of the shooter, workplace violence quickly becomes terrorism.



I suppose the shootings in San Bernardino were just workplace violence. The guy was an employee and all.

All buses are automobiles, but all automobiles are not buses.

This might be correct, if he was pissed about someone stealing his red stapler, and being put in a basement broom closet, and was watching too much Office Space.

Instead he was consuming extremist jihadi propaganda on the internet, and he sympathized with ISIS, instead of Ron Livingston.

I am pretty sure that most of us could independently come up with the conclusion that was terrorism, and not workplace violence.
"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

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DougH

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Quote

That is why the phrase "work place" is used in conjunction with the word "violence" to describe such events.



Careful now.....depending on the gun free workplace and the religion of the shooter, workplace violence quickly becomes terrorism.



I suppose the shootings in San Bernardino were just workplace violence. The guy was an employee and all.

All buses are automobiles, but all automobiles are not buses.

This might be correct, if he was pissed about someone stealing his red stapler, and being put in a basement broom closet, and was watching too much Office Space.

Instead he was consuming extremist jihadi propaganda on the internet, and he sympathized with ISIS, instead of Ron Livingston.

I am pretty sure that most of us could independently come up with the conclusion that was terrorism, and not workplace violence.

REGARDLESS, Texas Walmarts are NOT "gun free zones". And the gun-o-philes have been telling us repeatedly that bad guys with guns pick gun free zones. So why were the "good guys with guns" not in evidence when the sh1t hit the fan? Maybe the "good guy with a gun" is a mythical creature when faced with a bad guy.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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kallend


REGARDLESS, Texas Walmarts are NOT "gun free zones". And the gun-o-philes have been telling us repeatedly that bad guys with guns pick gun free zones. So why were the "good guys with guns" not in evidence when the sh1t hit the fan? Maybe the "good guy with a gun" is a mythical creature when faced with a bad guy.



Your point makes zero sense.

The situation ended perfectly, unless you count the death of the aggressor to be a huge loss. No innocent lives lost.

You can't prove that there were good guys with guns there in the first place. You can't prove that there was a direct situation that the good guys with guns needed to respond to.

If I accept your "fact" that there were good guys with gun there, then we can all stop and recognize the fact that your alleged good guys with guns didn't make the situation worse, by turning it in to a wild west shoot out resulting in loss of innocent lives. That is a huge claim of the "gun-o-phobe" curl in a ball and pray to spaghetti monster crowd.

The point of a concealed weapon is to be able to respond to imminent threats to the safety of yourself, your family, and others; WHEN A RESPONSE WOULD BE NECESSARY AND APPROPRIATE! Responsible gun owners exercise restraint. The point isn't that they can make every situation better, the point is that they can do more to try to make a situation better when there are no other options than a bunch of helpless people with no ability to respond other than retreat or hide.

I will say it again, I am very sorry for your loss Kallend.

I am sorry that gun owners didn't kill a bunch of innocent people, I know this lost opportunity to further your agenda must be crushing.

I am sorry that this wasn't some right wing nut job that was able to kill a bunch of people, it must be a real shame to know this was just workplace violence, how sad.
"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

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>The situation ended perfectly, unless you count the death of the aggressor to be a
>huge loss. No innocent lives lost.

Agreed. The system worked. Police responded, ended the situation and rescued the hostages.

>. . .turning it in to a wild west shoot out resulting in loss of innocent lives. That is
>a huge claim of the "gun-o-phobe" curl in a ball and pray to spaghetti monster crowd.

Your two extremes are equally absurd.

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DougH

***
REGARDLESS, Texas Walmarts are NOT "gun free zones". And the gun-o-philes have been telling us repeatedly that bad guys with guns pick gun free zones. So why were the "good guys with guns" not in evidence when the sh1t hit the fan? Maybe the "good guy with a gun" is a mythical creature when faced with a bad guy.



Your point makes zero sense.



Your response simply illustrates the truth of what I wrote.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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DougH

***
REGARDLESS, Texas Walmarts are NOT "gun free zones". And the gun-o-philes have been telling us repeatedly that bad guys with guns pick gun free zones. So why were the "good guys with guns" not in evidence when the sh1t hit the fan? Maybe the "good guy with a gun" is a mythical creature when faced with a bad guy.



Your point makes zero sense.

The situation ended perfectly, unless you count the death of the aggressor to be a huge loss. No innocent lives lost.

You can't prove that there were good guys with guns there in the first place. You can't prove that there was a direct situation that the good guys with guns needed to respond to.

If I accept your "fact" that there were good guys with gun there, then we can all stop and recognize the fact that your alleged good guys with guns didn't make the situation worse, by turning it in to a wild west shoot out resulting in loss of innocent lives. That is a huge claim of the "gun-o-phobe" curl in a ball and pray to spaghetti monster crowd.

The point of a concealed weapon is to be able to respond to imminent threats to the safety of yourself, your family, and others; WHEN A RESPONSE WOULD BE NECESSARY AND APPROPRIATE! Responsible gun owners exercise restraint. The point isn't that they can make every situation better, the point is that they can do more to try to make a situation better when there are no other options than a bunch of helpless people with no ability to respond other than retreat or hide.

I will say it again, I am very sorry for your loss Kallend.

I am sorry that gun owners didn't kill a bunch of innocent people, I know this lost opportunity to further your agenda must be crushing.

I am sorry that this wasn't some right wing nut job that was able to kill a bunch of people, it must be a real shame to know this was just workplace violence, how sad.

He really REALLY wanted a modern version of the OK Corral.[:/]
I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

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