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normiss

Another cop goes free.

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normiss

Do I correctly understand "selling loose cigarettes" as a guy in NYC offering me a smoke for a quarter?
If so, what is the taxable value on a single cigarette?

A life.



taxes are used for homeless shelters, subsidizing green energy, feeding the starving, educating schools, raising awareness, paying off leaders, supporting unions, paying the mayor's salary, lining the pockets of the city politicians, funding 'work programs' etc etc etc - why do you hate the needy?

Cops are primarily revenue collection workers - busting guys for doing tax free transitions is equivalent to having quotas for the police for parking violations. - and they don't do that......wait a second...

(sorry, out of control tax hungry social/political power crooks in charge tangent here, back to the original topic)

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

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Andy9o8

Quote

DIS



Blatant racism on your part.


Is that NOT what he said? How is quoting what the man SAID racist?:S Should we start calling you AL now?

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

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Andy9o8



Anyone who thinks that the usual reason why black people get their asses kicked by cops is because they're resisting is naive indeed.



Soooo, what you're saying is that all cops are racist and only target people of a certain color in order to dole out beatings? It's 2014 and this is how you think?

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Kingsixx

***

Anyone who thinks that the usual reason why black people get their asses kicked by cops is because they're resisting is naive indeed.



Soooo, what you're saying is that all cops are racist and only target people of a certain color in order to dole out beatings? It's 2014 and this is how you think?

Sooo, you don't get to spin-up what I say to demonize the spun-up version. Sorry, been married too long to fall for that one. What I'm saying is what I said, not what you said I said you said I said. Dear.

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Andy9o8

******

Quote

DIS



Blatant racism on your part.



Is that NOT what he said?

Thank you for insulting the intelligence of every honest person reading dis thread.

You didn't answer the question. Is that NOT what he said?

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

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catfishhunter

*********

Quote

DIS



Blatant racism on your part.



Is that NOT what he said?

Thank you for insulting the intelligence of every honest person reading dis thread.

You didn't answer the question. Is that NOT what he said?

So you, too, are doubling-down. Excellent.

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Andy9o8

************

Quote

DIS



Blatant racism on your part.



Is that NOT what he said?

Thank you for insulting the intelligence of every honest person reading dis thread.

You didn't answer the question. Is that NOT what he said?

So you, too, are doubling-down. Excellent.

and your being Obtuse. Answer the question

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

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A properly administered "choke hold" does not crush the throat, as you are incorrectly assuming. It doesn't even touch the throat. The upper part of the arm and the lower part form a "V" and the throat, where breathing occurs is not even touched. The pressure is on the sides of the neck, squeezing the two big veins (return flow from the brain) and if hard enough, the two arteries(blood flow to the brain. It is called a "blood choke" and is one way to subdue a person as distinguished from a striking force, such as a baton or a gun or some other potentially lethal or injurious force. The person faints from low blood flow to/from brain. That is why he was able to say 'I can't breathe'. His throat/vocal chords were not affected. After the pressure is released and blood flow resumes, the person is woozy; then fully Ok after a few moments.

The coroner said, correctly, that the pressure of weight was the reason. The blood flow choke was only on for 17 seconds.

The guy was grotesquely obese. Asthma, heart problems also according to coroner. Weight was on his back. That's about it.

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dpreguy

50% at risk...yadda ... = unintelligent response/comment, and totally off point.



What was irrelevant is your suggestion that the guy's physical state is what killed him. He was killed by the cop.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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kallend

***50% at risk...yadda ... = unintelligent response/comment, and totally off point.



What was irrelevant is your suggestion that the guy's physical state is what killed him. He was killed by the cop.

No he died because broke the law. Cause and effect.

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

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This guy, Eric Gardner, stood there arguing with the Po-Po for several minutes. That was a dumb thing to do.

In my profession we attempted to train our clients to learn to live life on life's terms. He was expecting the police to accept his illegal activities and disregard their day's orders. Life was telling him he was in the wrong. Gardner made a series of bad choices.

On the radio now it is being reported that the precinct chief is black. The patrol sargeant is black. This issue is not racial it is a violation of the law. That is, he was selling untaxed individual cigarettes.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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Kingsixx

***

Anyone who thinks that the usual reason why black people get their asses kicked by cops is because they're resisting is naive indeed.



Soooo, what you're saying is that all cops are racist and only target people of a certain color in order to dole out beatings? It's 2014 and this is how you think?

STOP FEEDING HIM:S
"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

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RonD1120

This guy, Eric Gardner, stood there arguing with the Po-Po for several minutes. That was a dumb thing to do.

In my profession we attempted to train our clients to learn to live life on life's terms. He was expecting the police to accept his illegal activities and disregard their day's orders. Life was telling him he was in the wrong. Gardner made a series of bad choices.

On the radio now it is being reported that the precinct chief is black. The patrol sargeant is black. This issue is not racial it is a violation of the law. That is, he was selling untaxed individual cigarettes.



Unless the precinct chief and the patrol sargeant were the ones who killed him, I am not sure how your logaic allows you to proclaim it is not racial.

The same group of people who complain here on DZ.com that they are being treated differently by the moderators, appear to be the same group of people to argue that if "these people" would just behave properly there wouldn't be a problem.

I don't know how you guys all suck and blow at the same time.

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Quote

The coroner said, correctly, that the pressure of weight was the reason. The blood flow choke was only on for 17 seconds.



The coroner also cited "compression of neck (choke hold)" as a causative factor. In fact, he listed it first. You (I'm sure deliberately) omitted that fact.

Quote

The guy was grotesquely obese. Asthma, heart problems also according to coroner. Weight was on his back. That's about it.



There's a long, long-standing principle of Anglo-American law called "You take your victim [or "plaintiff'] as you find him". By all means, Google it for yourself. But in a nutshell, it means that if you act upon and cause injury to a person who (for whatever reason) is particularly vulnerable to injury, you are still fully responsible for the harm the person has incurred, even if that harm is extra severe in light of his personal vulnerability.

Put another way: medically, Garner's obesity and asthma made him very vulnerable; but legally, the choke hold and the other force used against him by police is what caused his death.

Yes, yes, I know: his unlawful acts caused his death. But that ignores the principle of proportionality: you don't use potentially deadly force against someone suspected of doing nothing worse than selling loosies. Period. You just don't.

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catfishhunter

******50% at risk...yadda ... = unintelligent response/comment, and totally off point.



What was irrelevant is your suggestion that the guy's physical state is what killed him. He was killed by the cop.

No he died because broke the law. Cause and effect.

Tax evasion is not a capital offense. If it were, a lot of our billionaires would be dead.

I broke the speed limit this morning, and didn't die. Cause but no effect.

He was killed by the cop.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Andy9o8

Quote

your being Obtuse.



Now you've gone and hurt my feelings, you meanie. And not just from the irony of your spelling! Don't drop an Anvil on me, Brother!

Ok word police, Obtuse-not quick or alert in perception but I don't claim to be a educated man while you Andy are supposed to be a lawyer. I am sure there could be a better word to describe you.

Back to the issue
Answer the damn question since you called the man a racist for quoting the deceased. You said he is racist for saying he said "dis" please tell me what he said and when you have to admit he said "dis" please tell us why it is racist to quote the deceased.

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

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kallend

*********50% at risk...yadda ... = unintelligent response/comment, and totally off point.



What was irrelevant is your suggestion that the guy's physical state is what killed him. He was killed by the cop.

No he died because broke the law. Cause and effect.

Tax evasion is not a capital offense. If it were, a lot of our billionaires would be dead.

I broke the speed limit this morning, and didn't die. Cause but no effect.

He was killed by the cop.

Your flawed again. Being stopped by the police for your crime would be the cause. Effect would be running from the cops, being taken to the ground and dying from a heart attack.

Breaking a law in of itself wont kill anyone just as jumping from a plane wont kill you. But when you die skydiving it is absolutely the cause the led to you dying.

Thought you were a professor?

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

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Just some info


1. There is no doubt that Garner was resisting an arrest for illegally selling untaxed cigarettes. Former New York City Police Commissioner Bernard Kerik put it succinctly: "You cannot resist arrest. If Eric Garner did not resist arrest, the outcome of this case would have been very different," he told Newsmax. "He wouldn't be dead today.

"Regardless of what the arrest was for, the officers don't have the ability to say, 'Well, this is a minor arrest, so we're just going to ignore you.'"

2. The video of the July 17 incident clearly shows Garner, an African-American, swatting away the arms of a white officer seeking to take him into custody, telling him: "Don't touch me!"

3. Garner, 43, had history of more than 30 arrests dating back to 1980, on charges including assault and grand larceny.

4. At the time of his death, Garner was out on bail after being charged with illegally selling cigarettes, driving without a license, marijuana possession and false impersonation.

5. The chokehold that Patrolman Daniel Pantaleo put on Garner was reported to have contributed to his death. But Garner, who was 6-foot-3 and weighed 350 pounds, suffered from a number of health problems, including heart disease, severe asthma, diabetes, obesity, and sleep apnea. Pantaleo's attorney and police union officials argued that Garner's poor health was the main cause of his death.


6. Garner did not die at the scene of the confrontation. He suffered cardiac arrest in the ambulance taking him to the hospital and was pronounced dead about an hour later.

7. Much has been made of the fact that the use of chokeholds by police is prohibited in New York City. But officers reportedly still use them. Between 2009 and mid-2014, the Civilian Complaint Review Board received 1,128 chokehold allegations.

Patrick Lynch, president of the New York City Patrolmen's Benevolent Association, said: "It was clear that the officer's intention was to do nothing more than take Mr. Garner into custody as instructed, and that he used the takedown technique that he learned in the academy when Mr. Garner refused."

8. The grand jury began hearing the case on Sept. 29 and did not reach a decision until Wednesday, so there is much testimony that was presented that has not been made public.

9. The 23-member grand jury included nine non-white jurors.

10. In order to find Officer Pantaleo criminally negligent, the grand jury would have had to determine that he knew there was a "substantial risk" that Garner would have died due to the takedown.

11. Less than a month after Garner's death, Ramsey Orta, who shot the much-viewed videotape of the encounter, was indicted on weapons charges. Police alleged that Orta had slipped a .25-caliber handgun into a teenage accomplice's waistband outside a New York hotel.
!
"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

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devildog

***Ok multiple things going on here. The choke hold unless it caused trauma probably did not kill that guy. I think it was probably positional asphyxiation.



http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/forensic-expertagrees-city-autopsy-eric-garner-article-1.1946458

"After reviewing case files, photographs and X-rays, Baden said he agreed with the ruling that the 43-year-old Staten Island man died from compression of the neck.

...

A famed forensics expert hired by the family of police chokehold victim Eric Garner said Friday the city medical examiner’s autopsy was spot on.

Dr. Michael Baden — after reviewing case files, photographs and X-rays — said he agreed with the ruling that the 43-year-old Staten Island man died from compression of the neck. The medical examiner “did an excellent autopsy,” Baden said outside the ME’s office on First Ave. at E. 30th St."

Just a question...if the cause of death was due to "Compression of the Neck". Is it possible for someone who is killed or shall I say subjected to Compression of the Neck to be able to speak, "I can't breath, I can't breath". I'm thinking if the cause of the death was due to the above, would he not have been unconscious and in the process of asphyxiation?

And if he was so injured was there any fractures to the larynx or hyoid. In any case, there was very little done to access the victim to determine if he needed immediate medical care such as establishing a airway and someone giving him month to month. So I think based on the video after having watched it numerous time, there is grounds for civil action. Just my .02

(It seems this question was answered in Post #61) Sorry for the repeat.

I can't speak to any possible Federal charges.

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