Does having a gun in the home make you safer?

[Cajundude 0]

kallend

***Absolutely a gun makes me feel safer in the home and on my person. I pity the robber or the home invader that comes in my direction.

BTW, how are all those gun laws in Chicago working out for you and your city? It really does keep the guns out of the hands of the criminals doesn't it?

Lake Wobegon effect in action.

Or Dunning-Kruger.

Maybe both.

Uhhhhh, I think you may need a reality check and direct this back at yourself. Please… Lol

[kallend 1,621]

Cajundude

BTW, how are all those gun laws in Chicago working out for you and your city? It really does keep the guns out of the hands of the criminals doesn't it?

news.yahoo.com/2013-ends-big-drop-homicides-chicago-212612071.html

Chicago's murder rate is lower than:

New Orleans
Atlanta
Orlando
Birmingham AL
Detroit
St. Louis
Memphis
Cleveland
Baltimore
Baton Rouge
Jackson MS
Mobile
Philadelphia
Montgomery AL

and a whole bunch of others in "gun friendly" states.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Cajundude 0]

kallend

***
BTW, how are all those gun laws in Chicago working out for you and your city? It really does keep the guns out of the hands of the criminals doesn't it?

news.yahoo.com/2013-ends-big-drop-homicides-chicago-212612071.html

Chicago's murder rate is lower than:

New Orleans
Atlanta
Orlando
Birmingham AL
Detroit
St. Louis
Memphis
Cleveland
Baltimore
Baton Rouge
Jackson MS
Mobile
Philadelphia
Montgomery AL

and a whole bunch of others in "gun friendly" states.

You mean liberal friendly. All these cities are run by Democrats. See a pattern here?

[kallend 1,621]

Cajundude

******
BTW, how are all those gun laws in Chicago working out for you and your city? It really does keep the guns out of the hands of the criminals doesn't it?

news.yahoo.com/2013-ends-big-drop-homicides-chicago-212612071.html

Chicago's murder rate is lower than:

New Orleans
Atlanta
Orlando
Birmingham AL
Detroit
St. Louis
Memphis
Cleveland
Baltimore
Baton Rouge
Jackson MS
Mobile
Philadelphia
Montgomery AL

and a whole bunch of others in "gun friendly" states.

You mean liberal friendly. All these cities are run by Democrats. See a pattern here?

So all those cities have stricter gun laws than Chicago? Really?

You are clearly into self-delusion.

A classic case of Dunning-Kruger effect.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Cajundude 0]

kallend

*********
BTW, how are all those gun laws in Chicago working out for you and your city? It really does keep the guns out of the hands of the criminals doesn't it?

news.yahoo.com/2013-ends-big-drop-homicides-chicago-212612071.html

Chicago's murder rate is lower than:

New Orleans
Atlanta
Orlando
Birmingham AL
Detroit
St. Louis
Memphis
Cleveland
Baltimore
Baton Rouge
Jackson MS
Mobile
Philadelphia
Montgomery AL

and a whole bunch of others in "gun friendly" states.

You mean liberal friendly. All these cities are run by Democrats. See a pattern here?

So all those cities have stricter gun laws than Chicago? Really?

You are clearly into self-delusion.

A classic case of Dunning-Kruger effect.

No, you are under the delusion that a city is a state. What we have here are cities with a concentration of freeloading welfare criminals spawned from crooked Democrat leadership. Just about every liberal run city is a cesspool.

[kallend 1,621]

Cajundude

************
BTW, how are all those gun laws in Chicago working out for you and your city? It really does keep the guns out of the hands of the criminals doesn't it?

news.yahoo.com/2013-ends-big-drop-homicides-chicago-212612071.html

Chicago's murder rate is lower than:

New Orleans
Atlanta
Orlando
Birmingham AL
Detroit
St. Louis
Memphis
Cleveland
Baltimore
Baton Rouge
Jackson MS
Mobile
Philadelphia
Montgomery AL

and a whole bunch of others in "gun friendly" states.

You mean liberal friendly. All these cities are run by Democrats. See a pattern here?

So all those cities have stricter gun laws than Chicago? Really?

You are clearly into self-delusion.

A classic case of Dunning-Kruger effect.

No, you are under the delusion that a city is a state. What we have here are cities with a concentration of freeloading welfare criminals spawned from crooked Democrat leadership. Just about every liberal run city is a cesspool.

Fascinating that when you're proven wrong about Chicago's crime rate being exceptional among US cities, you suddenly move the goalposts to something totally irrelevant, as if you think we're too stupid to notice.

So tell us, how many of those high murder rate cities have tougher gun laws than Chicago?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[craddock 0]

kallend

Fascinating that when you're proven wrong about Chicago's crime rate being exceptional among US cities, you suddenly move the goalposts to something totally irrelevant, as if you think we're too stupid to notice.

Chicago's crime rate is suddenly normal because it lowered a little this year? So John Kallend does not find Chicago's crime rate exceptional because he found that it is not the worst in the US.

Is Chicago's crime rate normal? Acceptable? What would is need to rise to to be exceptional?

That spot isn't bad at all, the winds were strong and that was the issue! It was just on the downwind side.

[Cajundude 0]

kallend

Fascinating that when you're proven wrong about Chicago's crime rate being exceptional among US cities, you suddenly move the goalposts to something totally irrelevant, as if you think we're too stupid to notice.

So tell us, how many of those high murder rate cities have tougher gun laws than Chicago?

Uhhhh, how am I being proven wrong? I never said Chicago had the highest. Besides, I'm not changing the subject, I'm pointing out the problem. Your problem is that you can not think past the piece of metal (the gun).

[Cajundude 0]

Furthermore, every city has crime and some more than the others. And yes, even Southern states including the one I am in now, Texas. To further narrow it down for you, Houston, further narrow it down, 18th District. Most of that district is a turdhole. Guess who runs that one… Sheila Jackson Lee.

I happen to live in Ron Paul's district (now Weber). Night and day difference in crime rates and practically back up to each other.

[quade 3]

Cajundude

Night and day difference in crime rates and practically back up to each other.

Are you sure or are you only looking at specific types of crimes? Obvious, violent street crime, you might be right, but my guess is that crime of a different type is higher in the less violent area. I'm not saying it all balances out, but "white collar" crime rates tend to happen a lot more in affluent areas. Power cocaine tends to happen more in affluent areas than crack. Crack tends to happen more in impoverished.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Cajundude 0]

quade

***Night and day difference in crime rates and practically back up to each other.

Are you sure or are you only looking at specific types of crimes? Obvious, violent street crime, you might be right, but my guess is that crime of a different type is higher in the less violent area. I'm not saying it all balances out, but "white collar" crime rates tend to happen a lot more in affluent areas. Power cocaine tends to happen more in affluent areas than crack. Crack tends to happen more in impoverished.

True, and no I have not done research not the types of crimes. There is lots of white collar crime everywhere for sure but we are talking about a gun making you safer and where I live I would feel much safer not having a gun than if I lived in any of the places mentioned above...

[Cajundude 0]

Also, white collar crime is not kicking my door off its hinges in the middle of the night. I ail always have a gun because it is my right to have one. I'm not paranoid, I'd rather be prepared if someone does kick that door in or some psycho tries to shoot up a mall that I am in, or a theater, or whatever...

[quade 3]

Cajundude

...and where I live I would feel much safer...

But the question isn't how you'd feel. It's how you'd actually be.

While some individuals may in fact be safer, statistically as a whole, that is not the case.

Looked at another way, if you were a life insurance company, would you charge more or less for life insurance for people living in households with guns. The smart money says you would charge more. Significantly more.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Cajundude 0]

quade

***...and where I live I would feel much safer...

But the question isn't how you'd feel. It's how you'd actually be.

While some individuals may in fact be safer, statistically as a whole, that is not the case.

Looked at another way, if you were a life insurance company, would you charge more or less for life insurance for people living in households with guns. The smart money says you would charge more. Significantly more.

For registered gun owners? No, if I were an insurance company I would have an exclusion in the policy that stated something to the nature of an accident death by a firearm in the insured's residence would be a denial. I have no patience when it comes to people acting stupid with guns or leaving them out for kids to get.

As far as the criminals with guns, they would not be able to track that and if guns were outlawed, guess who is still going to have the guns… the bad guys...

[Cajundude 0]

I didn't answer your first question on how I would feel. I will always feel safer because I will never be without one.

[kallend 1,621]

craddock

***
Fascinating that when you're proven wrong about Chicago's crime rate being exceptional among US cities, you suddenly move the goalposts to something totally irrelevant, as if you think we're too stupid to notice.

Chicago's crime rate is suddenly normal because it lowered a little this year? So John Kallend does not find Chicago's crime rate exceptional because he found that it is not the worst in the US.

Is Chicago's crime rate normal? Acceptable? What would is need to rise to to be exceptional?

By the standards of every other developed western nation, ALL US cities have exceptional murder rates

Why do you all worry so much about Chicago? It's not even in the top 20, yet no one posts on here about St. Louis, or Baltimore, or Memphis, or Nashville, or Orlando, or Miami, or Cleveland, or New Orleans, or Baton Rouge, or ... all of which have higher murder rates.

I suggest you do a little casting out of logs in your own eyes before worrying about specks in others' eyes.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,621]

Cajundude

***

Fascinating that when you're proven wrong about Chicago's crime rate being exceptional among US cities, you suddenly move the goalposts to something totally irrelevant, as if you think we're too stupid to notice.

So tell us, how many of those high murder rate cities have tougher gun laws than Chicago?

Uhhhh, how am I being proven wrong? I never said Chicago had the highest. Besides, I'm not changing the subject, I'm pointing out the problem. (the gun).

So why bring up Chicago in the first place? YOU chose to do that. Why not choose Baton Rouge or New Orleans?

Oh, of course, Obama isn't from Cajun country.

Check out this list: www.neighborhoodscout.com/neighborhoods/crime-rates/top100dangerous2013/

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[SkyDekker 1,121]

kelpdiver

***
Same situation here. Data shows that adding a gun to your household increases the risk of a household member dying a violent death. You know the risks, you take your chances.

If we were all one generic household, perhaps. We're not.

I'm white, do not engage in drug trade, and did not purchase my weapons in response to a direct threat. My probability of being murdered is pretty minute as a result.

No one in my household has a history of mental health issues or takes psychiatric drugs (or other mind fucking ones), and the guns were purchased long ago, so the risk of suicide is also far lower than any average would imply.

Oh how cute.

We are talking about general statistics, and you design one specific scenario just to disagree with me.

You also sound like the young skygod explaining why the risks of a pocket rocket do not apply to him.

[DanG 1]

Quote

Most of that district is a turdhole. Guess who runs that one… Sheila Jackson Lee.

I happen to live in Ron Paul's district (now Weber).

I think you might need a primer on how government works if you think congresspeople "run" anything in their home districts.

- Dan G

[Boogers 0]

kallend

FACT - carrying a gun increases your chance of being shot dead.

So we should disarm the police?

[quade 3]

Boogers

***FACT - carrying a gun increases your chance of being shot dead.

So we should disarm the police?

I think you should probably look at the statistics of police and their gun related suicides and homicides of family members.

Go ahead. Report what you find. We'll wait.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[kelpdiver 2]

SkyDekker

******
Same situation here. Data shows that adding a gun to your household increases the risk of a household member dying a violent death. You know the risks, you take your chances.

If we were all one generic household, perhaps. We're not.

I'm white, do not engage in drug trade, and did not purchase my weapons in response to a direct threat. My probability of being murdered is pretty minute as a result.

No one in my household has a history of mental health issues or takes psychiatric drugs (or other mind fucking ones), and the guns were purchased long ago, so the risk of suicide is also far lower than any average would imply.

Oh how cute.

We are talking about general statistics, and you design one specific scenario just to disagree with me.

You also sound like the young skygod explaining why the risks of a pocket rocket do not apply to him.

So make up your mind - is my specific scenario not the same as the general statistics, or am I a skygod pretending that they are? You can't even maintain your bullshit for two sentences in a row!

"You know the risks, you take your chances" implies the latter, the skygod argument, so you'll need to address my points to defend it.

But really it's affirming what most of us know, and you and bill and kallend keep slipping on - correlation and causation are frequently confused. I'm not shocked to hear that people carrying guns are more likely to be killed - in California, only felons and people afraid enough to commit felonies are going to be carrying. And those people have a dramatically higher risk of being attacked and killed. But those risks don't get any better if they don't carry. So it makes for good scare propaganda...only kills a few people unnecessarily.

[kallend 1,621]

Boogers

***FACT - carrying a gun increases your chance of being shot dead.

So we should disarm the police?

Well, that's an interesting question.

In the UK, where the police are (mostly) unarmed, there were 3 police officers shot dead in the last DECADE. Even at the height of IRA terrorism, the number only reached 12. In the USA, for comparison, the number hovers around 70 per YEAR.

The UK population is roughly 1/5 of the USA's.

So YOU do the math.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Boogers 0]

quade

******FACT - carrying a gun increases your chance of being shot dead.

So we should disarm the police?

I think you should probably look at the statistics of police and their gun related suicides and homicides of family members.

Go ahead. Report what you find. We'll wait.

It's your theory - you post the numbers, and your source.

People who want to commit suicide, will do so by whatever means available. If you take their guns away, they'll jump off a bridge instead.

How many cops do you think we'll have if you disarm them and then tell them to go out on the street and catch bad guys?

[Boogers 0]

kallend

******FACT - carrying a gun increases your chance of being shot dead.

So we should disarm the police?

Well, that's an interesting question.

In the UK, where the police are (mostly) unarmed, there were 3 police officers shot dead in the last DECADE. Even at the height of IRA terrorism, the number only reached 12. In the USA, for comparison, the number hovers around 70 per YEAR.

The UK population is roughly 1/5 of the USA's.

So YOU do the math.

So we should disarm our police to reduce cop-killings and make them more safe?
That's going to be a tough sell with the cops...

For all your self-professed math skills, you need some help with your logic skills.
You see, cops aren't usually killed with their own guns.
Taking their guns away won't make them immune from being killed by others.
Tsk tsk. Factor that into your equation.