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regulator

New california gun control laws working like a champ

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Well, they didn't do nothing in his case. Evidently they saw some of his YouTube videos and called the police to go check on him... ...but failed to share the videos with the police. Police are not psychiatrists so unless they find newspaper clippings, strings, and pushpins all over the walls or he's having a schizophrenic episode when they get there it's not likely they were going to bring him in for being crazy.

The ironic thing about a loner posting videos threatening violence on his or her YouTube channel is that they probably have very few if any subscribers so it's unlikely many people will see it and send it to authorities.

Edited to add: I find the statement from the family that was given through their attorney shortly after the rampage that they are "staunchly against guns" to be in very poor taste.

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champu

Well, they didn't do nothing in his case. Evidently they saw some of his YouTube videos and called the police to go check on him... ...but failed to share the videos with the police. Police are not psychiatrists so unless they find newspaper clippings, strings, and pushpins all over the walls or he's having a schizophrenic episode when they get there it's not likely they were going to bring him in for being crazy.

The ironic thing about a loner posting videos threatening violence on his or her YouTube channel is that they probably have very few if any subscribers so it's unlikely many people will see it and send it to authorities.

Edited to add: I find the statement from the family that was given through their attorney shortly after the rampage that they are "staunchly against guns" to be in very poor taste.




Or.. that prohibition in their home against guns led him to acquire several once he could aqnd he did so legally. It is kind of like how a preachers daughter acts when she gets away from the stifling atmosphere of the parents home.
Forbidden fuit and all of that... without any form of training in how to be responsible with the weapons.

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normiss

I doubt he was trained on responsible knife and auto ownership either.



True.

That training is more likely to be available to school aged children though. Driver's Ed courses, shop classes, outdoor youth programs.

It used to be that gentlemen carried pocket knives. I'm currently the one in the office someone comes to if they need a pocket knife. Nobody else carries a knife. They're not commonplace anymore. And it seems nobody is taught how to use them.

Driver's ed was probably not on Rodger's agenda. He likely had a driver where most kids are learning to drive.

Gun safety? That's right out. Apparently guns are evil, not the people who use them. So parents don't want their kids taught about them. Would Rodger have snapped if he'd had a gun safety class? Probably... It's not about the guns. It's about the violent actor. Who in this case killed as many with a blade as with a gun.
--
Rob

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Quote

It used to be that gentlemen carried pocket knives. I'm currently the one in the office someone comes to if they need a pocket knife. Nobody else carries a knife. They're not commonplace anymore. And it seems nobody is taught how to use them.



Blame ballpoint pens and pencil sharpeners, toss in computers for good measure.

The reason most office workers in the old days carried knives had to do with writing. That has slowly faded over the decades. Very few people need a pocket knife in their daily office lives today.

I suspect a LOT of people who carried pocket knives after the turn of the 20th century also were heavily influenced by the Boy Scouts who made carrying a pocket knife a rite of passage and it just stuck with them.

I think I have my old Totin' Chip buried somewhere in a cigar box in a drawer.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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I carry one every day.
Spare in my desk drawer in case I forget.

I have a large box full of them at home. Some inherited from dad and my grandfather.

I foresee mush as the only menu item at a steak house without them.

They are but a tool. One I can't do without.

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quade



I think I have my old Totin' Chip buried somewhere in a cigar box in a drawer.



At least you were taught proper use. I'm amazed to find teenagers (boys and girls both) who fear using a small pocket knife.

Yeah, I suppose pens and pencil sharpeners are to blame. To me it's a great tool. The original multi-tool.
--
Rob

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normiss

I carry one every day.
Spare in my desk drawer in case I forget.

I have a large box full of them at home. Some inherited from dad and my grandfather.

I foresee mush as the only menu item at a steak house without them.

They are but a tool. One I can't do without.



http://www.artofmanliness.com/2008/04/01/every-man-should-carry-a-pocket-knife/

Quote

Why a Man Should Carry a Pocket Knife

How many times have you been in a situation where you’ve said to yourself, “Damn, a knife would be really handy now!” Here are a few instances when a pocket knife can come in handy or just make the simple things in life more enjoyable:

1. Opening a box.

2. Cutting rope, tags, and string.

3. Cutting an apple. I love eating an apple that I’ve cut with my pocket knife, slice by slice. You feel like a bad ass doing it. You hold the apple in your non-dominant hand and then make a slice with the knife using your dominant hand. After you make the slice, pinch it between your thumb and knife blade. Bring the blade to your mouth and deposit the apple slice.

4. Opening a letter. Sure, you could use your finger, but using a knife is just more manly.

5. Weapon. Not the most effective, but it’s better than nothing.

6. Camping. How else will you sharpen the point of a stick in preparation for stabbing your prey? And by prey I mean hot dog.

7. You never know when you’re going to have to MacGyver your way out of a crisis. Be prepared.

8. You need something to clench in your teeth when swinging from a rope.

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kallend


This immature and mentally ill young man (Rodger) is a classic example of someone who could legally obtain a firearm due entirely to the toothless laws that we have in place.



You mean a classic example where there is no viable process that would have filtered out this one guy and not hundreds of thousands of others. There are lots of angry virgins out there. The ones that act out are rounding errors. Maybe we will see more information in the weeks to come, but so far there are no events that point out to a gap. Hell, they even sent a LEO over to check him out.

Saying it was obvious here, in hindsight, is cheap and easy, but doesn't solve any problem. You have to translate it into an actual policy with actual language. Something you've been loath to do. One newsreporter says something vague about Asperger's and there's a mob ready to make new policy based on fear, not science.

And of course would have done nothing to save his housemates, or the cyclists he ran over, or the car he crashed into.

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normiss

Here's our problem.
We understand the need for and the use of tools.

These crazy fucks don't.
We need to stop the crazies.



Exactly, a gun is nothing more than a tool. It is no more different in this way from a car. A gun is an extension to our hands as a car is to our feet. I can easily kill a person with my hands but, far easier with a gun. I can easily walk a mile for a Camel but, far easier to drive.

Responsibility? Apparently he showed enough responsibility to get a driver's license as well as a gun. One only need to scan the many times similar acts have been committed. Those guilty have ranged in ages from the teens to the very elderly. These people were responsible, law abiding citizens. Or, so they may appear to be but, many of these people had exhibited odd behavior. Such is the case with this guy. Yet, had someone tried to deny him his right to own a gun the NRA and the GOP would had stood strong behind him (recall the schizophrenic who talked to imaginary bears, John Rich, are you out there?) up until he started shooting. The question is, how do you sort them out? Who should be denied a gun. You are denied for a felony conviction. Problem is most of these types of killers have never even had a parking ticket. Often is the case for most everyday people who just kill another for whatever reason. The only solution is to narrow the laws. Scrap the bad and refine what works.

As for the knife and car? It is weak to even compare with a gun. True that you can kill just as easy with either or you can just pick up a rock and bash someones brains out. Should this guy been denied the privilege to drive? He surely was a ticking bomb, as he had shown. Yet, he hadn't committed any crime. There are many ticking bombs out there. Some will explode, some will never. You just can't start taking away certain items due to what one may consider odd behavior. Is there a criteria somewhere that we should be aware of. What do take away? I can see that a gun should be taken from those who exhibit intent to harm but, what about the person who thinks he's Jesus? What about a car. Sure, Jesus would have no need for a car but, what about JFK (as long as it's not a convertible). The person who shows intent? There are a lot of people who are angry but, never act. And what about that knife? I bought my Kabar 1081 when I was around 8 or 9 years old. I still carry it today. Carry it everyday. I could do real damage with a two inch blade, up close. Much easier with a gun a few feet back. Knifes are easy to get. So easy an 8 year old kid can buy one at the Ben Franklin five and dime.

Yup, some people should never drive, some should never touch sharp things and some should never touch a gun, some should never touch any type of tool. We just never know when someone will use them to kill. In this case, he used the three tools that echos in every argument on gun rights.
"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

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He was evidently too immature to buy a car as well but you can't legislate against those things.

Guy was a fuck up.

I say this time and again to people, I'm a Brit who loves the USA and the US people. It's a great country with a lot to offer and I have friends and family who live over there and are US citizens.

BUT, the reason there are these shootings aren't because there are guns but because there is something deeply wrong with the psyche of the USA.

Switzerland is full of guns - how many mass shootings do they have?

In the UK the countryside if full of shotguns and hunting rifles, even a few straight pull AR-15's - how many mass shootings? Even when handguns were legal there was one mass shooting and that caused the ban (and people are still being killed by handguns in the UK)

France - country is full of legal weapons, the only thing France can't have is full auto. Mass shootings? A couple but done with ILLEGAL firearms.

I could go on, but guns ARE NOT the problem in the USA. The American psyche is.....

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Andy9o8

***I carry one every day.
Spare in my desk drawer in case I forget.

I have a large box full of them at home. Some inherited from dad and my grandfather.

I foresee mush as the only menu item at a steak house without them.

They are but a tool. One I can't do without.



http://www.artofmanliness.com/2008/04/01/every-man-should-carry-a-pocket-knife/

Quote

Why a Man Should Carry a Pocket Knife

How many times have you been in a situation where you’ve said to yourself, “Damn, a knife would be really handy now!” Here are a few instances when a pocket knife can come in handy or just make the simple things in life more enjoyable:

1. Opening a box.

2. Cutting rope, tags, and string.

3. Cutting an apple. I love eating an apple that I’ve cut with my pocket knife, slice by slice. You feel like a bad ass doing it. You hold the apple in your non-dominant hand and then make a slice with the knife using your dominant hand. After you make the slice, pinch it between your thumb and knife blade. Bring the blade to your mouth and deposit the apple slice.

4. Opening a letter. Sure, you could use your finger, but using a knife is just more manly.

5. Weapon. Not the most effective, but it’s better than nothing.

6. Camping. How else will you sharpen the point of a stick in preparation for stabbing your prey? And by prey I mean hot dog.

7. You never know when you’re going to have to MacGyver your way out of a crisis. Be prepared.

8. You need something to clench in your teeth when swinging from a rope.



9. Emergency tracheostomy.

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Backintothesky

Switzerland is full of guns - how many mass shootings do they have?



If you want to make US requirements for gun ownership the SAME as requirements for gun ownership in Switzerland, then go for it.

I think you might want to look into what that is though.

I have a feeling the NRA isn't going to go for it.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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Backintothesky


I could go on, but guns ARE NOT the problem in the USA. The American psyche is.....



I would say you're wrong on the American psyche being the problem. Every country has their nutbags that should not get their hands on a gun. Wasn't there a mass murder somewhere in Norway a few years back where one guy went bonkers?

What we have is a mental illness problem, and it's a world-wide problem.
"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

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