millertime24 8 #551 October 4, 2017 I guarantee you I can physically operate a vehicle with or without a license.Muff #5048 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #552 October 4, 2017 millertime24No. You don't "need" a license to drive a truck. Also, if I get caught using a gun inappropriately or while under the influence of alcohol or drugs I will also go to jail. But, you don't "have" to register a truck to use it. I have a friend with a race car. Pretty damn sure it isn't registered. I have 2 unregistered vehicles. Wanna take a stab as to how many times I've been pulled over while driving either one on my land? Since we are into false equivalence fallacies in a bigly way here, how about requiring registration and licensing to use a gun and ammo anywhere except on your own (or a friend's) land - just like your truck.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,397 #553 October 4, 2017 >I guarantee you I can physically operate a vehicle with or without a license. I'm sure you can - for at least a little while. People drive without licenses all the time. At least until they get caught. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pterodactyl1986 0 #554 October 5, 2017 billvon >I guarantee you I can physically operate a vehicle with or without a license. I'm sure you can - for at least a little while. People drive without licenses all the time. At least until they get caught. I've been stalking this thread, and won't comment on the crazyness. however regarding your comment, I remember watching the TV show cops, they pulled over this older gentleman that had been driving for 40 years with no license and had never been pulled over, I couldn't believe it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 1,911 #555 October 5, 2017 pterodactyl1986 ***>I guarantee you I can physically operate a vehicle with or without a license. I'm sure you can - for at least a little while. People drive without licenses all the time. At least until they get caught. I've been stalking this thread, and won't comment on the crazyness. however regarding your comment, I remember watching the TV show cops, they pulled over this older gentleman that had been driving for 40 years with no license and had never been pulled over, I couldn't believe it He definitely was a Caucasian.Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 135 #556 October 5, 2017 How many people are killed or maimed by trucks accidentally driven by toddlers? How many people maimed or killed by adults intentionally driving a truck ? How many suicides by truck ? Please compare these figures with the same kind of killings by guns.scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMK 3 #557 October 5, 2017 He’d prefer not; the most juvenile and childish form of debate is to simply to start talking about “something else”. That’s why this thread is now filled with suicide and truck references. I’d invite them (as before) to subtract out all shootings that are suicide. The resultant numbers still leave the US with occurrences more comparable to a war zone than a G20 nation."Pain is the best instructor, but no one wants to attend his classes" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ronhend 0 #558 October 5, 2017 They went to the gun shop{Guitars and Guns} and interviewed the guy that sold him several of his guns. The guns were all sold to him legally. This interview was on national television. RonATP B-727 B767-757 CFI-II Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 18 #559 October 5, 2017 this person nails it For your enlightenment. https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/i-used-to-think-gun-control-was-the-answer-my-research-told-me-otherwise/2017/10/03/d33edca6-a851-11e7-92d1-58c702d2d975_story.html?utm_term=.c674ea6b8515 QuoteI researched the strictly tightened gun laws in Britain and Australia and concluded that they didn’t prove much about what America’s policy should be. Neither nation experienced drops in mass shootings or other gun related-crime that could be attributed to their buybacks and bans. Mass shootings were too rare in Australia for their absence after the buyback program to be clear evidence of progress. And in both Australia and Britain, the gun restrictions had an ambiguous effect on other gun-related crimes or deaths."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 18 #560 October 5, 2017 piisfishHow many people are killed or maimed by trucks accidentally driven by toddlers? How many people maimed or killed by adults intentionally driving a truck ? How many suicides by truck ? Please compare these figures with the same kind of killings by guns. Look, During the 8 years when Obama was president (this is not linked to him, only the time line) there were nearly the same number of people killed in mass shootings in France when compared the US. France has much stricter gun control and is what, 1/5 the population? Gun controll does not work. http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/12/03/facts-shoot-holes-in-obamas-claim-that-us-is-only-host-to-mass-killings.html"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 18 #561 October 5, 2017 kallend******It's a fantastic comparison and for the first time ever, I actually appreciate his comments. After all, ALL of those trucks require training and licensing, registration, and insurance. Their use and possession are heavily regulated. Even the contents of the trucks are documented and regulated! Again, it's a fantastic comparison. It's nice to see some progress in the gun control discussion with some from the far right for once. of course the truck would be stolen. Also Two things Guns are heavily regulated Two, trucks are not constitutionally protected Sad how your attempt falls flat........ The Constitution doesn't prevent: universal background checks on ALL sales, bans on certain types of weapons, registration, bans on certain types of ammo, bans on carrying in certain locations, bans on the mentally ill or convicted criminals from owning/using guns, etc. See, for example, the SCOTUS ruling in Heller. John Which one of your so called solutions, the ones you list here, would have stopped the shooting this weekend?"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 18 #562 October 5, 2017 gowlerk ******>I guarantee you I can physically operate a vehicle with or without a license. I'm sure you can - for at least a little while. People drive without licenses all the time. At least until they get caught. I've been stalking this thread, and won't comment on the crazyness. however regarding your comment, I remember watching the TV show cops, they pulled over this older gentleman that had been driving for 40 years with no license and had never been pulled over, I couldn't believe it He definitely was a Caucasian. Maybe, (and I will disregard the racist overtone of you post for now) but more than likely his equipment was kept in good repair and he did not drive in places known for drugs late at night (just to name a few things)"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #563 October 5, 2017 Don’t tell me this is about protecting the Second Amendment when you won’t stand up for the First Amendment. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #564 October 5, 2017 rushmc*********It's a fantastic comparison and for the first time ever, I actually appreciate his comments. After all, ALL of those trucks require training and licensing, registration, and insurance. Their use and possession are heavily regulated. Even the contents of the trucks are documented and regulated! Again, it's a fantastic comparison. It's nice to see some progress in the gun control discussion with some from the far right for once. of course the truck would be stolen. Also Two things Guns are heavily regulated Two, trucks are not constitutionally protected Sad how your attempt falls flat........ The Constitution doesn't prevent: universal background checks on ALL sales, bans on certain types of weapons, registration, bans on certain types of ammo, bans on carrying in certain locations, bans on the mentally ill or convicted criminals from owning/using guns, etc. See, for example, the SCOTUS ruling in Heller. John Which one of your so called solutions, the ones you list here, would have stopped the shooting this weekend? Ignoring your false dichotomy logical fallacy: it would be impossible to kill 58 and injure 500 people with a single shot muzzle loader (the type known to the authors of the Constitution) before being stopped. And there are some 9,000+ gun murders every year, not just these 58.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
melch 0 #565 October 5, 2017 rushmcthis person nails it For your enlightenment. https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/i-used-to-think-gun-control-was-the-answer-my-research-told-me-otherwise/2017/10/03/d33edca6-a851-11e7-92d1-58c702d2d975_story.html?utm_term=.c674ea6b8515 QuoteI researched the strictly tightened gun laws in Britain and Australia and concluded that they didn’t prove much about what America’s policy should be. Neither nation experienced drops in mass shootings or other gun related-crime that could be attributed to their buybacks and bans. Mass shootings were too rare in Australia for their absence after the buyback program to be clear evidence of progress. And in both Australia and Britain, the gun restrictions had an ambiguous effect on other gun-related crimes or deaths. Prior to Port Arthur, 13 mass shootings. After the 1996 legislation, 0 mass shootings. I'm not sure how much clearer one needs that to be as evidence of progress. You don't have to be a statistician to know that 0 is less than 13. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMK 3 #566 October 5, 2017 melch Prior to Port Arthur, 13 mass shootings. After the 1996 legislation, 0 mass shootings. I'm not sure how much clearer one needs that to be as evidence of progress. You don't have to be a statistician to know that 0 is less than 13. You've seen RushMC's writing and logic; are you expecting his math skills to be any different?"Pain is the best instructor, but no one wants to attend his classes" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lawndarter 3 #567 October 5, 2017 rushmc John Which one of your so called solutions, the ones you list here, would have stopped the shooting this weekend? The point I think is more that with anything else - trucks running people down, bombings, whatever, we start looking for ways to mitigate the risk of further attacks of the same or similar nature, while with guns, it immediately becomes "don't politicize this" and other nonsense to avoid discussing anything useful. I am still staggered that Americans are told to accept rampant gun violence as "the price of freedom" while the idea of universal healthcare is somehow just inconceivable. I feel like the only thing that will change it is those spewing stupidity like "the price of freedom" start paying a whole lot more of that price. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 18 #568 October 5, 2017 kallend************It's a fantastic comparison and for the first time ever, I actually appreciate his comments. After all, ALL of those trucks require training and licensing, registration, and insurance. Their use and possession are heavily regulated. Even the contents of the trucks are documented and regulated! Again, it's a fantastic comparison. It's nice to see some progress in the gun control discussion with some from the far right for once. of course the truck would be stolen. Also Two things Guns are heavily regulated Two, trucks are not constitutionally protected Sad how your attempt falls flat........ The Constitution doesn't prevent: universal background checks on ALL sales, bans on certain types of weapons, registration, bans on certain types of ammo, bans on carrying in certain locations, bans on the mentally ill or convicted criminals from owning/using guns, etc. See, for example, the SCOTUS ruling in Heller. John Which one of your so called solutions, the ones you list here, would have stopped the shooting this weekend? Ignoring your false dichotomy logical fallacy: it would be impossible to kill 58 and injure 500 people with a single shot muzzle loader (the type known to the authors of the Constitution) before being stopped. And there are some 9,000+ gun murders every year, not just these 58. Ahh the false muzzle loader bullshit that has already been debunked in a court So you admit, NONE of your dream laws would have stopped this man. Thanks"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lawndarter 3 #569 October 5, 2017 Blacksmith311Do we even know if he purchased the weapons himself and actually got a background check on them, private transfer, stole, or straw purchase??? He bought at least some of them legally - and there's no indication any he had were illegal that I've seen - most came from stores in CA, AZ, NV, and I think UT. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 18 #570 October 5, 2017 Lawndarter*** John Which one of your so called solutions, the ones you list here, would have stopped the shooting this weekend? The point I think is more that with anything else - trucks running people down, bombings, whatever, we start looking for ways to mitigate the risk of further attacks of the same or similar nature, while with guns, it immediately becomes "don't politicize this" and other nonsense to avoid discussing anything useful. I am still staggered that Americans are told to accept rampant gun violence as "the price of freedom" while the idea of universal healthcare is somehow just inconceivable. I feel like the only thing that will change it is those spewing stupidity like "the price of freedom" start paying a whole lot more of that price. when you chose to start from the false premise of rampant gun violence there can be no dialog."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lawndarter 3 #571 October 5, 2017 rushmc when you chose to start from the false premise of rampant gun violence there can be no dialog. The premise is not false. No other civilized country is plagued by gun violence like America. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lawndarter 3 #572 October 5, 2017 http://www.theonion.com/article/gorilla-sales-skyrocket-after-latest-gorilla-attac-30860 Another Onion classic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 18 #573 October 5, 2017 Lawndarter*** when you chose to start from the false premise of rampant gun violence there can be no dialog. The premise is not false. No other civilized country is plagued bygun violence like America. I do not think you can back this up. When you break it all down, most of the murders are gang/drug related. Look at Chicago and other Democratic controlled cities with high murder rates. But you would rather just throw a blanket over all of it to link it together because the argument does not stand up. Look, I am willing to listen to any idea. Got any that would have stopped the shooting this weekend?"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phil1111 910 #574 October 5, 2017 Lawndarter*** John Which one of your so called solutions, the ones you list here, would have stopped the shooting this weekend?... I am still staggered that Americans are told to accept rampant gun violence as "the price of freedom" while the idea of universal healthcare is somehow just inconceivable. I feel like the only thing that will change it is those spewing stupidity like "the price of freedom" start paying a whole lot more of that price. According to my calculations. The actual cost of freedom, i.e. gun violence, in the US over the lifetime of US citizen is $139,000. "the U.S. was found to be on course for the lowest average life expectancy levels of all the rich countries worldwide... very unequal to an extent the whole national performance is affected – it is the only country without universal health insurance," ... the U.S. has the highest child and maternal mortality, homicide rate, and body-mass index of any high-income country.... https://www.cnbc.com/2017/02/22/us-life-expectancy-is-low-and-is-now-projected-to-be-on-par-with-mexico-by-2030.html The annual cost for victims of gun violence is an average of $2.8 billion in emergency-room and inpatient charges alone, the study concluded. If lost wages are factored in, the financial burden rises to $45 billion each year. https://qz.com/1093144/us-gun-violence-costs-an-average-of-2-8-billion-a-year-a-johns-hopkins-study-reveals/ Assuming 80 year life expectancy, interest 5%, single annual compounding,$137 a year per person cost, of $45 billion over a 318 million population. The average life expectancy of a US citizen is only 78. But the OECD average country with universal health care is 80. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phil1111 910 #575 October 5, 2017 rushmc****** when you chose to start from the false premise of rampant gun violence there can be no dialog. The premise is not false. No other civilized country is plagued bygun violence like America. Look, I am willing to listen to any idea. Got any that would have stopped the shooting this weekend? Why do you insist upon teasing everyone who reads your posts. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
