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regulator

Chicago's extensive gun laws are doing a great job

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A man gunned down Thursday on Chicago's west side marked what police say is the city's 500th homicide of the year. It's a dubious distinction that hasn't occurred since 2008, when the city ended the year with 512 murders.

Police are releasing few details about the shooting that happened around 9 p.m. in the 4900 block of West Augusta. The man was taken to Stroger Hospital, where he died.

At a peace dinner held Thursday, residents came together to talk about ways to end violence. Alderman Anthony Beale, who is running for Jesse Jackson Jr.'s old 2nd Congressional District seat, said Police Superintendent Garry McCarthy needs to change strategies.

"His philosophy is not working," Beale said. "We need to put resources where the problems are, and then you will see crime drop across the city."

Chicago surpassed 2011's 435 murder total in October

Police said Chicago's 499th homicide victim was a man who died after he was shot at least four times – including in the face and chest – in a Gage Park neighborhood alley Wednesday night on the Southwest Side.

Frederico Martinez, of the 5400 block of South California Avenue, died from gunshot wounds he suffered near his home, according to the Cook County Medical Examiner’s office.

Police said the 32-year-old Martinez was standing with a female in an alleyway down the block from his home when a light-colored pick-up truck approached and somebody inside opened fire.

Martinez was shot in the face, chest and both arms and was taken to Mount Sinai Hospital, where he died, authorities said.

Behind the troubling statistics, flashing lights and crime tape, communities throughout the city are searching for solutions.

"There's no magic spell that can end it. It's a matter of people and neighborhoods coming together and deciding that it's not going to happen," said neighbor Robert Grider.

Larry Pickens, who is running in the special election in the 2nd Congressional seat, offered a few suggestions Thursday: "Teaching our young people alternative dispute resolution, non-violent strategies for addressing conflict and getting guns off the street."

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/12/28/16212238-grim-milestone-chicago-records-500th-homicide-of-2012?lite

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Police said Chicago's 499th homicide victim was a man who died after he was shot at least four times – including in the face and chest – in a Gage Park neighborhood alley Wednesday night on the Southwest Side.

Frederico Martinez, of the 5400 block of South California Avenue, died from gunshot wounds he suffered near his home, according to the Cook County Medical Examiner’s office.

Police said the 32-year-old Martinez was standing with a female in an alleyway down the block from his home when a light-colored pick-up truck approached and somebody inside opened fire.

Martinez was shot in the face, chest and both arms and was taken to Mount Sinai Hospital, where he died, authorities said.



So just how exactly would this have gone differently if Federico Martinez or the female with him had been armed?

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I dont know, I cant stop time...go back to the scene of the crime and do an investigation. Perhaps with your superhuman powers of hindsight you could do that. The point I was trying to make was that in obama's hometown...where the gun control laws are most strict than anywhere else in the nation...didnt make much of a difference to the 500 people who were murdered.

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I dont know, I cant stop time...go back to the scene of the crime and do an investigation. Perhaps with your superhuman powers of hindsight you could do that. The point I was trying to make was that in obama's hometown...where the gun control laws are most strict than anywhere else in the nation...didnt make much of a difference to the 500 people who were murdered.



There were over 800 in 1990. So the rate had been steadily decreasing over 2 decades. Now it's gone up again.
...

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The point I was trying to make was that in obama's hometown...where the gun control laws are most strict than anywhere else in the nation...didnt make much of a difference to the 500 people who were murdered.



I thought he was from Kenya?

So you don't know if there is causation or correlation, but you are bringing it forward as an example of such?

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The point I was trying to make was that in obama's hometown...where the gun control laws are most strict than anywhere else in the nation...didnt make much of a difference to the 500 people who were murdered.



I thought he was from Kenya?

So you don't know if there is causation or correlation, but you are bringing it forward as an example of such?



Homicide rate declined over 40% over 2 decades since 1990, but is now up significantly. The only change in gun laws is that a previous gun ban was overturned in June 2010. I'm NOT claiming cause and effect, but it certainly destroys regulator's implication.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Handguns were banned in Chicago in 1982. Over 800 in 1990 isn't good - especially since the homicide rate in Chicago would not fall under 800 until 1996 (it hit almost 950 in 1992).

Note that Chicago also still has a higher murder rate that NYC. Though I believe that Bloomberg will do his best to close that margin.


My wife is hotter than your wife.

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Handguns were banned in Chicago in 1982. Over 800 in 1990 isn't good - especially since the homicide rate in Chicago would not fall under 800 until 1996 (it hit almost 950 in 1992).

Note that Chicago also still has a higher murder rate that NYC. Though I believe that Bloomberg will do his best to close that margin.



Based on what I see in the local news, the overwhelming majority are gang-on-gang shootings. We certainly have a major league gang problem here, but fortunately for most Chicagoans it's restricted to a few neighborhoods. Not good if you happen to live in one of those neighborhoods, of course.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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" shot at least four times – including in the face and chest –
Martinez was shot in the face, chest and both arms and was taken to Mount Sinai Hospital, where he died, authorities said."

So just how exactly would this have gone differently if Federico Martinez or the female with him had been armed?

"""'

So what if the first shot hit his arm and he had a gun and the next three didn't kill him because he was able to return fire after the first shot....
That is how it could have been different.
It is never cut and dried and I would rather have it and not need it than wish I had it. And when the Mayor sends his kids to a school with security but says I can't have any for my kids or myself, there is something wrong.
tom #90 #54 #08 and now #5 with a Bronze :-)

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Handguns were banned in Chicago in 1982. Over 800 in 1990 isn't good - especially since the homicide rate in Chicago would not fall under 800 until 1996 (it hit almost 950 in 1992).

Note that Chicago also still has a higher murder rate that NYC. Though I believe that Bloomberg will do his best to close that margin.



Based on what I see in the local news, the overwhelming majority are gang-on-gang shootings. We certainly have a major league gang problem here, but fortunately for most Chicagoans it's restricted to a few neighborhoods. Not good if you happen to live in one of those neighborhoods, of course.



Seems to be a Gang and Criminal issue. not a Law abiding Gun Owner Issue.

Matt
An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

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the overwhelming majority are gang-on-gang shootings



Yes. Fuller Park and Garfield Park are rough places. I've read some stuff suggesting that handguns are now a greater percentage of murder weapons in Chicago.

And I am pretty disappointed that gang violence is viewed as a way to kinda minimize it. They are people, too.


My wife is hotter than your wife.

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Handguns were banned in Chicago in 1982. Over 800 in 1990 isn't good - especially since the homicide rate in Chicago would not fall under 800 until 1996 (it hit almost 950 in 1992).

Note that Chicago also still has a higher murder rate that NYC. Though I believe that Bloomberg will do his best to close that margin.



Based on what I see in the local news, the overwhelming majority are gang-on-gang shootings. We certainly have a major league gang problem here, but fortunately for most Chicagoans it's restricted to a few neighborhoods. Not good if you happen to live in one of those neighborhoods, of course.



Seems to be a Gang and Criminal issue. not a Law abiding Gun Owner Issue.

Matt



Yes. Until the street gangs can be brought under control the homicide rate will continue to be high, regardless of much else. Fortunately for the law abiding (gun owner or not) the gang bangers are mostly offing each other.

Legalizing drugs would probably have a beneficial effect as it would take the profit out of the gang business.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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The point I was trying to make was that in obama's hometown...where the gun control laws are most strict than anywhere else in the nation...didnt make much of a difference to the 500 people who were murdered.



I thought he was from Kenya?

So you don't know if there is causation or correlation, but you are bringing it forward as an example of such?



Homicide rate declined over 40% over 2 decades since 1990, but is now up significantly. The only change in gun laws is that a previous gun ban was overturned in June 2010. I'm NOT claiming cause and effect, but it certainly destroys regulator's implication.



During that same period, much of which Chicago led the nation with the most restrictive gun laws, the national murder rate declined by 52.94% while the rate in Chicago only decreased by 43.90%.

Me thinks that has a LOT to do with demographics and very little to do with gun control.

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It missed 2010: 16.1

Notice big drop 1990-2010. Up again this year.



And still way higher than during the Prohibition tommy-gun days.

But also see the big increase after the handgun ban.



To be fair, the nation as a whole saw an upswing in homicides between 1984 and 1991...largely as a result of the crack cocaine epidemic during that period.

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The point I was trying to make was that in obama's hometown...where the gun control laws are most strict than anywhere else in the nation...didnt make much of a difference to the 500 people who were murdered.



I thought he was from Kenya?

So you don't know if there is causation or correlation, but you are bringing it forward as an example of such?



Homicide rate declined over 40% over 2 decades since 1990, but is now up significantly. The only change in gun laws is that a previous gun ban was overturned in June 2010. I'm NOT claiming cause and effect, but it certainly destroys regulator's implication.



During that same period, much of which Chicago led the nation with the most restrictive gun laws, the national murder rate declined by 52.94% while the rate in Chicago only decreased by 43.90%.

Me thinks that has a LOT to do with demographics and very little to do with gun control.



Did I claim otherwise?
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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It missed 2010: 16.1

Notice big drop 1990-2010. Up again this year.



And still way higher than during the Prohibition tommy-gun days.

But also see the big increase after the handgun ban.




No, the ban was in 1982. The big increase was from 1960 - 1970.
And then big decrease before the ban was lifted in 2010. Now an increase.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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To be fair, the nation as a whole saw an upswing in homicides between 1984 and 1991...largely as a result of the crack cocaine epidemic during that period.



Yeah. So we had a "Drug Czar" named William Bennett who decided to fight that problem by diverting attention to gang violence while letting the crackheads just die off.

Maybe we'll do the same this time, only with meth instead of coke.


My wife is hotter than your wife.

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