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RonD1120

Observation Regarding Spirituality

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I ponder the animosity in SC and I have reached a hypothesis of understanding. First some background.

As a sport parachutist from the 60's I considered myself outside the norm. I'll explain the concept of “normal” later. Apparently, so did many others as evidenced by the topics of discussion after a day's jumping activities. In the early 70's a very common and popular topic, along with the Vietnam War, was spirituality. It was the “Dawning of the Age of Aquarius” you know. We sought to discover levels of consciousness and different dimensions of thinking and living.

My hypothesis is modern day skydivers are consumed with technology and have no interest in things spiritual. So, I offer a primer for the seekers among us.

There are levels or dimensions of thinking and I present my concept in reverse hierarchy as follows:

1.Physical – the observation and categorization of data from the five senses.
2.Emotional – the experience and categorization of feelings
3.Scientific or cause and effect
4.Mental – daydreaming or fantasy activities
5.Spiritual or metaphysical

Consciousness expansion is the desire and ability to progress through the levels or dimensions.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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And you share this view of spirituality with the use of technology. :o;)



I did not mean to imply they are mutually exclusive.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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There is nothing supernatural...The things that people attribute to the supernatural are simply natural things that we don't understand yet., not the realm of some mythological god.
"Science, logic and reason will fly you to the moon. Religion will fly you into buildings."
"Because figuring things out is always better than making shit up."

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supernatural refers to objects or events that are observable in the outside world by the senses but defy scientific explanation.

spirituality refers to issues relating to the human soul, such as transcendance of the material world, desires & efforts to come closer to God, etc.
Speed Racer
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supernatural refers to objects or events that are observable in the outside world by the senses but defy scientific explanation.

spirituality refers to issues relating to the human soul, such as transcendance of the material world, desires & efforts to come closer to God, etc.



Does it not occur to you that the observation of one has historically lead to an unjustified the belief in the other?
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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There is nothing supernatural...The things that people attribute to the supernatural are simply natural things that we don't understand yet., not the realm of some mythological god.



Or, stuff that never happened but the 'observer' reported it anyway ... and some people are gullable enough to believe it. ... There's one born every minute:P

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

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The replies so far in the thread pretty much explain why spiritual discussion are rare (around a dropzone anyway). They assume the science of today is correct and therefore God or anything else "supernatural" is a myth. It's tough to have a discussion on the meaning of life, the soul, or levels of consciousness if people think science explains it all.

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Stay positive and love your life.

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t's tough to have a discussion on the meaning of life, the soul, or levels of consciousness if people think science explains it all.



To me spirituality is a meaningless concept, that's why I have no interest in it. It's got nothing to do with the fact that science actually explains things and is quite useful; pretty much everything religion isn't.

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The replies so far in the thread pretty much explain why spiritual discussion are rare (around a dropzone anyway). They assume the science of today is correct and therefore God or anything else "supernatural" is a myth. It's tough to have a discussion on the meaning of life, the soul, or levels of consciousness if people think science explains it all.



It becomes easy to see the level of discernment or level of consciousness the responder is operating in.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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To me spirituality is a meaningless concept, that's why I have no interest in it. It's got nothing to do with the fact that science actually explains things and is quite useful; pretty much everything religion isn't.



However, to those in the substance abuse/chemical dependency/mental health profession, both professionals and client/patients, spirituality is an integral aspect of treatment.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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To me spirituality is a meaningless concept, that's why I have no interest in it. It's got nothing to do with the fact that science actually explains things and is quite useful; pretty much everything religion isn't.



However, to those in the substance abuse/chemical dependency/mental health profession, both professionals and client/patients, spirituality is an integral aspect of treatment.




From my perspective, my spirit is very self evident to me. To RonD, the same is also probably true. Hence his desire for spiritual exploration, in his case through Christianity.

In JackC's mind, things might be entirely different.


Here's one possibility to consider:

It may well be that some people do not have the same capacity as others for any sort of spiritual experience.

Some people may lack any form of an "Inner Life".

In short, if someone says "I have no soul." it may very well be true. The person could have an intellect that allows them to outwardly function as a human being, but might have little or no capacity for any sort of inner life or spirit or soul (call it what you will).

To such a person, any sort of spiritual efforts would appear to them to be like chasing after pink unicorns. It would be completely and mind-bogglingly meaningless to them, since they don't have a soul to begin with.

Since we are not inside each other's heads, we can never know for sure, until someone invents the Vulcan Mind Meld or something.


It would explain why these arguments never go anywhere. To someone without the capacity for a soul, spirituality in pretty much any form would seem like so much bullshit. To someone who DOES have a soul, it seems so obvious that we have this inner existence, that we might naturally, but incorrectly, believe that all other people feel it as well.
Speed Racer
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However, to some of those in the substance abuse/chemical dependency/mental health profession, both professionals and client/patients, spirituality is an integral aspect of treatment.



Fixed



Do you have experience or knowledge on a treatment facility/program without a spiritual component?
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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The way that I see it (and I'm far from being an expert) Spirituality is a very personal thing and can not be measured and analysed...
not sure if this adds Anything - sorry

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

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From my perspective, my spirit is very self evident to me. To RonD, the same is also probably true. Hence his desire for spiritual exploration, in his case through Christianity.

In JackC's mind, things might be entirely different.


Here's one possibility to consider:

It may well be that some people do not have the same capacity as others for any sort of spiritual experience.

Some people may lack any form of an "Inner Life".

In short, if someone says "I have no soul." it may very well be true. The person could have an intellect that allows them to outwardly function as a human being, but might have little or no capacity for any sort of inner life or spirit or soul (call it what you will).

To such a person, any sort of spiritual efforts would appear to them to be like chasing after pink unicorns. It would be completely and mind-bogglingly meaningless to them, since they don't have a soul to begin with.

Since we are not inside each other's heads, we can never know for sure, until someone invents the Vulcan Mind Meld or something.


It would explain why these arguments never go anywhere. To someone without the capacity for a soul, spirituality in pretty much any form would seem like so much bullshit. To someone who DOES have a soul, it seems so obvious that we have this inner existence, that we might naturally, but incorrectly, believe that all other people feel it as well.



I have often thought about the possibility that some folks are without the genetic predisposition for any understanding of spirituality. My thought is that without the seed of Abraham in their heritage it is difficult to impossible for them to comprehend. As the AA Big Book says, "There are such unfortunates. They are not at fault; they seem to have been born that way."
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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supernatural refers to objects or events that are observable in the outside world by the senses but defy scientific explanation.

spirituality refers to issues relating to the human soul, such as transcendance of the material world, desires & efforts to come closer to God, etc.



I disagree with your definitions, which I think impart artificial distinctions. To me, they are one and the same; or if you will, the overall category is "supernatural", with everything else
(including, but not limited to, God, gods, the Devil, Heaven, Hell, spirits, spirituality, the soul, reincarnation of the soul, karma, magic, Wicca, witchcraft, faith healing, reiki, predetermined destiny, spirits of land or plants or animals, good luck, bad luck, any and all superstitions, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, etc.)
all being subsets of "supernatural".

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seed of Abraham? I'm not sure what you mean by that.



Judaism begins with Abraham, his son Isaac, his son Jacob later Israel. God told Abraham his seed would be greater that the stars in the heavens.

I am proposing weak theory in this soul reference.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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I'm trying to understand: So spirituality in any form is to you, no different than believing in, say, pink unicorns?



Sorry to horrify you, but: Yes.
.

Not horrifying at all, it goes along with what I posted above.
Speed Racer
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seed of Abraham? I'm not sure what you mean by that.



Judaism begins with Abraham, his son Isaac, his son Jacob later Israel. God told Abraham his seed would be greater that the stars in the heavens.

I am proposing weak theory in this soul reference.



OK, but my post was about spirituality in general (through any religion, or even through no organized religion at all).

I am saying that there may be some people who lack any capacity for spiritual experience of any sort.
Speed Racer
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