Should Cannabis be legalized?

[Butters 0]

Quote

Sorry, I thought you were one of those dumb shits who thinks it would be cool to live in a society full of crack heads and junkies. My apologies.

I understand that all drugs are not the same. I also understand that the current scheduling of substances according to the Controlled Substances Act does not correlate to the actual potential for abuse of the substances.

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[Shotgun 1]

Quote

Sorry, I thought you were one of those dumb shits who thinks it would be cool to live in a society full of crack heads and junkies. My apologies.

As opposed to the dumb shits who think it's cool to live in a society of alcoholics rather than making booze illegal?

[DrewEckhardt 0]

Quote

Sorry, I thought you were one of those dumb shits who thinks it would be cool to live in a society full of crack heads and junkies. My apologies.

No, although I wouldn't mind living someplace like Portugal which legalized all drugs. Half as many people there abuse drugs compared to before the legalization.

I also wouldn't mind paying to treat any of the remaining addicts that care to get help since that's _much_ less expensive than locking them up (as of 2008 it cost California $47,102 per inmate with $19,663 of that just for security).

[Marinus 0]

Quote

I also wouldn't mind paying to treat any of the remaining addicts that care to get help since that's _much_ less expensive than locking them up

I bet you would mind it even less when addiction treatment was paid for by addict themselves by means of sin taxes.

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Quote

I also wouldn't mind paying to treat any of the remaining addicts that care to get help since that's _much_ less expensive than locking them up

I bet you would mind it even less when addiction treatment was paid for by addict themselves by means of sin taxes.

Not a bad idea! After all, I didn't get anyone hooked on dope or booze or anything else. They did it to themselves, they should have to pay for their 'cleaning up'! It's their problem... not mine. People need to start taking responsibility for their own actions!
edit to add: I thought 'recreational users' could handle it!?


Chuck

[Marinus 0]

Legalizing drug and using the sin taxes to combat drug-related problems is full of win. It's not that I necessarily like drugs, but I'm a pragmatic young man.

Quote

I thought 'recreational users' could handle it!?

A recreational user is like a social drinker, an in fact the majority of people who do any drug are recreational users, why?

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Legalizing drug and using the sin taxes to combat drug-related problems is full of win. It's not that I necessarily like drugs, but I'm a pragmatic young man.

Quote

I thought 'recreational users' could handle it!?

A recreational user is like a social drinker, an in fact the majority of people who do any drug are recreational users, why?

Until they become addicted.


Chuck

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Legalizing drug and using the sin taxes to combat drug-related problems is full of win. It's not that I necessarily like drugs, but I'm a pragmatic young man.

Quote

I thought 'recreational users' could handle it!?

A recreational user is like a social drinker, an in fact the majority of people who do any drug are recreational users, why?

Is this a rcreational user???

http://home.myhughesnet.com/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CDA12DEHO1%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=1018


Chuck

[Shotgun 1]

Quote

Quote

Legalizing drug and using the sin taxes to combat drug-related problems is full of win. It's not that I necessarily like drugs, but I'm a pragmatic young man.

Quote

I thought 'recreational users' could handle it!?

A recreational user is like a social drinker, an in fact the majority of people who do any drug are recreational users, why?

Is this a rcreational user???

http://home.myhughesnet.com/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CDA12DEHO1%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=1018

Hard to say. Obviously someone who had too much and/or a bad reaction to the drug. And of course, with illegal drugs, there's really no telling what drug the person was actually on since there are no standards for manufacturing/selling/marketing these drugs.

Anyhow, I'm sure alcohol is by far the drug involved in most homicides and manslaughters (when there is a drug involved). And I don't think these incidents always involve alcohol addicts or even problem drinkers; some probably involve recreational users (social drinkers).

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Legalizing drug and using the sin taxes to combat drug-related problems is full of win. It's not that I necessarily like drugs, but I'm a pragmatic young man.

Quote

I thought 'recreational users' could handle it!?

A recreational user is like a social drinker, an in fact the majority of people who do any drug are recreational users, why?

Is this a rcreational user???

http://home.myhughesnet.com/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CDA12DEHO1%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=1018

Hard to say. Obviously someone who had too much and/or a bad reaction to the drug. And of course, with illegal drugs, there's really no telling what drug the person was actually on since there are no standards for manufacturing/selling/marketing these drugs.

Anyhow, I'm sure alcohol is by far the drug involved in most homicides and manslaughters (when there is a drug involved). And I don't think these incidents always involve alcohol addicts or even problem drinkers; some probably involve recreational users (social drinkers).

I've heard that anyone buying weed or any other illicit drug really doesn't know for surewhat they are getting. At least with beer or booze, they are controlled and you know what you are getting.


Chuck

[Bolas 5]

Quote

Quote

RELEASE THE FLYING MONKEYS!

ALL HAIL THE GREAT AND GLORIOUS WAR ON DRUGS!


check out its wonderful track record.

Another one who wants to live in a world full of Zombies. Then we can go bankrupt taking care of the morons when they blow out their heart arteries.

You mean like the prescription drug zombies?

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Quote

Quote

RELEASE THE FLYING MONKEYS!

ALL HAIL THE GREAT AND GLORIOUS WAR ON DRUGS!


check out its wonderful track record.

Another one who wants to live in a world full of Zombies. Then we can go bankrupt taking care of the morons when they blow out their heart arteries.

You mean like the prescription drug zombies?

An addict is an addict... prescription or otherwise. Are illicit drugs better on the social scale than prescription drugs? Either addiction still, costs taxpayers.


Chuck

[jammindave 0]

Wow! Listen to ya'll. And all I want to do is get a nice buzz on.

[Marinus 0]

Quote

Until they become addicted.

Recreational use doesn't automatically end with addiction. Else a large majority of the world population would be chain-smoking alcohol addicts,

Quote

Is this a rcreational user???

I've no idea, but since this is anecdotal, it can be ignored.

Quote

At least with beer or booze, they are controlled and you know what you are getting.

One of the goals of legalization is that other drugs are controlled too. And indeed with alcohol you know what you get. A drug that's relatively addictive, that's very harmful to your health and has been known as a leading cause for traffic accidents, violence and obnoxious behaviour.

[Butters 0]

Quote

I've heard that anyone buying weed or any other illicit drug really doesn't know for surewhat they are getting. At least with beer or booze, they are controlled and you know what you are getting.

If other substances were controlled like beer or booze then people would know what they're getting.

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Quote

Until they become addicted.

Recreational use doesn't automatically end with addiction. Else a large majority of the world population would be chain-smoking alcohol addicts,

Quote

Is this a rcreational user???

I've no idea, but since this is anecdotal, it can be ignored.

Quote

At least with beer or booze, they are controlled and you know what you are getting.

One of the goals of legalization is that other drugs are controlled too. And indeed with alcohol you know what you get. A drug that's relatively addictive, that's very harmful to your health and has been known as a leading cause for traffic accidents, violence and obnoxious behaviour.

...and the 'recreational drugs' that so many folks want legalized do not have similar qualities?


Chuck

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Quote

I've heard that anyone buying weed or any other illicit drug really doesn't know for surewhat they are getting. At least with beer or booze, they are controlled and you know what you are getting.

If other substances were controlled like beer or booze then people would know what they're getting.

There's no telling what some illegal drugs are cut with. Basically, anything that closely resembles the particular drug, like dry-wall rat poison, baking soda and so-on. At this point in time, it seems that people don't care... just get that high. Sheesh!


Chuck

[billvon 2,396]

>There's no telling what some illegal drugs are cut with. Basically, anything that closely
>resembles the particular drug, like dry-wall rat poison, baking soda and so-on. At this
>point in time, it seems that people don't care...

?? I know a few people who do harder drugs, and they very much care. Do you know anyone who really don't care if the drugs they use are the actual drugs or rat poison?

This used to be true for alcohol as well. Mostly due to distillers that screwed up and got some methanol in the distillate, but also due to the government intentionally adding poisons to alcohol. The government program killed about 10,000 Americans overall; they used this number to prove how 'evil and dangerous' drinking alcohol was. (Interesting parallel, no?) Legalizing alcohol ended this.

[masterrig 1]

Quote

>There's no telling what some illegal drugs are cut with. Basically, anything that closely
>resembles the particular drug, like dry-wall rat poison, baking soda and so-on. At this
>point in time, it seems that people don't care...

?? I know a few people who do harder drugs, and they very much care. Do you know anyone who really don't care if the drugs they use are the actual drugs or rat poison?

This used to be true for alcohol as well. Mostly due to distillers that screwed up and got some methanol in the distillate, but also due to the government intentionally adding poisons to alcohol. The government program killed about 10,000 Americans overall; they used this number to prove how 'evil and dangerous' drinking alcohol was. (Interesting parallel, no?) Legalizing alcohol ended this.

I believe this was back in the days when booze was illegal and folks drank Sterno strained through a slice of bread. The government (to the best of my knowledge) is not involved with cutting dope with poisons or sheet rock. What I find funny is, just like the ol' boy who said; "I do my best driving when I've had a six-pack!" People who claim that they can 'handle' dope or booze are kidding themselves.


Chuck

[billvon 2,396]

>I believe this was back in the days when booze was illegal and folks drank Sterno
>strained through a slice of bread.

And they drank regular alcohol (ethanol) that had been poisoned by the government:

===============================
. . . the US government's mostly forgotten policy in the 1920s and 1930s of poisoning industrial alcohols manufactured in the US to scare people into giving up illicit drinking during Prohibition. Known as the 'chemist's war of Prohibition,' the federal poisoning program, by some estimates, killed at least 10,000 people between 1926 and 1933. The story begins with ratification of the 18th Amendment in 1919, which banned sale and consumption of alcoholic beverages in the US. By the mid-1920s, when the government saw that its 'noble experiment' was in danger of failing, it decided that the problem was that readily available methyl (industrial) alcohol — itself a poison — didn't taste nasty enough. The government put its chemists to work designing ever more unpalatable toxins — adding such chemicals as kerosene, brucine (a plant alkaloid closely related to strychnine), gasoline, benzene, cadmium, iodine, zinc, mercury salts, nicotine, ether, formaldehyde, chloroform, camphor, carbolic acid, quinine, and acetone. In 1926, in New York City, 1,200 were sickened by poisonous alcohol; 400 died. The following year, deaths climbed to 700. These numbers were repeated in cities around the country as public-health officials nationwide joined in the angry clamor to stop the poisoning program. But an official sense of higher purpose kept it in place, while lawmakers opposed to the plan were accused of being in cahoots with criminals and bootleggers. The chief medical examiner of New York City during the 1920s, one of the poisoning program's most outspoken opponents, liked to call it 'our national experiment in extermination.
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/10/02/27/2040251/us-government-poisoned-alcohol-during-prohibition
============================

>The government (to the best of my knowledge) is not involved with cutting dope with
>poisons or sheet rock.

==========
The U.S. government itself poisoned marijuana smokers during the Carter administration. Mexican fields were sprayed with paraquat, which requires 24 hours of sunlight to kill the plants. The growers quickly harvested the crops, cleaned them off and shipped them into the United States, where they caused extensive respiratory damage on unwitting smokers.
http://www.wired.com/medtech/drugs/news/2001/10/47659?currentPage=all
==========

They justified this by saying "well, they were breaking the law anyway." Is it possible that they are doing it now, given that they've done it several times in the past?

[masterrig 1]

Quote

>I believe this was back in the days when booze was illegal and folks drank Sterno
>strained through a slice of bread.

And they drank regular alcohol (ethanol) that had been poisoned by the government:

===============================
. . . the US government's mostly forgotten policy in the 1920s and 1930s of poisoning industrial alcohols manufactured in the US to scare people into giving up illicit drinking during Prohibition. Known as the 'chemist's war of Prohibition,' the federal poisoning program, by some estimates, killed at least 10,000 people between 1926 and 1933. The story begins with ratification of the 18th Amendment in 1919, which banned sale and consumption of alcoholic beverages in the US. By the mid-1920s, when the government saw that its 'noble experiment' was in danger of failing, it decided that the problem was that readily available methyl (industrial) alcohol — itself a poison — didn't taste nasty enough. The government put its chemists to work designing ever more unpalatable toxins — adding such chemicals as kerosene, brucine (a plant alkaloid closely related to strychnine), gasoline, benzene, cadmium, iodine, zinc, mercury salts, nicotine, ether, formaldehyde, chloroform, camphor, carbolic acid, quinine, and acetone. In 1926, in New York City, 1,200 were sickened by poisonous alcohol; 400 died. The following year, deaths climbed to 700. These numbers were repeated in cities around the country as public-health officials nationwide joined in the angry clamor to stop the poisoning program. But an official sense of higher purpose kept it in place, while lawmakers opposed to the plan were accused of being in cahoots with criminals and bootleggers. The chief medical examiner of New York City during the 1920s, one of the poisoning program's most outspoken opponents, liked to call it 'our national experiment in extermination.
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/10/02/27/2040251/us-government-poisoned-alcohol-during-prohibition
============================

>The government (to the best of my knowledge) is not involved with cutting dope with
>poisons or sheet rock.

==========
The U.S. government itself poisoned marijuana smokers during the Carter administration. Mexican fields were sprayed with paraquat, which requires 24 hours of sunlight to kill the plants. The growers quickly harvested the crops, cleaned them off and shipped them into the United States, where they caused extensive respiratory damage on unwitting smokers.
http://www.wired.com/medtech/drugs/news/2001/10/47659?currentPage=all
==========

They justified this by saying "well, they were breaking the law anyway." Is it possible that they are doing it now, given that they've done it several times in the past?

Not un-like the dopers of today... anything to get that 'high'. Bath salts, stolen prescription drugs... you name it. The people of Mexico and South America look at growing and producing cocaine, black-tar heroin and marijuana, look at it as a 'business'and evem have a patron saint of drug smugglers. As for us poisoning their crops, I don't really think so. Those crops are so well protected by 'artillary', it would be difficult to get our aircraft in there. The cartels have the 'lawyers,guns and money'!


chuck

[Bolas 5]

Quote

Not un-like the dopers of today... anything to get that 'high'. Bath salts, stolen prescription drugs... you name it.

If people want to get high, they're going to get high. Making one substance illegal just causes people to look for substitutes, some of which are far more dangerous. Once that substance is made illegal, they just find somethings else. Perhaps even more dangerous. It's a slippery slope shell game.

Quote

The people of Mexico and South America look at growing and producing cocaine, black-tar heroin and marijuana, look at it as a 'business. As for us poisoning their crops, I don't really think so. Those crops are so well protected by 'artillary', it would be difficult to get our aircraft in there. The cartels have the 'lawyers,guns and money'! '

It is a business, and it's big business. They have raw materials, manufacturing, distribution networks, and dealers. The fact that it's illegal just means it has no regulation and they pay no taxes.

As for protecting their crops, what business wouldn't defend its raw materials/supply chain?

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Quote

Not un-like the dopers of today... anything to get that 'high'. Bath salts, stolen prescription drugs... you name it.

If people want to get high, they're going to get high. Making one substance illegal just causes people to look for substitutes, some of which are far more dangerous. Once that substance is made illegal, they just find somethings else. Perhaps even more dangerous. It's a slippery slope shell game.

Quote

The people of Mexico and South America look at growing and producing cocaine, black-tar heroin and marijuana, look at it as a 'business. As for us poisoning their crops, I don't really think so. Those crops are so well protected by 'artillary', it would be difficult to get our aircraft in there. The cartels have the 'lawyers,guns and money'! '

It is a business, and it's big business. They have raw materials, manufacturing, distribution networks, and dealers. The fact that it's illegal just means it has no regulation and they pay no taxes.

As for protecting their crops, what business wouldn't defend its raw materials/supply chain?

I agree. That's why, I don't see this country poisoning their 'crops'. Besides, the cartels take very good care of the villages in the area of their crops and operations. Not to mention, the cartels keep their money in huge warehouses. Most of which comes from the U.S.A.


Chuck

[Marinus 0]

Quote

...and the 'recreational drugs' that so many folks want legalized do not have similar qualities?

Actually, alcohol is on the bad side of the spectrum. Magic mushrooms, ecstasy, weed... those are all a better idea than alcohol.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

Quote

... As for us poisoning their crops, I don't really think so. Those crops are so well protected by 'artillary', it would be difficult to get our aircraft in there. The cartels have the 'lawyers,guns and money'! ...

Paraquat was used back in the 70s. It was a far different world back then.

There have been aerial eradication programs in Columbia that have resulted in the aircraft being shot down.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo