Florida Teen Shot

[toolbox 0]

I just want to thank you for making the case for all of our freedoms that many would have us give up for a false sense of safety.
As far as our right to bear arms go's,our founding fathers wrote this into the constitution not only to protect us from each other,but so the people could defend against a tyrannical government that might try to repress the people and the other freedoms that our constitution is written to protect.
I myself like being free,even if there could be some risk from those who might use our freedoms to hurt us.

[headoverheels 291]

Quote

Odd how this is becoming a white/black racial issue. Apparently the security guard is hispanic.

Security guard?

[normiss 622]

Gah - reputed to be self appointed neighborhood watch leader or some shit

sorry - my bad. (yummy beer...mmmm...beeer)

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

If the kid assaulted the man after the man threatened him with a gun, then that was a justified response.

It would also be a very stupid response. The smart response would be to just walk away. Assaulting someone who is holding a gun while armed yourself only with your fists, is a sure way to get shot. Proceeding in that manner is likely to lead to a predictable end, and not in your favor.

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

It may end up that this person basically murdered the boy but could escape punishment due to lack of evidence. That is a price of a system where innocence is presumed. That price, like the death itself, is harsh to those who pay it, but the alternative isn't attractive to the whole.

All the anti-death penalty liberals here seem to think that a 1,000 guilty murderers should go free in order to save one innocent man on death row. And the ironic thing is, those are the same people who are here calling the shooter a murderer, without even having any facts yet for a basis upon which to do that. It's funny how that double standard works: Death row murderers = Innocent, Gun owner = Guilty.

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

Maybe unjustified, but hardly unprovoked. Maybe he was calling the kid "fucking coon"...

Don't Mom's teach their kids this rule any more?

"Sticks and stones may break my bones,
but words will never hurt me."

If someone is pointing a gun at you and calling you a coon, he's an asshole, and is not worth getting shot over. The proper response is to walk away.

Quote

I don't think that you would find a lot of real cops mishandling the situation like this guy.

Real cops exhibit bad attitudes towards citizens and mishandle situations all the time.

[billvon 2,394]

>It would also be a very stupid response.

Yes, it would be.

>Assaulting someone who is holding a gun while armed only with your fists, is a sure
>way to get shot.

Yep. It would be much smarter for the person being threatened to draw their own weapon, so they can fire and kill their threatener before they are themselves killed. Fortunately the new law makes both their actions legal - so the only issue that remains is "who can draw faster?"

[Gravitymaster 0]

Quote

so the only issue that remains is "who can draw faster?"

Not always. It's the person who can stay the coolest under pressure. 1:45 if you don't want to watch the whole thing.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccqdEhytKOk

[blkhwk91b 0]

Well, guess what all you thumb suckers. It doesn't matter what you think; and if you feel so bold, write your congressman.

According to the law, this guy (Hispanic none-the-less) could be an absolute flaming racist. Yes, flaming racist! He could hate any race 10 ways from Tuesday. Guess what, doesn't frickin' matter.

What matters is whether he felt his life was in danger at that particular moment. (read that again, and take a deep breath)

You don't have to like it....you may even despise it....whatever. But the laws that protect you protect racist as well. Oh shit....living in America is a quandary!!

Bottom line, let local law enforcement and the district attorney do their job. If that fails, let the Feds investigate.

Bottom line...you were not there and neither was I.

If you think that if a racist kills someone out of self-defense that they should hang, just because they are racist, then you are no better than they are.

"Better to have a short life that is full of what you like doing, than a long life spent in a miserable way." - Alan Watts

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

What matters is whether he felt his life was in danger at that particular moment. (read that again, and take a deep breath.

If you think that if a racist kills someone out of self-defense that they should hang, just because they are racist, then you are no better than they are.

I'd people people have great doubts about this being a case of self defense, given the size differences between them and his insistence on playing cop against recommendation.

your post makes me think of Uncle Jimbo on South Park - "He's coming right for us! BLAM!"

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

Yep. It would be much smarter for the person being threatened to draw their own weapon, so they can fire and kill their threatener before they are themselves killed. Fortunately the new law makes both their actions legal - so the only issue that remains is "who can draw faster?"

Not quite. This kid was 17 - well below legal age to obtain a handgun (21).

[wlsc 0]

Quote

Quote

It may end up that this person basically murdered the boy but could escape punishment due to lack of evidence. That is a price of a system where innocence is presumed. That price, like the death itself, is harsh to those who pay it, but the alternative isn't attractive to the whole.

All the anti-death penalty liberals here seem to think that a 1,000 guilty murderers should go free in order to save one innocent man on death row. And the ironic thing is, those are the same people who are here calling the shooter a murderer, without even having any facts yet for a basis upon which to do that. It's funny how that double standard works: Death row murderers = Innocent, Gun owner = Guilty.

Murder is murder. Demonstrations have started. This is going to build and build (especially reading the comments here defending the killer) and merge with the Occupy movement. The racists have shot themselves in the foot.

[RonD1120 58]

Latest radio interview from an investigative reporter in Orlando reveals the following:

1. Federal Government, Justice Department I believe, is investigating possibility of hate crime.

2. State Attorney is pursuing to impanel a grand jury next month.

3. Zimmerman had a bloody nose, blood on the back of his head and grass stains on his shirt.

4. Zimmerman's neighbors have not reported any negative racial behavior or speech perpetrated by him in the past.

5. Zimmerman's neighbors have stated that his reputation as a watchman has been above reproach.

6. The police chief has stated that no evidence thus far exists that would disprove the shooting as self defense.

7. The police chief has received a no confidence vote from the Sanford City Council. (The council has no management authority as the police chief reports to the city manager.)

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

Quote

The jury who no-billed George Zimmerman very likely has some white people on it.

But much of my post was not specifically about this incident -- people give more of a pass to those whom they can identify with, than those they can't.

Wendy P.

Has a grand jury issued a "no bill" already?

I read it as the investigation is still ongoing, and he could still face charges.

And there was an AP story last night (I can't find it right away this morning) that stated that Zimmerman had marks on his face and grass on his back consistent with a struggle.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[airdvr 197]

Quote

Quote

Quote

It may end up that this person basically murdered the boy but could escape punishment due to lack of evidence. That is a price of a system where innocence is presumed. That price, like the death itself, is harsh to those who pay it, but the alternative isn't attractive to the whole.

All the anti-death penalty liberals here seem to think that a 1,000 guilty murderers should go free in order to save one innocent man on death row. And the ironic thing is, those are the same people who are here calling the shooter a murderer, without even having any facts yet for a basis upon which to do that. It's funny how that double standard works: Death row murderers = Innocent, Gun owner = Guilty.

Murder is murder. Demonstrations have started. This is going to build and build (especially reading the comments here defending the killer) and merge with the Occupy movement. The racists have shot themselves in the foot.

How re-assuring it is to know you've gotten all the facts and have been interviewing everyone involved so you can leap over the investigation and reach your conclusion.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[pirana 0]

Quote

Real cops exhibit bad attitudes towards citizens and mishandle situations all the time.

ALL the time? That must be your hyperbolic way of saying sometimes, or occasionally, or rarely-but-when-it-does-it-gets-a-lot-of-press.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[normiss 622]

Interesting look at the word.

CNN video

[SkyDekker 1,121]

Quote

The price of gun freedoms is that some people will be accidentally or wrongly shot.

Absolutely. American society is fine with that price, most other Western civilizations are not.

I would not be suprised if Zimmerman felt more powerful with a gun, which influenced his course of action.

[Andy9o8 0]

Quote

Just think what a perfect world it could be. Nobody walking around with guns. Those darned neo-nazis not publishing racist tracts. Those gross "occupy" protestors not shitting in the streets. Those darned religious folks not praying and erecting crosses all over the place. Yeah, that would be sweet.

You mean Canada? Too cold.

[wmw999 2,120]

Quote

Murder is murder. Demonstrations have started. This is going to build and build (especially reading the comments here defending the killer) and merge with the Occupy movement.

That has absolutely nothing to do with what actually happened.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[billvon 2,394]

>Not always. It's the person who can stay the coolest under pressure.

Well, true - that kid is very cool now.

[Coreece 190]

Quote

Quote

Murder is murder. Demonstrations have started. This is going to build and build (especially reading the comments here defending the killer) and merge with the Occupy movement.

That has absolutely nothing to do with what actually happened.

Wendy P.

Oh, of course it does. "2+2=4"

wlsc has already proven his/her inability/unwillingness to form an actual argument about anything.

Not really the best way to start off your career as a Speaker's Corner contributor...

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[Gravitymaster 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Murder is murder. Demonstrations have started. This is going to build and build (especially reading the comments here defending the killer) and merge with the Occupy movement.

That has absolutely nothing to do with what actually happened.

Wendy P.

Oh, of course it does. "2+2=4"

wlsc has already proven his/her inability/unwillingness to form an actual argument about anything.

Not really the best way to start off your career as a Speaker's Corner contributor...

Oh, I suspect this is not the beginning of Kevins career in Speakers Corner.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

Murder is murder. Demonstrations have started. This is going to build and build (especially reading the comments here defending the killer) and merge with the Occupy movement.

That has absolutely nothing to do with what actually happened.

Wendy P.

Oh, of course it does. "2+2=4"

wlsc has already proven his/her inability/unwillingness to form an actual argument about anything.

Not really the best way to start off your career as a Speakers Corner contributor...

Oh, I suspect this is not the beginning of Kevin's career in Speakers Corner.

You mean some people haven't recognized that sock puppet for who it really is??

We so need a "Name That Sock Puppet" thread on here. Kinda like the "Name That Rack" thread, but without the boobies (Boobs, yes. But not boobies).

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[lawrocket 3]

Quote

The jury who no-billed George Zimmerman very likely has some white people on it.

But much of my post was not specifically about this incident -- people give more of a pass to those whom they can identify with, than those they can't.

Wendy P.

Absolutely. This is why the holocaust of deaths of black men and boys at the hands of other black men and boys continues without causing much attention. Just another gangsta killed in a drive by.

As easy as it is to give a pass to those they can identify with, it's just as easy to villainize those they don't identify with. Hence we have some honky Florida neighborhood watch goon looking for trouble and finding/causing it. That boy just didn't belong in HIS gated neighborhood. And there are people who identify with that.

I think the guy overreacted and I have a tough time seeing how reasonable deadly force was. Sounds like the guy went up to and confronted the kid, had deadly force, the kid didn't, and the guy used it and killed that kid.

On the other hand, where the hell are these civil rights leaders with the massive amount of killings by black men on black men?

I think it is extremely sad that the plight and fates of black men has been so far removed from society. Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton and Julian Bond see no evil, hear no evil and speak no evil. Thousands of black men killed by black men get hit with silence.

Take a look at this:
http://abclocal.go.com/kfsn/story?section=news/local&id=8443847

Where were the self-appointed "black leaders" condemning this? Were they calling for witnesses to step forward? A rally to support him and his family? A fundraiser to help with medical bills? Nope. No political hay to make with just another black kid shot in a drive-by.

This is not to say that they are wrong for going after this creep loser with nothing better to do than be a self-appointed commando protecting his neighborhood from suspicious (aka "black") characters. However, I think it would be nice for them to show that they care more about people than they do about getting whitey.

My wife is hotter than your wife.