More mass shootings

[yoink 321]

There has never been a bad case for background checks...

[GeorgiaDon 340]

kallend

Good case for background checks on all gun sales:

www.latimes.com/science/sciencenow/la-sci-sn-gun-show-deaths-20171023-story.html

Could also have something to do with the 10-day waiting period (sometimes referred to as a "cooling off period")
in California.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[Hooknswoop 19]

On this issue, we are 100% in agreement.

Buying a fitearm at a gun show venue should require a background check, same as at a gun store.

Derek V

[rushmc 18]

Hooknswoop

On this issue, we are 100% in agreement.

Buying a fitearm at a gun show venue should require a background check, same as at a gun store.

Derek V

if you are selling as a vendor at the gun show a background check is required.
At least to all I have gone to.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Phil1111 910]

rushmc

***On this issue, we are 100% in agreement.

Buying a fitearm at a gun show venue should require a background check, same as at a gun store.

Derek V

if you are selling as a vendor at the gun show a background check is required.
At least to all I have gone to.

Thats why you do all your buying in the parking lot outside the show. In a private sale, face to face unless you have reasonable reason to believe the buyer is a felon. i.e. a full patch Hells Angel.Like Duh!

See post #15
http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=347352

There are people that go to gun shows specifically to sell out of their vans in the parking lot. They keep it on the sly so to speak.Unless the person is a FFL , i.e. licensed gun dealer, no record(identification) is needed.

This post sums it up(#30):
"No need to be paranoid, FTF cash sale is hard to track. Never buy from someone that asks for ID or ccw docs or bill of sale. The reasons are obvious. I wouldn't loose any sleep over it. Folks don't buy private because they're criminals, some may, they buy private so the gov doesn't know! Thats why the push for gun show backround checks."

FTF means face to face, i.e. in person, be it a gun show parking lot or Walmart parking lot.What the laws don't propose is background checks and waiting periods across the board in private FTF transactions.

So a full patch Hells Angel without a felony. Yeah I know we are talking fantasy-example. Can FTF sell to another full patch member at a Hells Angel rally in whereever, USA.

[rushmc 18]

Phil1111

******On this issue, we are 100% in agreement.

Buying a fitearm at a gun show venue should require a background check, same as at a gun store.

Derek V

if you are selling as a vendor at the gun show a background check is required.
At least to all I have gone to.

Thats why you do all your buying in the parking lot outside the show. In a private sale, face to face unless you have reasonable reason to believe the buyer is a felon. i.e. a full patch Hells Angel.Like Duh!

See post #15
http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=347352

There are people that go to gun shows specifically to sell out of their vans in the parking lot. They keep it on the sly so to speak.Unless the person is a FFL , i.e. licensed gun dealer, no record(identification) is needed.

This post sums it up(#30):
"No need to be paranoid, FTF cash sale is hard to track. Never buy from someone that asks for ID or ccw docs or bill of sale. The reasons are obvious. I wouldn't loose any sleep over it. Folks don't buy private because they're criminals, some may, they buy private so the gov doesn't know! Thats why the push for gun show backround checks."

FTF means face to face, i.e. in person, be it a gun show parking lot or Walmart parking lot.What the laws don't propose is background checks and waiting periods across the board in private FTF transactions.

So a full patch Hells Angel without a felony. Yeah I know we are talking fantasy-example. Can FTF sell to another full patch member at a Hells Angel rally in whereever, USA.

Then drop the gun show bull shit and say what you really mean!

But just so you know, very few of the private sale guns end up in crimes.
But then it is not about back ground checks is it?

You are afraid of an object. You can't help yourself. So you ignore facts.

Facts like, mass shooting are not rising. (they are just more sensationalized by those like you and the compliant media)

Thank God for the rule of law and the limitations the Constitution puts on people who would push their agenda through courts because......

........


........

THEY CAN'T WIN AT THE FUCKING BALLOT BOX!!!

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Phil1111 910]

rushmc

*********On this issue, we are 100% in agreement.

Buying a fitearm at a gun show venue should require a background check, same as at a gun store.

Derek V

if you are selling as a vendor at the gun show a background check is required.
At least to all I have gone to.

Thats why you do all your buying in the parking lot outside the show. In a private sale, face to face unless you have reasonable reason to believe the buyer is a felon. i.e. a full patch Hells Angel.Like Duh!

See post #15
http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=347352

There are people that go to gun shows specifically to sell out of their vans in the parking lot. They keep it on the sly so to speak.Unless the person is a FFL , i.e. licensed gun dealer, no record(identification) is needed.

This post sums it up(#30):
"No need to be paranoid, FTF cash sale is hard to track. Never buy from someone that asks for ID or ccw docs or bill of sale. The reasons are obvious. I wouldn't loose any sleep over it. Folks don't buy private because they're criminals, some may, they buy private so the gov doesn't know! Thats why the push for gun show backround checks."

FTF means face to face, i.e. in person, be it a gun show parking lot or Walmart parking lot.What the laws don't propose is background checks and waiting periods across the board in private FTF transactions.

So a full patch Hells Angel without a felony. Yeah I know we are talking fantasy-example. Can FTF sell to another full patch member at a Hells Angel rally in whereever, USA.

Then drop the gun show bull shit and say what you really mean!

But just so you know, very few of the private sale guns end up in crimes.
But then it is not about back ground checks is it?

You are afraid of an object. You can't help yourself. So you ignore facts.

Facts like, mass shooting are not rising. (they are just more sensationalized by those like you and the compliant media)

Thank God for the rule of law and the limitations the Constitution puts on people who would push their agenda through courts because......

........


........



THEY CAN'T WIN AT THE FUCKING BALLOT BOX!!!


Easy there, breathe deep, clearly the loopholes that allow "straw" purchases, FTF selling, cut a bit.

Don't worry, I won't tell my democrat friends how the backyard dealing really works. They don't like guns anyway and their wives,girlfriends won't let them in the house.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

Phil1111

Thats why you do all your buying in the parking lot outside the show. In a private sale, face to face unless you have reasonable reason to believe the buyer is a felon. i.e. a full patch Hells Angel.Like Duh!

See post #15
http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=347352

There are people that go to gun shows specifically to sell out of their vans in the parking lot. They keep it on the sly so to speak.Unless the person is a FFL , i.e. licensed gun dealer, no record(identification) is needed.

This post sums it up(#30):
"No need to be paranoid, FTF cash sale is hard to track. Never buy from someone that asks for ID or ccw docs or bill of sale. The reasons are obvious. I wouldn't loose any sleep over it. Folks don't buy private because they're criminals, some may, they buy private so the gov doesn't know! Thats why the push for gun show backround checks."

FTF means face to face, i.e. in person, be it a gun show parking lot or Walmart parking lot.What the laws don't propose is background checks and waiting periods across the board in private FTF transactions.

So a full patch Hells Angel without a felony. Yeah I know we are talking fantasy-example. Can FTF sell to another full patch member at a Hells Angel rally in whereever, USA.

First off, every gun show I've been to has folks patrolling the parking lot, looking for this sort of thing. It's not illegal, but the guys running the show want their money. Anyone buying or selling has to do so inside the show.

Shows in WI don't require background checks for private party sales. But the vast majority of sellers are FFL dealers.

Second off, the push for background checks is for "across the board" checks (bolded part).

The push is for checks and records for every transfer. California has it and has for a while. Colorado & Washington recently passed it.

The problem becomes that every transfer is now required to go through an FFL holder. In California, they aren't supposed to charge extra, but many do.

And in both WA & CO, "transfer" includes any exchange of a gun. Even loaning a rifle to a friend to go hunting with (even if the owner of the gun is along with the person borrowing it).

Both WA & CO have had a lot of LEO saying it was unenforceable and that they weren't even going to try.

And, as a bit of "read between the lines", the SC has said that there were reasonable restrictions that could be placed on the 2nd A that would be constitutional. One specifically stated was "commercial sales."

Specifically saying "commercial" sales would seem to indicate that private sales and simple gifts may not be included in that.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[Hooknswoop 19]

Quote

Both WA & CO have had a lot of LEO saying it was unenforceable and that they weren't even going to try.

Private gun sales background checks are unenforceable. I tried to explain that to Billvon and Kallend and they didn't believe me.

Requiring all sales of guns at a gun show to go through a background check would be easy to enforce, but wouldn't change much.

Derek V

[rushmc 18]

Oh
Now you move the goal post to straw purchases.

You find it hard to focus?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DJL 232]

rushmc

Oh
Now you move the goal post to straw purchases.

You find it hard to focus?

Straw buyer purchases and shady FFL purchases are the source of most illegal firearms. Why not address that? Are you interested in keeping firearms out of the criminal market or do you just want to win internet arguments?

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[billvon 2,396]

"Buying a fitearm at a gun show venue should require a background check, same as at a gun store."

"Private gun sales background checks are unenforceable."

So you think all sales at a gun show should require a background check, unless they are private.

Well, there's an easy solution to your issue with the AFF JCC as well. Toughen up standards for all AFF JCC's, unless they are private. Then the evaluator can evaluate the candidate however they want.

[Hooknswoop 19]

Quote

"Buying a fitearm at a gun show venue should require a background check, same as at a gun store."

"Private gun sales background checks are unenforceable."

So you think all sales at a gun show should require a background check, unless they are private.

No. I think that all sales at gun shows should require a background check. I do not think private sales (not at a gun show) should require a background check. I think that private sale (not at a gun show) background checks are unenforceable. Colorado is proof of this.

Quote

Well, there's an easy solution to your issue with the AFF JCC as well. Toughen up standards for all AFF JCC's, unless they are private. Then the evaluator can evaluate the candidate however they want.

I think you overestimate my level of concern about the AFFICC. It is more about USPA not representing its individual members interests when they conflict with the DZO's interests.

Derke V

[kallend 1,623]

rushmc

***On this issue, we are 100% in agreement.

Buying a fitearm at a gun show venue should require a background check, same as at a gun store.

Derek V

if you are selling as a vendor at the gun show a background check is required.
At least to all I have gone to.

Have you been to one in Nevada?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[billvon 2,396]

> I do not think private sales (not at a gun show) should require a background check.

Ah. So sales at the Monthly Gun Sale Event and Gathering (not a gun show) or the Weapons Swap Meet and Sale (not a gun show) don't require a background check. Clever.

Imagine how much progress we could make towards reducing the number of gun deaths if gun enthusiasts put as much effort into self-policing and training that they did into getting around gun laws.

[normiss 622]

Bought my Siig .40 at a gun show from a dealer, no ID, no waiting period.
All brand new packaging, still in the grease bag too.
I'm such an outlaw.

I sold one handgun years ago to a friend, but I insisted on us doing it at the local cop shop in TN. They verified the weapon wasn't on any lists and he was clean to buy it. He had reasons for the purchase, so I wanted to be clean on the sale.
I have made one FTF purchase, no checks, no nothing.
I inherited two 45 cal revolvers, nothing to document them.
I was given a sawed off 12 ga, no papers.

Amazingly easy to build a cache of weapons with little effort in this country.

[piisfish 135]

rushmc

Facts like, mass shooting are not rising. (they are just more sensationalized by those like you and the compliant media)
!!!

and you are OK with the number of so called mass shootings in the USA ? Anything you would suggest to try and reduce them a bit ?

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[billvon 2,396]

> So you ignore facts.
> Facts like, mass shooting are not rising. (they are just more sensationalized by those like you and
> the compliant media)

Once again, you fail to even check what you are saying before posting.

The actual number of deaths due to mass shootings (per year in the US) are attached.

[Hooknswoop 19]

Quote

Clever

I wasn’t trying to be clever. I thought I was agreeing with the anti-gun side.

Universal background checks without gun registration in not enforceable. You said it is. Colorado proves it is not.

Derek V

[yoink 321]

Here's today's shooting - at a Walmart in Colorado.

Doesn't class as a 'mass-shooting' though because only 3 people died... amateur.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41842985

My favourite quote comes from the police spokesperson responding to an event in which 3 people have just randomly been killed by a lunatic with a gun:

Quote

"From what we have right now it appears to be random," he added. "It's a crazy world we live in."

3 people murdered. hahaha... Crazy times huh? How 'bout them Dodgers? What a game!

[DJL 232]

yoink

Here's today's shooting - at a Walmart in Colorado.

Doesn't class as a 'mass-shooting' though because only 3 people died... amateur.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41842985

My favourite quote comes from the police spokesperson responding to an event in which 3 people have just randomly been killed by a lunatic with a gun:

Quote

"From what we have right now it appears to be random," he added. "It's a crazy world we live in."

3 people murdered. hahaha... Crazy times huh? How 'bout them Dodgers? What a game!

I wonder if Trump is going to call for disbanding the US citizenship program or extreme vetting on US citizens.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[Hooknswoop 19]

http://www.denverpost.com/2017/11/02/colorado-springs-shooting-thursday/

So the wal mart shooting made national news. This one didn't. Why?

Why do we discuss gun control after a shooting, but no one will engage you to discuss solutions after a truck is used to kill 8?

It defies logic. It does hit on emotions though......

Derek V

[billvon 2,396]

>So the wal mart shooting made national news. This one didn't. Why?

No one is dead. In the US, news of a shooting where no one is killed (or just blacks are killed, or only one person is killed) is like a report on "dog bites man." Not news.

>Why do we discuss gun control after a shooting, but no one will engage you to discuss
>solutions after a truck is used to kill 8?

?? There have been several discussions about that here, including the use of autonomous vehicles to prevent such deaths. Did you miss that?

[yoink 321]

Hooknswoop

http://www.denverpost.com/2017/11/02/colorado-springs-shooting-thursday/

So the wal mart shooting made national news. This one didn't. Why?

Honestly? Probably not enough carnage to sell.

Quote

Why do we discuss gun control after a shooting, but no one will engage you to discuss solutions after a truck is used to kill 8?

Derek V

Because everyone has their nice and tidy bullet point for a gun control discussion. We can reel them off no thought required.

A new discussion? That's going to take AT LEAST 300 people dying to provide impetus for some actual new thought.

[DJL 232]

Hooknswoop

http://www.denverpost.com/2017/11/02/colorado-springs-shooting-thursday/

So the wal mart shooting made national news. This one didn't. Why?

Why do we discuss gun control after a shooting, but no one will engage you to discuss solutions after a truck is used to kill 8?

It defies logic. It does hit on emotions though......

Derek V

Two issues here. One is that he didn't use guns, so of course the solution on this one didn't have to do with guns making the killing easier. Two is that #One is a fallacy. After the guy got out of his car he had a paint gun and a pellet gun. Obviously for him it was too difficult to get a gun. If he DID have actual guns then he would have been able to kill more people more easily. As it was he was only able to kill people who didn't react quickly enough to the sound of a truck barreling down a bike path. So, we now have a case in which someone was only able to kill a limited number of people because of his inability to obtain actual firearms.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher