Coreece 189 #101 January 24, 2012 Sill don't know what you're talking about... Thanks for making an agument about nothing. You've been very helpful.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #102 January 24, 2012 QuoteQuoteNot to come to Rand Paul's defense, but . . . I believe there is a law prohibiting members of Congress from being detained while en route to or from their home districts and DC. 1. I know, Canada is very similar in that attitude. 2. Pretty sure Canada is part of the American continenent, but for clarity should have added North to my original statement. (Who are you responding to? I didn't say the quote you seem to be referring to.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,121 #103 January 24, 2012 this was supposed to be the quote copied: OK. You might want to take a gander at this: Canadian Obscenity Law Coreece, I wasn't making or trying to create an argument. Just stating someting that has always amazed me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 189 #104 January 24, 2012 QuoteCoreece, I wasn't making or trying to create an argument. Just stating someting that has always amazed me. Ok, I'm not gonna force you to play. I just don't know what you're talking about. Obscenity isn't necessarily limited to things that sexual in nature, and sex itself isn't considered obscene...we can talk about it rather freely here...we also have the boob tube, though it's becomming obsolete with the advent of flatscreen HDTVs...Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,121 #105 January 24, 2012 QuoteI just don't know what you're talking about. In general, North Americans tend to have a rather puritanical nature. In general, violence tends to be glorified, yet anything sexual gets ostracised. Many parents are comfortable with their children watching violent movies and playing violent video games, yet are very worried about their future development should they spot a nipple. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,380 #106 January 24, 2012 >Pretty American to allow speech about violence and hatred but not allow speech about sex. Who doesn't allow speech about sex? I think there's plenty of porn out there both written and graphic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 189 #107 January 24, 2012 QuoteMany parents are comfortable with their children watching violent movies and playing violent video games, yet are very worried about their future development should they spot a nipple. I do thinks parents are sometimes a little overprotective when it comes to sex, but that's because they're scared. Sex can be preceived many differnt ways by many different kids depending on their maturity... Personally I think parents are more concerned with their kids ruining their childhood through the negative conseuences of one bad decision to have sex, rather then their kids going out and shooting somebody... Overall, I don't like to get involved in how parents raise their kids.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,121 #108 January 24, 2012 QuoteWho doesn't allow speech about sex? I think there's plenty of porn out there both written and graphic. I'll let Suzanne B. Goldberg, Clinical Professor at Law, Columbia Law School answer that for you: "It’s not that the court’s First Amendment law is crystal clear or anything regarding obscenity, but generally speaking violent depictions are not prohibited. Offensive depictions are not prohibited. But some limited kinds of sexual depictions can be prohibited as obscene." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,380 #109 January 24, 2012 >"It’s not that the court’s First Amendment law is crystal clear or anything regarding >obscenity, but generally speaking violent depictions are not prohibited. Offensive >depictions are not prohibited. But some limited kinds of sexual depictions can be >prohibited as obscene." What written stuff (in modern times) has been prohibited as obscene? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 189 #110 January 24, 2012 QuoteQuoteWho doesn't allow speech about sex? I think there's plenty of porn out there both written and graphic. I'll let Susan B. Goldberg, Clinical Professor at Law, Columbia Law School answer that for you: "It’s not that the court’s First Amendment law is crystal clear or anything regarding obscenity, but generally speaking violent depictions are not prohibited. Offensive depictions are not prohibited. But some limited kinds of sexual depictions can be prohibited as obscene." Violence is violence...it's supposed to be bad. Sex is good and many people prefer to stay classy about it and protect it's beauty rather than turning it into some kind of sick freak show.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,380 #111 January 24, 2012 >Violence is violence...it's supposed to be bad. Unless you're at war, or there's an intruder in your house. Then, apparently, it is very, very good. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,121 #112 January 24, 2012 QuoteWhat written stuff (in modern times) has been prohibited as obscene? Funny you should ask. I tried to get at that same info in a question to one of your resident lawyers, but did not get an answer. Nor is it really all that relevant. My statement relied upon prior obervance. It really doesn't come as a suprpise to me that violence and profanity would be protected, yet obscenity would be specifically excluded. It directly mirrors my statement to Coreece above. Suzanne B. Goldberg goes on to say: "The carve-out for sexualized obscenity comes more from a long-standing discomfort around sexuality, in my view, than anything that fundamentally distinguishes sexualized speech from other forms of speech that the majority may not like." I agree with her opinion and see that reflected in general every day American life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #113 January 24, 2012 QuoteQuoteWhat written stuff (in modern times) has been prohibited as obscene? Funny you should ask. I tried to get at that same info in a question to one of your resident lawyers, but did not get an answer . Uh, yes you did get an answer, up-thread. I said that in modern times, the criminalizing of obscene "words only" hasn't been considered constitutional since around the time that Lenny Bruce was prosecuted under obscenity laws for making sexual references in his live stand-up acts. That was in the early-mid 1960s. I then went on to say, essentially, that there has been such a massive quantity of debate as to the definition of "obscenity" that I couldn't effectively give a simple definition myself. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 189 #114 January 24, 2012 QuoteIt really doesn't come as a suprpise to me that violence and profanity would be protected, yet obscenity would be specifically excluded. But earlier you said it amazes you... What's wrong with having standards? What does it take for you to get uncomfortable... beastiality, snuff films, child porn? There are some sick people out there....and it doesn't start with what I listed above, it ends there.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,121 #115 January 24, 2012 You are right Andy, you did answer. I was a little too off hand in my remark above. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,121 #116 January 24, 2012 QuoteWhat's wrong with having standards? Noting at all, it is the difference in those standards that can be interesting/amazing. I grew up in a society which standards (in very generalized terms) had more restrictions on violence and profanity and less on obscenity and then moved to a society with less restrictions on violence and profanity but more on obscenity. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,380 #117 January 24, 2012 >"The carve-out for sexualized obscenity comes more from a long-standing discomfort >around sexuality, in my view, than anything that fundamentally distinguishes >sexualized speech from other forms of speech that the majority may not like." >I agree with her opinion and see that reflected in general every day American life. I agree there; we are in general more uncomfortable with sexuality than violence. I just don't see that reflected in law. You said: >My statement relied upon prior obervance. Where did you observe speech about sex being made illegal? I mean, violence is limited in some places. You can't produce a G-rated movie with violence or profanity in it. You can't use certain obscenities over the air. You can't show certain kinds of violence or sex on TV, with all sorts of varying restrictions over times and channels and whatnot. And there are restrictions on what you can show on public billboards, prohibiting things like graphic violence, nudity, sex etc. But I don't see any all-encompassing restrictions on either one. You can go to an adult bookstore* and get stuff that talk about sex in pretty graphic detail. (* - always thought that term was funny. They don't really sell books in the conventional sense and what they do sell seems a lot more on the juvenile side of things than the adult.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,121 #118 January 24, 2012 Quotewe are in general more uncomfortable with sexuality than violence. I just don't see that reflected in law. You don't? I think the obscenity exclusion to the first amendment is a prime example of that. Any violent depiction is protected, some sexually obscene depictions are specifically excluded from First Amendment protection. I think that is a pretty clear reflection in law. Quote>My statement relied upon prior obervance. Where did you observe speech about sex being made illegal? My observance refered to the differing standards as outlined in my previous post. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #119 January 24, 2012 Quote Quote Quote At any rate, it's dang good eatin'! Oh f'sure - there's a famer that breed them, not too far from my folks - nice grub. No kidding? Wow! Bison with a British accent! Chuck Yeah - they boil all the taste out of it!! Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #120 January 24, 2012 Quote Quote Quote Quote At any rate, it's dang good eatin'! Oh f'sure - there's a famer that breed them, not too far from my folks - nice grub. No kidding? Wow! Bison with a British accent! Chuck Yeah - they boil all the taste out of it!! Say it ain't so! Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 189 #121 January 25, 2012 Quote Quote What's wrong with having standards? Noting at all, it is the difference in those standards that can be interesting/amazing. I grew up in a society which standards (in very generalized terms) had more restrictions on violence and profanity and less on obscenity and then moved to a society with less restrictions on violence and profanity but more on obscenity. Just wondering if you ever watch TV... This was just on the Cartoon Network - A nice even dose of violence, profanity and sex... Robot Chicken - Paris Hilton Nicole Richie Prison escape: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU3-M9-0htINow, is that something you'd really want your kids to see?Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marinus 0 #122 January 25, 2012 Quote A nice even dose of violence, profanity and sex... The violence is explicit and the sex is implied, which supports the point that violence is less of a problem than sex.It was fun though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #123 January 25, 2012 Quote Quote Quote What's wrong with having standards? Noting at all, it is the difference in those standards that can be interesting/amazing. I grew up in a society which standards (in very generalized terms) had more restrictions on violence and profanity and less on obscenity and then moved to a society with less restrictions on violence and profanity but more on obscenity. Just wondering if you ever watch TV... This was just on the Cartoon Network - A nice even dose of violence, profanity and sex... Robot Chicken - Paris Hilton Nicole Richie Prison escape: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU3-M9-0htINow, is that something you'd really want your kids to see? It's part of "Adultswim.com". My college kids sometimes watch Adultswim shows (not that I do ). It's only on late at night. Young kids are not part of the target demographic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 189 #124 January 25, 2012 Quote Quote Quote Quote What's wrong with having standards? Noting at all, it is the difference in those standards that can be interesting/amazing. I grew up in a society which standards (in very generalized terms) had more restrictions on violence and profanity and less on obscenity and then moved to a society with less restrictions on violence and profanity but more on obscenity. Just wondering if you ever watch TV... This was just on the Cartoon Network - A nice even dose of violence, profanity and sex... Robot Chicken - Paris Hilton Nicole Richie Prison escape: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU3-M9-0htINow, is that something you'd really want your kids to see? It's part of "Adultswim.com". My college kids sometimes watch Adultswim shows (not that I do ). It's only on late at night. Young kids are not part of the target demographic. Um, most kids have televisions in their rooms these days...pretty naive if you think they don't stay up past midnight. Plus if you have a family package from directv you'll get Cartoon Network east and west where this stuff can be viewed as early at 9pm...other adult swim programming can be viewed during prime time. Not that this really matters...kids can view practically anything on the internet 24 hours a day. I guess the point is that this stuff isn't illegal...nobody's suppressing free speech.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 189 #125 January 25, 2012 QuoteThe violence is explicit and the sex is implied, which supports the point that violence is less of a problem than sex. It is...there are more sexually abused children and pregnant teenagers than teenage killers.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
