What's everyone's opinion on convicted and registered sex offenders being TI's?

[normiss 620]

Depends on the position of the FAA's knickers I expect.
Lying on the form is a federal felony.

Which confuses me even more as I left all those little boxes blank on mine.

[LuckyMcSwervy 0]

My opinion is no fucking way. Just what someone needs. Being strapped to the lap of a convicted sexual offender. The TI getting their jollies "legally".

As someone who has been sexually assaulted, if I know you're a predator I will scream from the rooftops to keep others from becoming another one of your victims, physically and mentally. I still have fucking nightmares and I don't wish that hell on my worst enemy.

I hope people reread the links Amazon posted about someone amongst us being raped. The DZ shouldn't be thought of as your "safe place" with so many transient people and all of the drugs being freely consumed.

Always be kinder than you feel.

[kelpdiver 2]

Doug_Davis

You are right. Even Match.com got sued and is finally running every member through the national sex offender registry after losing the law suit.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/TECH/web/04/18/match.rape.lawsuit/

Match didn't lose the suit, they settled fairly quickly. It announced shortly after the filing of the suit that it would start screening, and a few months later the plaintiff of the would be class action suit agreed to the policy changes offered by Match and ended the suit.

[promise5 17]

kelpdiver

***
You are right. Even Match.com got sued and is finally running every member through the national sex offender registry after losing the law suit.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/TECH/web/04/18/match.rape.lawsuit/

Match didn't lose the suit, they settled fairly quickly. It announced shortly after the filing of the suit that it would start screening, and a few months later the plaintiff of the would be class action suit agreed to the policy changes offered by Match and ended the suit.

I think there was another site that was also sued.

No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible.
Believe me I tried.

[turtlespeed 212]

billvon

>pedophilia in particular has an extremely high rate of recidivism.

Recidivism rates from the Bureau of Justice statistics, 3 year reconviction rate:

Homicide 20.9%
Assault 44.8%
Other violent 33.9%
Robbery 47%
Rape 27.5%
Other sexual 23.3%

So if you have:

a former thief on staff you have a 47% chance he'll be convicted of theft within 3 years of being released (how much are those tandem rigs worth?)

a violent criminal on staff you have a 34-44% chance of him being convicted within 3 years (perhaps of "taking it out to the parking lot" with a student who pissed him off?)

A rapist or other sex offender on staff you have a 23-28% chance of him being re-arrested within 3 years (perhaps due to groping a female student?)

So overall your odds are better with the sex offender. (Although your odds are the best with none of the above.)

Why would you EVER want those people working for you as a DZO?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[normiss 620]

I'm pretty sure they all have been.

What's the "god's dating website" that had the rapist?
Weren't they also sued?

Why would god chose that?

Oh. Sorry.

wrong thread, right forum.

[billvon 2,380]

>Why would you EVER want those people working for you as a DZO?

I wouldn't want any of them working for me. But then again I'm not a DZO - so I can be VERY picky.

[normiss 620]

[bigbearfng 9]

Public sex offender data bases are what keeps them from reoffending more often. They don't change.
The majority are situational offenders-if they are ever in that same situation again they will reoffend. So everyone knows not to let the guy babysit and he won't reoffend.
Then you have the 8% that are always on the hunt-Preferably send their cases to Dexter instead of the DA.
And yea-let's not forget about the victims.

[tkhayes 124]

that may be, but the 'sex offender' definition is pretty vast. Lots of people struck a plea deal for whatever 'crime' they committed and that is what it included. Including the simple case of a 19 year old having sex with a 16 year old girlfriend. Sure there are plenty of heinous crimes out there as well.

Are people who trade in child porn lining up to be tandem instructors? Are they a risk to your tandem passenger? I doubt it. They are probably just chronic masturbators.

and a hundred other examples.

If sex offenders committed their offenses during skydives, then I would support some sort of action I suppose.

But they do not that I am aware of. It is kind of like the felon whose crime was robbing banks not getting a job driving a forklift truck because he is a 'risk'. The two are completely unrelated.

We already make it impossible for anyone convicted of a crime to reintegrate into society. And we are the world leader of that failed policy.

[DanG 1]

Quote

Public sex offender data bases are what keeps them from reoffending more often. They don't change.
The majority are situational offenders-if they are ever in that same situation again they will reoffend. So everyone knows not to let the guy babysit and he won't reoffend.
Then you have the 8% that are always on the hunt

And you know all this, how?

- Dan G

[freethefly 6]

I seem to recall a suicide some years back committed by a jumper who was known for jumping with a dog. If I am recalling right, he was arrested for molesting children. Not sure what ratings he held. Point is, you never really know about anyone.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[Darius11 12]

promise5

Was discussing this with someone and I thought about asking here. But I want to be clear. I'm talking about those that have been convicted and then required to register. Also I'm not talking about an 18 year old guy that slept with his 16 year old girlfriend. I'm talking about those that have been convicted of a serious sex crime.

OK there is no way to really know the details of every case, if there was way to know for sure its not some 18 year old slept with his 16 year old girl friend and its only cases of assault and rape, or child rape then yes I would not be ok with them being hired.

There is no second chance in such cases, to me your talking about wiring its the same as asking a gay man not to like dudes, or me to not find woman attractive. It will never happen as long as i have my balls (literally).

I believe most experts agree the only way to prevent offenders from re-offending is by medical or physical castration.

To Amazone: i 100 % disagree with your comment about predators at the DZ, getting people drunk.....where does personal responsibility come in. If you lose control when you drink too much don;t drink too much. I think that way of thinking and such cases is why people don't feel as a serious as they should about real rape. If you get drunk and have sex that you didn't want to have it was not forced on you then you need to be an ADULT and take responsibility.

I feel nothing for stupid people who then want to blame others and call rape when its just a bad decision by all parties involved, and at the same time people who have committed violent rape IMO should be castrated or executed. So yea fuck there TI job IF they have committed such a crime. But there is no way to make sure :(
My .02

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[bigbearfng 9]

The majority have gotten plea bargains-so their actual conviction is for lot lessor charges. As for the statutory rape/sexual battery convictions they do have to register, however they are no post and don't even show up on the public data bases.
As for the apologists for kiddie porn-hey some asshole made that pic of a 10 yr old kid giving him a BJ; think of it this way-if it was your kid victimized wouldn't you want all those guys out there getting off on looking at it have to suffer some consequences? Also otherwise just basic supply and demand with no consequences they're going to keep victimizing kids and putting those pics/videos out there at an even higher rate.
As to how I know-years working in a CAC detail. (Crimes Against Children)

[DanG 1]

Quote

I believe most experts agree the only way to prevent offenders from re-offending is by medical or physical castration.

Citation, please.

- Dan G

[Amazon 7]

Darius11

***Was discussing this with someone and I thought about asking here. But I want to be clear. I'm talking about those that have been convicted and then required to register. Also I'm not talking about an 18 year old guy that slept with his 16 year old girlfriend. I'm talking about those that have been convicted of a serious sex crime.

OK there is no way to really know the details of every case, if there was way to know for sure its not some 18 year old slept with his 16 year old girl friend and its only cases of assault and rape, or child rape then yes I would not be ok with them being hired.

There is no second chance in such cases, to me your talking about wiring its the same as asking a gay man not to like dudes, or me to not find woman attractive. It will never happen as long as i have my balls (literally).

I believe most experts agree the only way to prevent offenders from re-offending is by medical or physical castration.

To Amazone: i 100 % disagree with your comment about predators at the DZ, getting people drunk.....where does personal responsibility come in. If you lose control when you drink too much don;t drink too much. I think that way of thinking and such cases is why people don't feel as a serious as they should about real rape. If you get drunk and have sex that you didn't want to have it was not forced on you then you need to be an ADULT and take responsibility.

I feel nothing for stupid people who then want to blame others and call rape when its just a bad decision by all parties involved, and at the same time people who have committed violent rape IMO should be castrated or executed. So yea fuck there TI job IF they have committed such a crime. But there is no way to make sure :(
My .02

My comments were more of a cautionary note to those who do not know what they are letting themselves into at the DZ or at a boogie and go to places where there is a very prevalent use of substances to lower inhibitions and not always with the best of motives. A party is not always just a party as evidenced by how many frat parties or other instances where interesting things are added to the liquid entertainment?? This is not a post designed to keep DUDES from getting their groove on but for all involved.. I would say... keep your wits about you and realize those people and behaviors are out there.

Edited to add. especially after rereading.
No means NO

RAPE STATISTICS
http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/reporting-rates

Sexual assault is one of the most under reported crimes, with 60% still being left unreported



SO I guess a DUDES desire to get his dick wet trumps "some bitches" desire to live a happy productive life, because after a rape.. telling her to suck it up and get over it is not what one would call a "viable option" and it does seem to happen all over the world

[DanG 1]

Do you have an opinion on the New Yorker article I posted upthread?

- Dan G

[billvon 2,380]

>Public sex offender data bases are what keeps them from reoffending more
>often. They don't change.

A friend of mine works with juvenile sex offenders. From what she has experienced in her professional life, you're wrong there.

[promise5 17]

This was sent to me, so I thought I would post it myself



This is legally tricky.

First, given the legal climate in the U.S., it is highly unlikely that clients will be minors. They will all be 18+ as few DZs allow minors to tandem, as a minor cannot sign a legally binding contract.
The part where the DZO has a good reason to get reason to get the heebies over employing this person is, thanks to Agency, the DZO is liable for the actions of their employees. Do you want a convicted sex offender strapping their body against clients? The most harmless playful tickle of that sorority girl as "Geronimo!" Is yelled, leaning out the door - well, maybe she laughs and thinks it was harmless fun. Maybe she gets angry and complains to the DZO. Maybe she has issues or was assssulted in the past, and she sues the drop zone, or files assault charges against that guy. His past will come out, and it will go horribly for the DZ.
Sorry, that offender is a liability time bomb. The only way I would employee them is if I had a personal relationship (Eg brother in law) and had a high trust factor. And then I still wouldn't put them in physical contact scenarios. Teach the AFF ground school. Fly camera as videographer. Pack. Work manifest. Be involved in a way that you don't physically interact with clients - ever. And again ONLY with high trust level. NEVER LEFT ALONE WITH CLIENTS. NEVER.
Agency law , folks, is why corp America drug tests, credit checks and breathes down the neck of employees. Liability.

No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible.
Believe me I tried.

[bigbearfng 9]

DanG

Do you have an opinion on the New Yorker article I posted upthread?

Lots of different areas covered in that article.
To start-do I feel sorry for the guy? No.
The Adam Walsh Act has many facets to it; the section dealing with incarceration past sentencing has been controversial and always will be. I feel that it was an unknown that is being sorted out and can and should be useful; that's the psychologist's area and there are good and incompetent amongst them as in any profession. As it stands now in order to get a sex offender designated as an SVP (Sexually Violent Predator) it takes numerous horrendous convictions on their record.
As for "not true" amongst juvenile offenders-how about when they're older and well out of the juvenile system? I certainly hope no one ever loses site of the victims.

[DanG 1]

Quote

As it stands now in order to get a sex offender designated as an SVP (Sexually Violent Predator) it takes numerous horrendous convictions on their record.

It doesn't seem that way from the anecdotal evidence in that article. It seems more like one strike and you're out, potentially for life.

Quote

As for "not true" amongst juvenile offenders...

I don't follow you. What are you referring to?

- Dan G

[bigbearfng 9]

Sorry mixed that reply to Billvon in with yours.

And nope it's not a "one strike". I've submitted a request on a sex offender before with all records and they said it had to be based on his actual convictions (that were plead down) and not on the elements of the crimes. So denied.

[kelpdiver 2]

bigbearfng

And nope it's not a "one strike". I've submitted a request on a sex offender before with all records and they said it had to be based on his actual convictions (that were plead down) and not on the elements of the crimes. So denied.

This varies by state, so you're making an unsupportable blanket statement.

At the worst example, we have those teenage kids who received and forward cell phone pics of naked classmates getting branded as sex offender for distribution of child pornography.

[promise5 17]

I have found it interesting that there seems to be so much concern for the perpetrators of these types of crimes. I've really never come across this as much as I have since discussing this topic. Maybe it's the way I grew up.

When did we reach the point that we are so concerned about the people that commit such crimes instead of the victims of the crimes. It was THEIR CHOICE and THEIR BAD DECISION that got them on that list to begin with. Maybe they have changed,maybe they will never commit such an act again,maybe it was 15-20 years ago an they've got a perfect record since. Ok fine good for them they've turned their life around. Great. I give them credit for it. But, I'm sorry the victim didn't have a choice in the matter and it can and does effect the rest of their lives. Yes,through good maybe even great counseling and therapy which is also EXPENSIVE they move on and live amazing lives. There still is the potential for triggers for them, for times of regression in the healing.

Yet, we are more concerned with the perpetrators and them not having something held against them for the rest of their lives or have it effect the rest of their lives.
Wow and wow!

Oh did we even mention the families of these victims? The boyfriends, the husbands, the parents or even the children that are also affected ? The counseling that they might need.

But hey the guy did his time and he's moved on and we shouldn't "punish him" for a bad choice he made or a series of bad choices.

Again, WOW!!!
As I said I believe he has the right to enjoy this sport. Skydive as much as he wants. But WHY does he have to be a TI or any type of instructor?
It was his choices that got him on the registry to begin with. So accept he should accept that he will have limitations to things he can do and not being able to be an instructor is one of them.

No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible.
Believe me I tried.

[kelpdiver 2]

bigbearfng

Public sex offender data bases are what keeps them from reoffending more often. They don't change.
The majority are situational offenders-if they are ever in that

I've seen this claim before, but it defies any reason.

For the registry to be the magic tool that stops offending (rather than the more obvious explanation) presupposes that everyone looks at it and has a photographic memory of every person within say a 10 or 20 mile radius. Sure you could know the handful within a mile, but last I checked, sex offenders can still drive cars or take the bus.

California is debating a change to the registry because with 100k listed (and a 5% reoffense rate), it's become effectively useless. Too much data to make any use of. Proposals to tier the entries and expire out after 10 or 20 years the unlikelies.

Unfortunately, it's nearly impossible to have a rational discussion on the topic of baby fuckers, so it's very unlikely that this result in meaningful improvement.