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normiss

Another cop goes free.

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I have not followed the case but the "choke hold" lasted 17 seconds hardly enough to kill you unless he caused tracheal deviation. Also when EMS was carting him off they were not doing compressions, had him intubated, or was even bagging him. Which seems to me he was alive and not needing ALS at that point. I doubt they were just carrying off a dead man on a stretcher without covering him up, and if he did die on the scene CSI would have had to come out and mark up the scene before the moved him. So I doubt he was in AFib on scene and declared DOA with EMS.

Im gonna have to read this one thx.

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catfishhunter

Used to be part of the GP's of the street every smart and ALIVE criminal knew. Having an assaulting a police officer/resisting arrest on your jacket means your having a really bad day every time they run you. Something anyone with half a brain knew to avoid.



Oh yes, the good old days! Honest, community minded cops who knew when to use a bit of illegal brutality for a good cause, and gentleman criminals who knew they should stay in line (well, except for all the criminal shit they were doing, anyway) if they wanted to keep all their teeth.

I fucking love rose-tinted glasses.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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Also when EMS was carting him off they were not doing compressions, had him intubated, or was even bagging him. Which seems to me he was alive and not needing ALS at that point. I doubt they were just carrying off a dead man on a stretcher without covering him up, and if he did die on the scene CSI would have had to come out and mark up the scene before the moved him. So I doubt he was in AFib on scene and declared DOA with EMS.



Did you look at the Guardian link? There's a video of him lying on the ground, motionless for over 5 minutes before the ambulance gets there with a policeman occasionally trying to find a pulse on his neck (presumably in the vain hope that he might have somehow sprung back to life).

Now I'm not a doctor, but he looked kinda dead.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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jakee

***Used to be part of the GP's of the street every smart and ALIVE criminal knew. Having an assaulting a police officer/resisting arrest on your jacket means your having a really bad day every time they run you. Something anyone with half a brain knew to avoid.



Oh yes, the good old days! Honest, community minded cops who knew when to use a bit of illegal brutality for a good cause, and gentleman criminals who knew they should stay in line (well, except for all the criminal shit they were doing, anyway) if they wanted to keep all their teeth.

I fucking love rose-tinted glasses.

Don't do the crime if you cant do the time.

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

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catfishhunter

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Oh yes, the good old days! Honest, community minded cops who knew when to use a bit of illegal brutality for a good cause, and gentleman criminals who knew they should stay in line (well, except for all the criminal shit they were doing, anyway) if they wanted to keep all their teeth.

I fucking love rose-tinted glasses.



Don't do the crime if you cant do the time.



Oh, undoubtedly.

But what you're saying is, don't do the crime if you don't want a bunch of criminals in uniform to beat the shit out of you, for which crime they should not do time. Which is, quite frankly, a sick and perverted vision of the justice system.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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Ok multiple things going on here. The choke hold unless it caused trauma probably did not kill that guy. I think it was probably positional asphyxiation.
https://suite.io/erika-lyn-smith/5dvb2hk
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Positional asphyxiation is a fatal disorder occurring when the body is placed into a position that interferes with the mechanics of pulmonary ventilation or breathing. Postural asphyxia can occur in a variety of situations, although positional asphyxia is most common in situations where a violent or physically aggressive person is physically or mechanically restrained. These situations most commonly occur in settings where law enforcement officers or medical personnel must physically or mechanically restrain an agitated person to keep that person or others safe from harm.

There are many names for this condition, including postural asphyxia, restraint asphyxiation, and sudden in-custody death. Restraint or positional asphyxiation most commonly occurs in situations when someone is restrained on their stomach, face down or in a prone position. The risk of injury or death increases when the person is physically restrained by other people. A mechanical restraint includes handcuffs, ankle shackles, sheets, straps, leather restraints, towels, Velcro, ropes, or even tape used to keep the person from moving.



Whats even more scary, and I would say the people more at fault is EMS. Your taught even at a the most basic level to check ABC's first. The medic dicks around, doesn't open the airway properly, doesn't provide breaths, compressions, any ALS care. Just loads him up and walks away, at 6 minutes the brain begins to die. Someone better get their checkbooks ready for sure!

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Anvilbrother

Ok multiple things going on here. The choke hold unless it caused trauma probably did not kill that guy. I think it was probably positional asphyxiation.



http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/forensic-expertagrees-city-autopsy-eric-garner-article-1.1946458

"After reviewing case files, photographs and X-rays, Baden said he agreed with the ruling that the 43-year-old Staten Island man died from compression of the neck.

...

A famed forensics expert hired by the family of police chokehold victim Eric Garner said Friday the city medical examiner’s autopsy was spot on.

Dr. Michael Baden — after reviewing case files, photographs and X-rays — said he agreed with the ruling that the 43-year-old Staten Island man died from compression of the neck. The medical examiner “did an excellent autopsy,” Baden said outside the ME’s office on First Ave. at E. 30th St."
You stop breathing for a few minutes and everyone jumps to conclusions.

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Rstanley0312

***Cops can legally kill us?

wow.
Just wow.
Seriously?????



Ferguson the grand jury got right IMO. This one seems wrong on many levels. Anyone have anything to add to this that would say otherwise? This guy surrendered. This is horrible!

How exactly did he surrender when he stated "NOT TODAY, DIS ENDS TODAY" and then proceeded to fail his arms and pull away in an effort to resist being handcuffed? How is that surrendering?

I think that the simply solution to all of these police related deaths is to NOT RESIST/FIGHT the police. Comply and stay alive. There are better/smarter venues in which to fight the fight. On a shitty ghetto sidewalk isn't one of them.

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For the record choke holds (not saying this was or wasn't one) are NOT illegal in the state of New York (barring domestic situations). A choke hold is well within the limits of article 35 of the NYS Penal law. That being said, the legality or such a tactic has no bearing in a court of law. Choke holds are however against NYPD policy and as such the department can levy discipline up to and including termination if it finds that this officer violated department policy.

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Yea from what I read in the preliminary autopsy comments are that there was no trachea damage and the final reports said the neck compression along with "The autopsy determined the victim’s asthma, obesity and high blood pressure were also contributing factors in his death." It also stated "Also, the four EMTs who apparently did nothing to aid Garner have been banned from responding to calls until the investigation is complete. They are not employed by the Fire Department."

So it wasn't the "choke" airway damage that killed him, and also the EMT's were in hot water as I suspected.

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"Im sorry sir with his size and weight it was an extenuating circumstance that required me to perform the choke hold as it was my last resort before using lethal force." I got you covered Normiss:D


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Andy9o8

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DIS



Blatant racism on your part.



Not racism but reality.

And no, a loose cigarette isn't worth a life nor is a world full of smokes for that matter. Something Mr. Gardner should have thought of before he decided to resist a lawful arrest.

There are no winners in this case or the one in MO but there are lessons to be learned.

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Im not saying anything past the time the cops showed up was ok, but gonna talk about before that.

1. If he would not have been breaking the law this would not have happened PERIOD.

2. If your argument was that he was just selling illegal cigs, and that's a bullshit law, get mad at the law and the people who made the law that gave the cops the reason to have been making contact with him in the first place............................................................................................





...Ok then get mad at the cops:D


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1. If he would not have been breaking the law this would not have happened PERIOD.

Most of us break the law; most of us break it every time we drive. And I'd submit that breaking the speeding and turn signal requirements is at least as dangerous to the public good as selling cigs.

However, most of us here on dz.com don't look as "suspicious." It's easier for us, and it's chickenshit not to admit it.

Wendy P.
There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

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When you were a kid and was off doing something you shouldn't have and it went all wrong what did mom always say? If you would have had your ass where you were supposed to be, doing what you should have been doing this would not have happened.

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I was the kid who pretty much always got away with it, whatever "it" was. Yeah, I took responsibility when caught, but basically no one ever suspected me of doing wrong. I was a pretty good kid, but definitely not perfect.

Blonde, blue-eyed, pink skin, soft spoken, good vocabulary -- why would anyone suspect me? :|. and yes, of course I took advantage of it and didn't confess whenever I didn't have to. I'm human too. :)
Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

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As a young man I was arrested and jailed on several occasions. Never once, not one time, have I ever been assaulted by the arresting officer.

The New Year celebration, 1961/62, in New Orleans found Bourbon Street typically packed. Rumor had it someone was stabbed at Pat O'Brien's and the NOPD started clearing the street in mass. They lined up paddy wagons and started arresting the merry makers. I was selected to make an example, along with hundreds. My paddy wagon was completely filled along the sides and down the middle. I was the only one not bleeding from a head wound.

Never give someone in authority an opportunity to fulfill their role. These fools can't seem to grasp the concept. But, on the upside it provides an income stream for the attorneys.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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RonD1120

As a young man I was arrested and jailed on several occasions. Never once, not one time, have I ever been assaulted by the arresting officer.



Hold your hand in front of you, and contemplate its color. There's your explanation, your 1961 anecdote notwithstanding.

Anyone who thinks that the usual reason why black people get their asses kicked by cops is because they're resisting is naive indeed.

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