Toddler accidentally shoots and kills his mother in Idaho Wal-Mart

[tkhayes 125]

Quote

You talked about children earlier

Are you as concerned as much about swimming pool deaths with children? Since the Pool/ accidental Death ratio is so much much higher than the Gun/accidental death ratio why all the focus on firearms?

we regulate pools and every year the standards get higher. The argument against gun control using other things like swimming pools and automobiles I find to be comical really.

I am all for regulating guns IN THE SAME WAY we regulate so many other things that the gun lobby likes to use as an example of how people die.

We regulate almost everything that causes human deaths. medicine, hospitals, cars, swimming pools, drugs, alcohol, lawn darts, etc etc

you are simply making our point for us. yes swimming pools are dangerous to children, and every year we CHANGE the way we do things to improve their safety. no so with the gun lobby. not one iota. not even the slightest smidgen of improvement of any kind. ever.

[craddock 0]

Huh? Where I live there are zero and I mean zero regulations about pools. The last county I lived in had simple set back requirements as they do with sheds and other things. Another county I lived in had some for in ground but none for the way more popular above ground that you gain access with the ladder always attached. So you do not know nearly as much as you say about US laws. Try again.

Further more all the states that I have lived in and I believe most in the US have a statute called something similar in name to the "recreational land use act". I protects the land owner from liability on his property as long is he is not financially benefiting from its recreational use above a certain threshold. I have a copy of it in my files from two different states. I have built enough motocross tracks on peoples property to be aware of the statute, relevant case law and at one time was well enough versed in with notes that I felt I could comfortably argue for summery judgement if an unfortunate lawsuit occurred.

Anyone can sue for anything. Does not mean the case will go forward.

And yes I am far more concerned that a neighborhood child could drown in a pool since the odds are so much higher. And don't fucking lie to me and say I am ok with halfwits leaving guns around. Just because you are scared of them does not mean you need to lie about my character.

That spot isn't bad at all, the winds were strong and that was the issue! It was just on the downwind side.

[Andy9o8 0]

If you need to mischaracterize someone else's point, you're already behind the 8-ball. That, or maybe you just misunderstood him. TK didn't say that all swimming pools everywhere in the US are government regulated, nor was that his principal point. It was an illustrative example, an analogy, if you will. Pointing out that some kinds of swimming pools, in some place, are not regulated is hardly a rebuttal to his point.

[BillyVance 34]

Iago

Tragic accident. These things happen. Regardless of the amount and level of precautions that are taken, accidents will still happen.

Toddler gets over behind the wheel of the car, slips off the brake, car rolls downhill and runs over mom. Again, tragic accident. If this smart, educated woman who is an avid driver can't control her own car, no one should have a car except the police and the taxi drivers.

I consider myself a pretty rough and 'morbid' kinda guy. I have a sense of humor that doesn't really fit in, well, pretty much anyplace.

That having been said, I feel dirty and disgusted by what you are doing here.

Please do us a favor and shut the fuck up. I mean that in the nicest possible way.

Have a Happy and Safe New Year.

Nicest possible way? Come on man!

But I agree 100%

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[craddock 0]

I was not responding to TK. He thinks that Florida is the entire US and that is a viewpoint so not worth even arguing. I have seen it before. I was responding to the person above as you can clearly tell if you just look at the name of the post I was responding to. You do not have to click on the actual post but just look to see that it was not tk or even the last poster. Usually if it is not the last poster listed there is a reason that you clicked reply on that post. It should not be necessary for everyone to quote posts all the time just because one too lazy to look at the name the post is in response to.

In this case it says in the subject line.....

Re: [Andy9o8] Toddler accidentally shoots and kills his mother in Idaho Wal-Mart......

which means I am responding to you.

Who is behind the 8 ball?

That spot isn't bad at all, the winds were strong and that was the issue! It was just on the downwind side.

[Andy9o8 0]

You are, as RMK wasn't asserting an absolute rule, either, as you mischaracterized him doing. I thus stand by my post.

[regulator 0]

Wow this thread is going nowhere.

[ryoder 1,382]

regulator

Wow this thread is going nowhere.

Isn't that par for this course?

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[BillyVance 34]

jakee

Quote

I will not apologize for mine or that of my fellow U.S. servicemen who stood guard on West German soil,

I'm not asking you to, I'm just challenging your blanket assumption that all Germans who weren't terrorists were happy to have US troops there.

Again, try just reading what's there instead of looking for what to be offended by.

I'm pretty sure there were plenty of Germans that lived through or fought in WWII that still held resentment toward the US military. That said, when I visited Germany 20 years ago, I didn't wear any clothing that might have advertised myself as an American, but in a couple shops, once I spoke, English of course, I got the impression the person working there wasn't thrilled.

Still a beautiful country though. My best friend growing up was ethnic German, and his parents were born in Germany, and yes, experienced WWII as young kids. His father had a US Army helmet that he kept all these years. A soldier knelt down and gave it to him after Germany surrendered.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[craddock 0]

What the hell are you talking about? He said "nearly all" and "most" and I simply showed that the last counties I have lived in to not fit in the "nearly all" and "most" profile. Funny people from outside the US seem to think they know so much about our laws and as in this case are many times wrong. Having lived all over the midwest with most places not having these stiff statues in place I can not agree with his "nearly all" and "most" statement. Further the guy actually accused me of being ok with people leaving guns just lying around.

Swimming pools are so much more dangerous to kids than guns AND are not protected by the 2nd amendment that I can't help but wonder why anyone would question why some jurisdictions want fences around in-ground pools. I find it hard to believe even the staunchest NRA loyalist would support leaving a loaded gun out in the front yard.

Your insult that I am behind the 8 ball is just a veiled PA to make you feel better about yourself. Mischaracterized how? By pointing out I have not lived in any county that I am aware of that falls under his "nearly all" and "most" rule. But since they are so dangerous and not protected by the Constitution I don't know why anyone would be surprised if there are some regulations.

Anyone can purchase a pool with no background check regardless if they are a felon. For that matter a multiple felon with vehicular manslaughter conviction could walk into a dealership and purchase a new vehicle with no license, insurance, or background check so long as he has the cash. And they are not protected by the constitution. Yet that same person that can buy the much more dangerous pool and car will not be able to purchase a firearm legally.

So I guess I miss your point. I mischaracterized someone and am behind the 8 ball. Gotcha

That spot isn't bad at all, the winds were strong and that was the issue! It was just on the downwind side.

[Andy9o8 0]

Quote

Toddler accidentally shoots and kills his mother in Idaho Wal-Mart

You know, I'm not really convinced it was accidental:

Quote

Terry Rutledge, Veronica’s father-in-law, told The Spokesman-Review that the boy unzipped the special gun compartment in the woman’s purse where the weapon was kept while she was looking at clothing.
Terry Rutledge said his 29-year-old daughter-in-law did not put the weapon “loosely into her purse.”

I think the little bastard .... well, let's just say There's precedent for this kind of thing.

[Hjeada 0]

RMK

"...Are you as concerned as much about swimming pool deaths with children?"


Because it’s a gun discussion, not a swimming pool discussion. But since you mentioned, I believe nearly all US cities/towns have regulations of some manner that attempt to protect children if you have a pool. Most require (by law) fencing of some method that can restrict access. Yes, children still drown, but at least it is acknowledged as a risk and actions have been taken.

As for guns, there are no methods to protect children in the US. As a populace, you’re concerned that a neighbourhood child could drown in your pool – and you get sued. However, you are seemingly OK with halfwits leaving guns around. “Merica”

Errr...wrong... https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/?id=609.666

Dudeist Skydiver #0511

[ryoder 1,382]

BillyVance

I'm pretty sure there were plenty of Germans that lived through or fought in WWII that still held resentment toward the US military. That said, when I visited Germany 20 years ago, I didn't wear any clothing that might have advertised myself as an American, but in a couple shops, once I spoke, English of course, I got the impression the person working there wasn't thrilled.

In college I knew another student who had spent time as an exchange student in Germany, working in a bank. At that time, there were a lot of skinhead gangs roaming around looking for foreigners to beat up. Here is how he explained his tactic to avoid that:

He had become very fluent in German, but still had enough of an accent that locals would know he was not one of them. So he practiced learning *other* regional German accents. i.e. in Northern Germany, he would put on a Southern German accent, and vice versa when in the South.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[ryoder 1,382]

Hjeada

***"...Are you as concerned as much about swimming pool deaths with children?"


Because it’s a gun discussion, not a swimming pool discussion. But since you mentioned, I believe nearly all US cities/towns have regulations of some manner that attempt to protect children if you have a pool. Most require (by law) fencing of some method that can restrict access. Yes, children still drown, but at least it is acknowledged as a risk and actions have been taken.

As for guns, there are no methods to protect children in the US. As a populace, you’re concerned that a neighbourhood child could drown in your pool – and you get sued. However, you are seemingly OK with halfwits leaving guns around. “Merica”

Errr...wrong... https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/?id=609.666

28 states according to this: http://smartgunlaws.org/child-access-prevention-policy-summary/

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[BillyVance 34]

Andy9o8

Quote

Toddler accidentally shoots and kills his mother in Idaho Wal-Mart

You know, I'm not really convinced it was accidental:

*** Terry Rutledge, Veronica’s father-in-law, told The Spokesman-Review that the boy unzipped the special gun compartment in the woman’s purse where the weapon was kept while she was looking at clothing.
Terry Rutledge said his 29-year-old daughter-in-law did not put the weapon “loosely into her purse.”

I think the little bastard .... well, let's just say There's precedent for this kind of thing.

I fucking LOVE Family Guy.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[Andy9o8 0]

ryoder

***

I'm pretty sure there were plenty of Germans that lived through or fought in WWII that still held resentment toward the US military. That said, when I visited Germany 20 years ago, I didn't wear any clothing that might have advertised myself as an American, but in a couple shops, once I spoke, English of course, I got the impression the person working there wasn't thrilled.

In college I knew another student who had spent time as an exchange student in Germany, working in a bank. At that time, there were a lot of skinhead gangs roaming around looking for foreigners to beat up. Here is how he explained his tactic to avoid that:

He had become very fluent in German, but still had enough of an accent that locals would know he was not one of them. So he practiced learning *other* regional German accents. i.e. in Northern Germany, he would put on a Southern German accent, and vice versa when in the South.

27 states and the District of Columbia have child firearm storage laws similar to Minnesota's, expressly prohibiting storing or leaving firearms where they can be accessed by juveniles outside of parental/guardian supervision. Idaho, where our little Stewie managed to gun down Lois, is not one of them. Nor are there child firearm access/storage statutes at the federal level. So, that's 45% of the United States where children are not protected by firearm access/storage laws. No, it isn't 100%, but it is what it is.

ETA: RYoder posted same while I was googling & typing.

[normiss 622]

Do they all offer the get out of jail free card?

"Subdivision 2 does not apply to a child's access to firearms that was obtained as a result of an unlawful entry."

[masterrig 1]

Andy9o8

Quote

Toddler accidentally shoots and kills his mother in Idaho Wal-Mart

You know, I'm not really convinced it was accidental:

*** Terry Rutledge, Veronica’s father-in-law, told The Spokesman-Review that the boy unzipped the special gun compartment in the woman’s purse where the weapon was kept while she was looking at clothing.
Terry Rutledge said his 29-year-old daughter-in-law did not put the weapon “loosely into her purse.”

I think the little bastard .... well, let's just say There's precedent for this kind of thing.

There's no telling what that kid has hidden away. Just the beginning of his plan of world domination!
The really slick part of all this is... who would suspect him?


Chuck

[Andy9o8 0]

normiss

Do they all offer the get out of jail free card?

"Subdivision 2 does not apply to a child's access to firearms that was obtained as a result of an unlawful entry."

I don't know about all of them, it was a fast google search. It seems intended to address scenarios where, for plausible example, if you keep a gun in your unlocked bedside nightstand drawer (and assuming you generally don't have juveniles in your home), and then a burglar unlawfully enters your premises and steals the gun out of your nightstand, you're not nailed under the statute if the burglar happens to be a juvenile. Seems legislatively reasonable.

[turtlespeed 212]

tkhayes

you are simply making our point for us. yes swimming pools are dangerous to children, and every year we CHANGE the way we do things to improve their safety. no so with the gun lobby. not one iota. not even the slightest smidgen of improvement of any kind. ever.

That statement is just untrue. I think you know that.

Why the troll?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[regulator 0]

http://www.ammoland.com/2015/01/2014-second-amendment-triumphs-gun-banners-lose-big/#axzz3NgijpOuF

[masterrig 1]

If, we're going to do it... let's do it right...

https://www.youtube.com/embed/iDnEkFSMRik?rel=0&vq=medium&autoplay=1


Chuck

[normiss 622]

I don't think he understands all the words he used.
"Clockwise"?

[champu 1]

Andy9o8

27 states and the District of Columbia have child firearm storage laws similar to Minnesota's, expressly prohibiting storing or leaving firearms where they can be accessed by juveniles outside of parental/guardian supervision. Idaho, where our little Stewie managed to gun down Lois, is not one of them. Nor are there child firearm access/storage statutes at the federal level. So, that's 45% of the United States where children are not protected by firearm access/storage laws. No, it isn't 100%, but it is what it is.

ETA: RYoder posted same while I was googling & typing.

And using ryoder's link and this, the percentage of the US population that lives in states with such laws that at least attempt to make owners secure their firearms aways from minors is about 71% (226.4M/318.9M)

That's practically nobody so RMK and TK were almost correct when they wrote...

RMK

As for guns, there are no methods to protect children in the US.

tkhayes

...we CHANGE the way we do things to improve their safety. no so with the gun lobby. not one iota. not even the slightest smidgen of improvement of any kind. ever.

They were only off by 71%

People who want more of these types of laws, or maybe a workable law that helps make sure people have had a background check before they make an in-state private party purchase (already required in many states and for all inter-state purchases) listen up, here's what you have to do...

Stop electing people that just try to ban every type of rifle, handgun, shotgun, magazine, or place to get ammo that they can get away with. Of course firearm owners and the NRA are going to be pissed and fight you. As Lil Jon so eloquently put it when featured in Damn! by the Youngbloodz... "Don't start no shit it won't be no shit."

[masterrig 1]

I noticed that too. An episode of Mythbusters proved the 'gangsta' method was highly not accurate.


Chuck