Law requires guns be locked up at home

[Darius11 12]

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[JohnRich 4]

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I think this is a law based on good intentions, but poorly written. This is another one of those occasions where I believe the NRA could have given guidance to create a "good" law as opposed to a poorly written one.

The NRA should not be in the business of helping anyone write laws that restrict gun rights in our own homes.

This law is stupid. It implies that a gun carried on your person is safe (not necessarily true), and that a gun sitting in a nightstand drawer in the next room is unsafe (also not necessarily true). Actually, a gun carried on your person as you move around a house is probably a whole lot more likely to go off accidentally, then a gun that's in a drawer with no-one touching it. And in addition, at some point you have to quit carrying it around, and lock it up for the night, or when you go to work - and that involves unloading it and removing a live round from the chamber, which involves the risk of an accidental discharge. If people actually obeyed this law, there would probably be MORE gun accidents.

Oh, and did you notice that this law only applies to handguns, but not long guns. So you can have a loaded shotgun next to the bed, ready to go, no lock, and that's legal. So if their concern is for children in the home, that's a loophole in their own law.

If you have children in the home, then I want to see the gun secured, like in one of those quick-access safes already mentioned. If only grown adults live in the home, no one should tell them how to store their guns. But the feeble-minded idiots in San Fransicko can't think that far.

The only "good intentions" these folks have, is based upon the premise that all guns are evil, and therefore anything they can do to restrict them, or persecute their owners, is good.

Still waiting to hear your opinion. Come out of the shadows and take a stand.

[quade 3]

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Still waiting to hear your opinion. Come out of the shadows and take a stand.

I've already given my opinion. You simply don't care to hear about any sort of middle ground.

I can't help that.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[JohnRich 4]

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Still waiting to hear your opinion. Come out of the shadows and take a stand.

I've already given my opinion. You simply don't care to hear about any sort of middle ground.

You gave a wishy-washy reply:

"I think this is a law based on good intentions, but poorly written."

So does that mean you're against it as-is? If so, say so. Or does that just put to much of a spasm in your gut, to actually admit that a gun law is a bad one? I can't help you with your spasms, but I believe you shouldn't be afraid to speak unequivocally what you actually think.

[quade 3]

Here's the deal, I don't see the world as black or white. Nearly everything could use improvement and just because it could use improvement and isn't "perfect" doesn't mean it's "bad," it just needs to be improved.

The entire law could be improved by simply changing the language a small bit while maintaining restrictions about keeping guns secured while the residence is unattended.

I thought I had already made that perfectly clear, but your ability to read and comprehend are not under my control.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[mnealtx 0]

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If you think that reasonable conversation has anything to do with gun control laws in the Bay Area, you're wasting our time. They knew the ban was illegal going into the vote, but promoted it anyway.

"Reasonable conversation" and "compromise", to the gun-grabbers, means letting them frame the conversation and giving up whatever the gun-grabbers want.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[AggieDave 6]

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. . . if a 17yo kid breaks in your house with a lock picking kit, and uses a disc grinder to remove your safety lock, brings his own ammo, and then shoots himself, that is something that nobody can protect against. (Without being home all the time or a security system)

Has that ever happened?

I've seen gun safes cut open with torches and/or cut with power tools more than a few times. As to the age of the suspects, well, that ranged from 15 to 50. This was more than a single burglary. More then a couple, actually. These are reports that I have personally taken, in a single city, not some state wide or even county wide statistic.

Luckily, at least in Texas, theft of a firearm is a felony and is a separate charge from the burglary of a habitation (also a felony).

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[mnealtx 0]

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Still waiting to hear your opinion. Come out of the shadows and take a stand.

I've already given my opinion. You simply don't care to hear about any sort of middle ground.

I can't help that.

Perhaps you could fill us in on some of those laws where the gun-grabbers have given up anything...

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[kelpdiver 2]

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The entire law could be improved by simply changing the language a small bit while maintaining restrictions about keeping guns secured while the residence is unattended.

Nope - that still puts the resident at risk. Since this is about self defense, what about the person who is followed home? Why should they have to unlock their weapon after entering the house? They may not have that much time. They may have only a 2 second head start.

Again, you have no idea what's going on up here if you think this is about "reasonable."

[LongWayToFall 0]

Not to mention that means locking and unlocking the firearm every night, if you want real security.

Firearms owners know very well that guns are dangerous, and although there are exceptions, most are very safe about their practices. What needs to happen, is firearms owners making sure that guns are not left loaded, out in the open. It is fairly simple. If you want to keep it loaded for defense, put it in a place that is not visible, or easy for a kid to find. I think that if it is sitting in a desk drawer, this is fine, because if a kid really does steal it and use it to hurt themselves or others, they could have just as easily done it with medication, chemicals, etc etc. Kids do need SOME amount of intelligence to not get themselves killed.

[Krip 2]

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. . . if a 17yo kid breaks in your house with a lock picking kit, and uses a disc grinder to remove your safety lock, brings his own ammo, and then shoots himself, that is something that nobody can protect against. (Without being home all the time or a security system)

Has that ever happened?

I've seen gun safes cut open with torches and/or cut with power tools more than a few times. As to the age of the suspects, well, that ranged from 15 to 50. This was more than a single burglary. More then a couple, actually. These are reports that I have personally taken, in a single city, not some state wide or even county wide statistic.

Luckily, at least in Texas, theft of a firearm is a felony and is a separate charge from the burglary of a habitation (also a felony).

Any one can do a search on Youtube and watch how to break into a gun safe, break into one of those night stand gun box's, pick a lock etc

Some of the dudes doing the show and tell are teens

I Should have done some more research before I bought my cheap ass 800 lb safe. A good safe would make the bad guys or teens work their butts off for at least a hr.

One Jump Wonder

[Andy9o8 0]

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in Texas, theft of a firearm is a felony

A mere felony?

[bodypilot90 0]

John, I wonder if the city fathers could be held liable in the event someone could not get to a lock gun in time?

[futuredivot 0]

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You simply don't care to hear about any sort of middle ground.

Nope, middle ground is 1/2 a loss of my rights. It makes me happy to have the ability to reach in my nightstand and find a weapon in a disengage the safety and fire status. And it's no business of the government.

You agree (statement, not question)

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What is it in you that would deny people their right to be happy?

What business is it of the government's?

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1334950;search_string=gay;#1334950

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[quade 3]

And it isn't any of the governments business what YOU do with the weapon in your own bedroom.

However, I think we'd both agree that the government does have an interested in what happens with CHILDREN in any bedroom.

That's the middle ground I'm talking about.

I've said repeatedly that the law isn't perfect the way it's currently written. I think it's reasonable to have guns locked so children can't use them in unsupervised situations.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[beqa 0]

The law that is meantioned is just plain bull. No one should have to right to tell you how to handle your personal property. These city and state laws that keep popping up all over the US, is a blatant disregard for the basic freedoms and principles that the United States Constitution was founded on.

I don't think that anyone has the right to tell other people how or when they can defend themselves. If some psycho comes into your home, with the intent to harm you or your family, don't you want to be able to keep them safe?

With this law you run the risk of you or someone you care about being seriously harmed BEFORE you can get to what you need to protect yourselves.

The makers of these laws aren't thinking of your safety, they want to control you.

As far as children being in the home.... If you take away the mystery of the gun, it isn't an object that children will take much interest in. Most children raised in a home where they are allowed to learn about guns, and handle them safely are at a lower risk of 'accidents'. It's when you get children that are told not to touch guns, or that have one parent that fears them, that they get curious and want to play with them.

Gun safety has nothing to do with having a gun locked up. It is about teaching people to handle them safely. Most people that are scared of guns have never even fired one. How's that for education?

BTW, guns aren't evil, they can't hurt anyone. You have to have a PERSON to hurt someone with a gun.

Besides, all laws like this do, is tell criminals to have fun doing whatever they want, while LAW ABIDING people get punished.

[mnealtx 0]

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I think it's reasonable to have guns locked so children can't use them in unsupervised situations.

What about pools, Paul? Should pools have locking covers?

How about household cleaners? Should they have caps with padlocks on them?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[futuredivot 0]

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I think we'd both agree that the government does have an interested in what happens with CHILDREN in any bedroom

And you would be wrong if you were talking about my bed room. I don't have kids and don't childproof. The outlets aren't guarded, the poisonous cleaners are under the sink, and a potentially dangerous weapon or two can be found in the nightstand or under the bed or in a closet. I shouldn't be liable if you bring your poorly reared brat into my home who doesn't understand that you don't plunder through someone else's stuff and then fail to keep proper tabs on him or her.

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[kelpdiver 2]

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I think we'd both agree that the government does have an interested in what happens with CHILDREN in any bedroom

And you would be wrong if you were talking about my bed room. I don't have kids and don't childproof. The outlets aren't guarded, the poisonous cleaners are under the sink, and a potentially dangerous weapon or two can be found in the nightstand or under the bed or in a closet.

Don't forget the porn lying all over the place!

SF is full of singles and DINKs, so if this law were really about the poor children, it's the wrong place.

[JohnRich 4]

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Here's the deal, I don't see the world as black or white. Nearly everything could use improvement and just because it could use improvement and isn't "perfect" doesn't mean it's "bad," it just needs to be improved. The entire law could be improved by simply changing the language a small bit while maintaining restrictions about keeping guns secured while the residence is unattended.

As-is, it's just plain bad. That you can't bring yourself to admit that, just shows you to be one of the usual gun-control fanatics, who can never say anything bad about any gun-control law. Even though it's bad, it's still good. Anything that restricts gun owners, is good. Right?

Fact: Until it's "improved", it's bad. Period.

And here you seem to think it's about locking guns up when people are away from home, presumably so they can't be burgled. And a few messages later you seem to think it's about protecting children. The fact that you can't figure out what the intended purpose of the law is, means it's bad.

You also said something about good intentions. Every law has someone's good intentions behind it. But good intentions are often misguided or misapplied, or done in ignorance, or incompetence. Regardless, just because someone had good intentions, doesn't mean that the end result is good. And that's what we have here.

If they had wanted it to be an anti-burglary law, or a child protection law, they could have easily written it as such. They're educated adults. But they didn't specify that it only applies when people leave their homes, nor did it make make an exemption for people without children. Those are simple things, but the San Fransicko idiots didn't include them. Therefore, it's a BAD law. By your own definition.

It's a shame that you are so against guns, that you are willing to look at a pig with lipstick, and call it beautiful.

[LongWayToFall 0]

Hahaha.

Whats funny is that I know several police in the San Francisco bay that have illegally configured assault rifles, loaded, in their home. If they are doing it, it shows how they feel about keeping loaded weapons at hand.

[beqa 0]

It also shows that they know that they could need it in a moments notice.

Isn't it nice that they are allowed to protect themselves and their families, but they can take you downtown for doing it for you and yours?!

[futuredivot 0]

So, it's 11:30 pm and my dogs go nuts. There is a car 1/2 down my driveway stopped so I get dressed and go see what's up. It's a deputy looking for a guy that just stabbed someone.
I'm glad I don't have to deal with trigger locks or safes tonight, and if Skippy wants to bring his knife to my house the only choice I make is what size hole he dies from.

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[Caitlin89 0]

This made me chuckle. Seriously, though? Sounds slightly paranoid...

[JohnRich 4]

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Sounds slightly paranoid...

Knives are the 2nd most deadly weapon with which you can be attacked.
People stabbed to death with knives last year: 2,000
Robbery with knives: 32,000
Aggravated assault with knives: 136,000
Burglary with knives: 619,000

Here's a sweet little story for you to read:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5364780/Knifeman-copied-scene-from-The-Shining-as-he-attacked-paramedics.html

It's not paranoia to know what dangers face you, and to take measures to mitigate those dangers.

Is it paranoia to carry a reserve parachute and practice your emergency procedures?