Dropzone.com got Jesus?

[rynodigsmusic 0]

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But what about the one true god?

Wisdom is the teacher. Truth is what is taught. Love is what is revealed... God is many things.

"We didn't start the fire"

[maadmax 0]

I actually don't begrudge anybody's religious faith at all. If it works for you, great. It doesn't work for me, and I don't appreciate people like max telling me that I'm selfish, evil, stupid, etc.

I just wanted him to realize how insulting his attack was by replying in kind.

No wonder we see the world in such drastically different ways. My post wasn't an attack, it was a statement of opinion. Believe me, I have no care or concern to attack you. Who's posts are you reading anyway? " selfish, evil, stupid, etc" WTF?

Also, hate to disappoint you, but your response was not insulting. I do enjoy a genuine spirited discussion. Keep it coming, but maybe just chill a little.
I would hate to get a " One Warning" from Bill Von.


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[JohnRich 4]

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Skydivers & Jesus...that's a good one!

What's so funny about that?
Do you think that all skydivers should be atheists?

No, not at all; it's just that most skydivers are atheists though.

So? I'm not sure that is true. But even if it is, does that make it okay to make fun of the minority of skydivers because of their religious beliefs? Would you make fun of black skydivers because there aren't very many of them?

You should respect the religious beliefs of others, even if you don't agree with them.

There are billions of people around the world who believe in religion. Maybe they're all wrong. Maybe you're wrong. No one can say for sure. So how about the two groups just not make fun of each other?

[billvon 2,881]

>Would you make fun of black skydivers because there aren't very many of
>them?

Of course. Why should they get special treatment?

>So how about the two groups just not make fun of each other?

At most DZ's that I've been to, people make fun of each other regularly.

[JohnRich 4]

I hear that you're really a duck.

http://www.mackeprang.com/duck/

That's a good one!

[redlegphi 0]

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If we go by ancient literature as proof of existence, there are lots and lots of gods around.

But what about the one true god?

Clapton?

[Meso 38]

In regards to respecting someone's beliefs, I don't believe in that at all- for a few reasons.

Respect should be earned, and should not be mandatory for every single person. I don't see why I should respect someone's choice if I disagree with it, especially when it's a believe with a shitty history of supporting violence, bigotry and archaic thought patterns. But sure, I'll try respect religion when religion as a whole starts respecting gays, abortion without trying to dictate lives through laws.

If one should respect someone's choices with an unbiased opinion. Then you should respect everyone's immoral choice no matter how disgusting it may be to you and give them the right to that. I'm not just talking about actions of religious conflict but any activity.

[ridestrong 1]

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In regards to respecting someone's beliefs, I don't believe in that at all- for a few reasons.

Respect should be earned, and should not be mandatory for every single person. I don't see why I should respect someone's choice if I disagree with it, especially when it's a believe with a shitty history of supporting violence, bigotry and archaic thought patterns. But sure, I'll try respect religion when religion as a whole starts respecting gays, abortion without trying to dictate lives through laws.

If one should respect someone's choices with an unbiased opinion. Then you should respect everyone's immoral choice no matter how disgusting it may be to you and give them the right to that. I'm not just talking about actions of religious conflict but any activity.

Yes, in most cases repect should be erned, but common courtesy should be given to all.

I think we all know that there is no shortage of close-minded, bigoted, hypocritical people in the world both religious and non-religious.

*I am not afraid of dying... I am afraid of missing life.*
----Disclaimer: I don't know shit about skydiving.----

[RALFFERS 0]

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I wasn't replying to you. I was replying to max's attack on my beliefs as "self-diefying".

I actually don't begrudge anybody's religious faith at all. If it works for you, great. It doesn't work for me, and I don't appreciate people like max telling me that I'm selfish, evil, stupid, etc.

I just wanted him to realize how insulting his attack was by replying in kind.

I'm a little behind in my own thread - there's something that doesn't happen every day, lol...

Anyway, I didn't read the post, butt I don't think anyone was trying to attack you. More often than not, when believers talk about their faith, non-believers almost always say that the other person's beliefs are being pushed on them. That's just not true; no one is forcing you to believe anything. However, if there is such a place such as hell, I would have to be the most evil person, & hate you beyond measure not to tell you about it. What you choose to believe about it is up to you. Christ gave the great commission to preach the Gospel to all people, & that's what believers are doing - not pushing anything on anyone.

You may not believe, & that's fine; but there is a lot evidence showing more & more evidence in favor of the case for Christianity. More & more I come across news that is in favor of biblical accounts; this is not something I'm seeking out either; it comes up when I open my browser in the morning. This for example, from a couple weeks ago.

1/3 of the world's population profess to be Christian - that's 2 billion people. Among them are doctors, lawyers, university professors & scientist from all branches of science. These are all highly educated individuals - who didn't forsake their intelligence in order to believe. The term "apologetics" means: To give reason why you believe what you believe, & it comes from 1 Peter 3:15-16.

What evidence? - there are thousands of O.T & N.T manuscripts. More information here & here. I also found this statement, by prominent Atheist Professor of Law and Philosophy Thomas Nagel to be intriguing (scroll down near the bottom of the page).

With regard to the textual evidence - it's not the age of the manuscripts that makes the creditable, but it's the amount of manuscripts available, & the fact that they all agree with 1 another; there are no contradictions in the bible. Sure, you can point some things out that appear to be contradictions, but once the verse is put in its proper contexts, taking into account the culture of that time, one realizes there is no contradiction.

other evidence includes Messianic prophecies, as well as prophecies concerning the Nation of Israel: (part 1 & part 2). The time between the O.T. Other events in history are accepted as fact on far less evidence than that provided for the case of the bible. Yes, the bible does make some extraordinary claims, but it has the textual & archeological evidence behind it to back up those claims.

Also, look at the lives of the lives of the Apostles themselves; before the resurrection they were unsure (even though they saw Jesus perform miracles),, & were scared & timid - Peter denied Christ 3 times... After the resurrection though, they all boldly preached the Gospel throughout the entire world, even though they were threatened for doing so. They continued to be persecuted, & eventually killed for their faith; they died unspeakable deaths. People don't go through all that & give up their lives for something they know is a lie. Furthermore, they had noting to gain by pulling a hoax. Again, look at what they went through because of their beliefs.

All we know from History is through what is written down & passed on. There is more evidence for the case of Christianity than any other event in History; if it wasn't for the resurrection more people would believe. It's that 1 claim that makes people go: "nahhhhhhhhhhhh..............."

Having said all that, I think that people choose not to believe in God because of not wanting to be held accountable to a higher authority. There are other reasons I'm sure, but that in my book is #1.

Dialogue/commentary between Divot, Twardo & myself -

"from your first Oshkosh when the three of us were riding to or from one of

[billvon 2,881]

>You may not believe, & that's fine; but there is a lot evidence showing
>more & more evidence in favor of the case for Christianity.

If you mean "I see more stuff that makes me happy to be a Christian" then great. If you mean "I see more proof that the Bible is literally correct, thus proving the case for Christianity" I'd disagree. As we learn more, we realize that the Bible is not an accurate recounting of events, but rather a morality play intended to teach people Christian ethics.

> Furthermore, they had noting to gain by pulling a hoax. Again, look at
>what they went through because of their beliefs.

The persecution and sacrifice that a modern religious terrorist endures may speak well of his character and perseverance, but does not in and of itself 'prove' the truth of his cause or the morality of his acts.

[RALFFERS 0]

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The persecution and sacrifice that a modern religious terrorist endures may speak well of his character and perseverance, but does not in and of itself 'prove' the truth of his cause or the morality of his acts.

The major difference between modern-day religious extremist is that they kills others in the name of what they believe; whereas the Apostles willingly gave up their lives.

Dialogue/commentary between Divot, Twardo & myself -

"from your first Oshkosh when the three of us were riding to or from one of

[RALFFERS 0]

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As we learn more, we realize that the Bible is not an accurate recounting of events, but rather a morality play intended to teach people Christian ethics.

Can you provide any sources for backing your statement?

Dialogue/commentary between Divot, Twardo & myself -

"from your first Oshkosh when the three of us were riding to or from one of

[billvon 2,881]

>Can you provide any sources for backing your statement?

Sure; here's one recent one. The Biblical deluge, which supposedly covered the entire earth, was likely just the Black Sea flooding:

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/blacksea/ax/frame.html

[RALFFERS 0]

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>Can you provide any sources for backing your statement?

Sure; here's one recent one. The Biblical deluge, which supposedly covered the entire earth, was likely just the Black Sea flooding:

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/blacksea/ax/frame.html

That's really short, & it doesn't quote anything; it reads like someone just giving their opinion. I expect more out of National Geographic. I need something more substantial & scientific.

Look at it another way - nearly every culture in history has a story of a global flood.

Dialogue/commentary between Divot, Twardo & myself -

"from your first Oshkosh when the three of us were riding to or from one of

[Andy9o8 2]

Published by the "Institute for Creation Science". Thanks for the unbiased source. And for the insult to our intelligence.

[RALFFERS 0]

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Published by the "Institute for Creation Science". Thanks for the unbiased source. And for the insult to our intelligence.

I could say that National Geographic is biased just the same; that gets us no where. There is no such thing as unbiased, in that the label of biased is always put on the opposing side no matter what.

Read my original post; I gave unbiased evidence for what I believe (the article in the beginning from Yahoo news. Furthermore, the author of the article holds a PhD - how is that an insult to your intelligence?...

Dialogue/commentary between Divot, Twardo & myself -

"from your first Oshkosh when the three of us were riding to or from one of

[kallend 1,929]

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Furthermore, the author of the article holds a PhD - .

Oooooh!

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[HHsurfer 0]

Published by the "National Geographic". Thanks for the unbiased source. And for the insult to our intelligence.

Scientist are like most people, and are very biased in their views. It takes a humble person to consider both sides.

[Tiger6513 0]

>Not to mention indisputable evidence that Julius, Augustus, Tiberius Caesar (among others) were real and become gods.

Such as? What exactly makes one a God?

[billvon 2,881]

>That's really short, & it doesn't quote anything; it reads like someone
>just giving their opinion.

It is; it's just one piece on it. Here are a few more:

http://www.nytimes.com/1996/12/17/science/geologists-link-black-sea-deluge-to-farming-s-rise.html?pagewanted=1

http://www.black-sea-atlantis.com/

http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Black+Sea+deluge+theory

>Look at it another way - nearly every culture in history has a story of
>a global flood.

Well, most do. Indeed, the ones with the most consistent "sea rose and destroyed everything" stories were the ones closest to the Black Sea.

[Andy9o8 2]

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It takes a humble person to consider both sides.

Bollocks. It takes simple reason, logic and a basic understanding of the lessons of one's education of the physical universe to separate fact from mythology. Call religious faith what it is: belief in something absent physical, scientifically-testable evidence; but don't put it in the same category with scientific evidence, or even theories, to be reasonably "considered" by educated people. Please. Because that's what insults our intelligence.

[JohnRich 4]

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In regards to respecting someone's beliefs, I don't believe in that at all- for a few reasons.

Respect should be earned, and should not be mandatory for every single person. I don't see why I should respect someone's choice if I disagree with it, especially when it's a believe with a shitty history of supporting violence, bigotry and archaic thought patterns. But sure, I'll try respect religion when religion as a whole starts respecting gays, abortion without trying to dictate lives through laws.

If one should respect someone's choices with an unbiased opinion. Then you should respect everyone's immoral choice no matter how disgusting it may be to you and give them the right to that. I'm not just talking about actions of religious conflict but any activity.

Your characterization of religious people does not fit the large majority who practice a religion. You shouldn't tar them all with that same nasty brush. I propose that you should pay individuals respect unless they've proven to you otherwise that they fall into that negative category. The vast majority of religious people are fine upstanding citizens, and should be treated as such.


To billvon: Quack quack!

[kallend 1,929]

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>Not to mention indisputable evidence that Julius, Augustus, Tiberius Caesar (among others) were real and become gods.

Such as? What exactly makes one a God?

Oh, that's easy. Contemporary literature says they were gods. Multiple sources, too, unlike the Bible.

You can't be serious kellend. Just because something is written in a book doesn't mean it is true or false. .

You mean the BIBLE could be false?

(Note to moderators - we really need that sarcasm icon)

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[dontsplatmatt 0]

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With regard to the textual evidence - it's not the age of the manuscripts that makes the creditable, but it's the amount of manuscripts available, & the fact that they all agree with 1 another; there are no contradictions in the bible. Sure, you can point some things out that appear to be contradictions, but once the verse is put in its proper contexts, taking into account the culture of that time, one realizes there is no contradiction.
.

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/donald_morgan/inconsistencies.html

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/donald_morgan/flaws.html

That is quite a bold assertion. Here are some interesting articles on this topic. Feel free to pull out your Bible for reference. Not all of these examples can be disregarded simply because of the "culture of that time."

[kallend 1,929]

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With regard to the textual evidence - it's not the age of the manuscripts that makes the creditable, but it's the amount of manuscripts available, & the fact that they all agree with 1 another; there are no contradictions in the bible. Sure, you can point some things out that appear to be contradictions, but once the verse is put in its proper contexts, taking into account the culture of that time, one realizes there is no contradiction.
.

Interpretation: fundamentalists can explain away the contradictions by twisting the meaning of the contradictory passages.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.