Your Tax Money Well-Spent

[Andy9o8 0]

Heavily armed drug cops raid retiree’s garden, seize okra plants.
Georgia police declare war on okra

(Extra props for the photo caption)

[RonD1120 58]

Training exercise, no problem, nothing to see here, just move on now, ya heah.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[headoverheels 291]

My uncle has just under 1000 acres in Henry County, Georgia. Mostly fallow or wooded, some leased to farmers. A few years ago there was some weed found growing on his land. Nothing to do with him, just "farmers" farming for free on the sly.

He does have a large vegetable garden. Not sure whether he has okra, but probably.

That is some might fine looking okra in the linked article. We rarely see it looking that good in the stores in San Jose.

That homeowner is growing a variety of okra I have not. His leaves look much more like marijuana leaves than those of the more common okra variety.

[masterrig 1]

I think, they just wanted to fry-up some okra or make gumbo.


Chuck

[turtlespeed 212]

masterrig

I think, they just wanted to fry-up some okra or make gumbo.


Chuck

Fried Okra goes good with Bunny Stew

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[GeorgiaDon 340]

turtlespeed

***I think, they just wanted to fry-up some okra or make gumbo.


Chuck

Fried Okra goes good with Bunny StewI wonder how it goes with Crow.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[turtlespeed 212]

GeorgiaDon

******I think, they just wanted to fry-up some okra or make gumbo.


Chuck

Fried Okra goes good with Bunny StewI wonder how it goes with Crow.

Don

Do you really think they will take a serious hit from this?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[masterrig 1]

turtlespeed

***I think, they just wanted to fry-up some okra or make gumbo.


Chuck

Fried Okra goes good with Bunny Stew

You bet it does!


Chuck

[GeorgiaDon 340]

turtlespeed

*********I think, they just wanted to fry-up some okra or make gumbo.


Chuck

Fried Okra goes good with Bunny StewI wonder how it goes with Crow.

Don

Do you really think they will take a serious hit from this?I live in Georgia and saw the story when it was first reported several months ago, and as far as I can tell there are almost never any repercussions no matter how bad the police screw up here.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[Anvilbrother 0]

Did they not fix anything that was damaged? What do you want $100,000 because the law acting in good faith to catch a criminal made a mistake? Am I missing something, did they shoot anyone here?

I had a call early in my career for a reported house fire. I arrived on scene and found a multi story residental dwelling with white smoke showing from the ridge vents. With no one home I kicked the door in and found no smoke in the bottom floor, entered the second floor with nothing, and then the attic to find steam. Turns out the homeowners redid the dryer vent and forgot to attach the hose back to where it exits the roof, and it filled the attic area with steam on that cool morning.

We paid for their new door frame. Should I have been charged with something? I see it the same as the cops, acting on good faith and intention, but was fooled by a rare situation. Humans not robots.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[GeorgiaDon 340]

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I see it the same as the cops, acting on good faith and intention...

I don't see it the same at all. In your case, you perceived an imminent threat to people and property, one that demanded immediate action. Your actions were the only reasonable and ethical course under the circumstances.

In the pot raid, a person was subjected to an unnecessary intrusion and detention by police who acted precipitously, not taking any time to investigate and verify anything beyond a vague suspicion based on a helicopter overflight. The homeowner certainly did not consider the raid to be a joke, he was traumatized by the invasion and is now worried about the damage to his reputation in his community. How can you compensate that with money? By "repercussions" I don't mean monetary payment, though I realize that for some money makes all problems go away. I mean retraining so cops can actually recognize pot plants as distinct from other shrubs that happen to be green and have narrow leaves, a change in protocols so citizens are not subject to such frivolous raids, and perhaps a couple of days of unpaid vacation for whoever approved the raid on such flimsy grounds.

In the larger sense, this case nicely illustrates some of the idiotic consequences of the "war on drugs". Taxpayers have to pay so police can fly helicopters over their homes and make a mockery of any notion of privacy. Even worse, many departments fund a large part of this big brother operation by seizing property from citizens, who then have to go to great uncompensated expense to prove that their property was obtained legally; this is no more than highway robbery.

And then there are incidents such as dropping flash bang grenades into a crib with a sleeping baby. The cops say, "oops, we're only human" and the family gets $1,000,000 and climbing in medical bills to fix the kids face and close the hole burned through his chest and into his lung. No drugs were found, no arrest made, but the cops claim it's not their problem. "We're not robots" and all that.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[Anvilbrother 0]

I understand your anger it's just this okra raid is a poor example to lead your crusade. Nothing was damaged here, no one hurt or injured, his reputation was cleared when the reason the police were there was all explained as okra all the way up the media chain to CNN.

Why not start a post about the flashbang incident?

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[skycop 0]

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A heavily-armed K9 unit arrived

Our friends at the Washington Post being a bit melodramatic, what a surprise. Now a police K-9 Unit is heavily armed and the long arm of oppression?

I would assume this was in a rural area, marijuana grows can be dangerous to the surrounding communities. Booby traps, pit bulls, armed growers guarding against "pirates". I've found large grows in small wooded areas in urban areas, while flying with the (gasp), National Guard. Growers also plant in unsuspecting farmers fields and public lands.

The guard guys I flew with could spot one plant, in a bucket, from 500 feet.

In our state illegal grows are a public safety problem. Imagine walking in a large park or wooded area, and ending up with a fish hook in your eye. That is just one type of booby trap grows can have.

The legalization argument is valid, but with legalization comes regulation. I'd venture to say there will still be illegal grows even with legalization.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[GeorgiaDon 340]

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The guard guys I flew with could spot one plant, in a bucket, from 500 feet.

Well, at least they thought they could. I'm sure they don't share the "humorous" stories about the times they screwed up.

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I'd venture to say there will still be illegal grows even with legalization.

Just like people still disappear when they wander too close to an illegal moonshine still up in the mountains (queue the banjo music)?

Anyway the whole tactic of making something illegal, forcing it into the criminal economy, then using the association with criminal violence to justify making it illegal is totally circular and self-reinforcing. Using that logic, Prohibition would never have been lifted. Of course, in parts of the South it never was, but at least it's only illegal to sell, not to possess.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[champu 1]

skycop

Quote

A heavily-armed K9 unit arrived

Our friends at the Washington Post being a bit melodramatic, what a surprise. Now a police K-9 Unit is heavily armed and the long arm of oppression?

I have to agree there. Terms like "heavily-armed" and "fully-loaded" (or my favorite: "fully-armed") can safely be ignored when encountered in a news article whether it is a quote or otherwise.

Note: "heavily-loaded" is okay, but only when describing an intoxicated person.

[skycop 0]

Quote

Well, at least they thought they could. I'm sure they don't share the "humorous" stories about the times they screwed up.

We did end up hovering IN a guys back yard at about 10 feet. The bucket was a tomato (we thought). I ended waving to someone taking video from their porch above where we were hovering.
Good times.

Then there were the 26 6ft plants we found right in the middle of a small wooded patch in the middle of a city, near a major highway. The near black helicopter hovering over the neighborhood was quite the stir. I just went in and cut it down, there were two guys with mullets who lived nearby that were very interested in what we were doing. It was in another jurisdiction, not sure if they ever charged anyone.

The pilot spotted these plants as he was setting up to land and talking on the radio. The guy was amazing, we weren't even out looking for dope. His head snapped right and he said "there's 26 plants right there dude".

The next day I was in a bar having a cold beer, when the guy next to me started talking about the black helicopter flying around. He said there was a guy in a blue shirt in the front seat. He was sure the blue shirt guy was a representative of the UN, plotting the future take over.
I bought him a beer, let him rant a few more minutes, then told him I was the guy in the blue shirt. The look on his face was priceless..........needless to say we had a few more beers and a good laugh.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[GeorgiaDon 340]

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The next day I was in a bar having a cold beer, when the guy next to me started talking about the black helicopter flying around. He said there was a guy in a blue shirt in the front seat. He was sure the blue shirt guy was a representative of the UN, plotting the future take over.
I bought him a beer, let him rant a few more minutes, then told him I was the guy in the blue shirt. The look on his face was priceless..........needless to say we had a few more beers and a good laugh.

That's pretty funny. Maybe you should have tried out a russian accent on him.

Quote

there were two guys with mullets ...

Now mullets, that should be illegal!

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[champu 1]

GeorgiaDon

Quote

there were two guys with mullets ...

Now mullets, that should be illegal!

And he was already down on the ground with a set of pruning shears / hedge trimmer / machete or whatever he was using...

...missed opportunities...

[Anvilbrother 0]

Cutting mullets from a hellicopter. He's doing gods work.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[DanG 1]

Why is the National Guard enforcing dope laws? Posse Commitatus doesn't apply?

- Dan G

[skycop 0]

Part of the guard mission is to support LE with equipment, training, and in limited situations personnel.

Aviation assets fall into this category, the guard is funded by the state. In declared emergencies the National Guard have arrest powers.
When looking for dope, they provided the platform, it was part of their mission. When supporting eradication efforts LE does the enforcement. We just happened to come across some while doing something else, but the pilot was very good at spotting it, it's what he did for most of the year.
We used them for large events, large tactical situations, and major emergencies.

I've been through the training, and I've done some dope spotting, but it's a perishable skill. Once during an airshow I was taking a Huey ride with my son, (a private Huey foundation). When we were flying over some farmland I spotted several grows hidden in large cornfields. It was in another state, so I just let the agency working the show know where it was. Never heard anything back. Grows are that prevalent in rural areas. I doubt the farmer knew they were there, all kinds of bad things can happen where it is grown.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[DanG 1]

I think using the Guard (which is ultimately under the authority of the DoD) for law enforcement, violates the spirit of the Posse Commitatus Act. Having a police officer on board a DoD aircraft doesn't make that aircraft and crew any less of a military asset.

- Dan G

[Stumpy 256]

And yet apparently according to Skycop, the police are not becoming more militarised?

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[skycop 0]

The guard belongs to the state,
The internet makes everyone an expert.
Supporting communities in their home state is a guard mission, these aircraft support other types of missions as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2zfrdu0xz0

NG OH-58 with Nightsun and FLIR, used to assist LE. Those have been retired and replaced by the UH-72 Lakota.
All my time was in the OH-58, at the stroke of the millennium, I was sitting in the back of one running the Nightsun. We were ready for the Y2K doom, we ended up turning a lot of fuel into noise.......

When one joins the guard you swear an oath to the state and governor as well as to the country and president.

When a situation exceeds an agency's ability or a specific capability is needed, a request can bring in guard support.

They don't enforce unless it's a declared emergency by city/county and the governor.

Put the foil hat away, even the conspiracy guy in the bar was good with it, once I explained the rules.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[skycop 0]

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And yet apparently according to Skycop, the police are not becoming more militarised?

It's been that way long before the internet-sensationalized "militarization" argument started.

Federal troops cannot support LE, unless directed by the CINC and authorized by congress. Think of the 101st Airborne at the University of Alabama in the 60's.

In that case they (the feds) didn't trust the guard, so they federalized them (Title 10 activation) and brought in federal troops to oversee.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"