grimmie 173 #26 October 9, 2008 Education and earning power don't always correlate. I wonder what the education levels of the 1,000 wealthiest people in the US are? Throwing out those that made their millions the old fashioned way...inheritance. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #27 October 9, 2008 Quote Quote I used to be one of those people, and later discovered that it had been simple jealousy. But did you ever use the quote "I'm not very educated, but I have COMMON SENSE - or I am STREET SMART" another quote from the insecure Yep, that was me. And of course by saying so I proved the opposite. I know I'm more educated today and a bit more mature, and I hope I have more "common sense" than I did then. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #28 October 9, 2008 Quote Not intended as contrarian If I EVER appear to be anything other than "contrarian" I pray that someone has the good sense to step up and slap me up side my head and knock some sense back into me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #29 October 9, 2008 QuoteI wasn't disputing the value of higher education nor am I against it. However, his generalization that one who isn't highly educated yet see's himself/herself as having common sense or street smarts is simply insecure. Intelligence and education are two different things. Intelligence and education are most certainly two different things, and insecurity is unrelated to either. Common sense can also prove quite lucrative, but bragging about it demonstrates insecurity independent of the presence or absence of said "street smarts." Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nerdgirl 0 #30 October 9, 2008 QuoteEducation and earning power don't always correlate. Thsoe are the averages as reported by the Dept of Commerce. That's the data. As I wrote there will be exceptions -- highschool graduates makig millions and PhDs below the poverty line. If you have other data, it would be interesting to consider comparatively. QuoteI wonder what the education levels of the 1,000 wealthiest people in the US are? Throwing out those that made their millions the old fashioned way...inheritance. Concur that would be interesting. By default, those folks are above average in incomes at least. Here's the list of the 400 richest Americans. 8 of 10 of the top have bachelors and about half of those have masters. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #31 October 9, 2008 Quote If I EVER appear to be anything other than "contrarian" I pray that someone has the good sense to step up and slap me up side my head and knock some sense back into me. Sllaappp!!! Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nerdgirl 0 #32 October 9, 2008 QuoteQuoteIn another school in the same district they had problems offering advanced placement classes because the parents claimed it was "unfair to their normal children" I think THIS here is one of the keys to the issue. Darius is right, there IS a bias against intelligence and education in this country. And what i quoted is one of the main reasons, i think. I would speculate it’s exacerbated by late 20th/early 21st Century anti-intellectualism and elevation of the pridefully ignorant jerk as epitome of ‘cool’. Although, it seems to go back further, e.g., Richard Hofstadter's Anti-Intellectualism in American Life published in 1963. How does one measure extent of anti-intellectualism? Where in the 20th Century was the most significant anti-intellectualism observed? Maoist China is the first candidate that I would put forth. Cultures, states, groups of people that do not value education -- whether inner city anti-intellectualism or rejection of education for women in most religious Islamic states -- tend to have higher levels of poverty. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
downwardspiral 0 #33 October 9, 2008 Quote Quote I wasn't disputing the value of higher education nor am I against it. However, his generalization that one who isn't highly educated yet see's himself/herself as having common sense or street smarts is simply insecure. Intelligence and education are two different things. Intelligence and education are most certainly two different things, and insecurity is unrelated to either. Common sense can also prove quite lucrative, but bragging about it demonstrates insecurity independent of the presence or absence of said "street smarts." Blues, Dave Oh kinda like the old " I may have a small penis but I can lick my eyebrows" addage?www.FourWheelerHB.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #34 October 9, 2008 Quote Oh kinda like the old " I may have a small penis but I can lick my eyebrows" addage? When I was at A-school in San Diego, the gal I was seeing was talking about flying down to visit. There was a guy in my company who was most certainly within the top 5 ugliest guys I've ever seen in my life. Short, pudgy, acne, no chin, BC glasses, and a crew cut. He told me that if my gal came down, she'd leave me for him in a heartbeat. I laughed really hard and asked why. His response was to lick across the lens of his BC glasses. A group of us went to The Body Shop the following weekend. We suddenly became QUITE popular with all the strippers when elephant-man started waggin' his tongue around. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
downwardspiral 0 #35 October 9, 2008 Gene Simmons ain't all that pretty either. www.FourWheelerHB.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #36 October 10, 2008 QuoteEducation and earning power don't always correlate. I wonder what the education levels of the 1,000 wealthiest people in the US are? Throwing out those that made their millions the old fashioned way...inheritance. For wealth, you may find an inconsistency here as the most common factor is working for yourself, and that often doesn't require college or post graduate education. Above all, it requires an insane work drive. for income (salary), I suspect you'd see the upward sloping curve, though in some fields it dips for those with a Masters because of the opportunity cost of yielding years of experience for school. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybill 18 #37 October 10, 2008 Hi Dari, Your operative word here is "SOME." It's the "SOME" that seem to be more vocal. Funny how that works, read the bumper sticker, "My kid is an Honor Student at Bling Bling School" and the next car has,"My kid beat up your honor student!!" Go Figure. A few years ago I worked as a Rigger for Irvin Aerospace. Putting Aerospace Parachutes together wasn't really complicated but it did require some "technical" ability. I thought it was rather sad and yet amusing at the comments made by some of the lower echelon employees about my position,"Those damn Riggers make too much money and don't ever do no work!!" Go figure?? Oh yes, another bumper sticker for you,"If you can read this, THANK A TEACHER!!!!!!!"SCR-2034, SCS-680 III%, Deli-out Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheAnvil 0 #38 October 10, 2008 I don't think it's widespread as you might think, but that's just me. I believe many people with advanced education are the targets of the ire and hatred of the less educated among us because of jealousy. The fact that more education many times equates to a higher salary and standard of living further fuels that jealousy, which in turn fuels ire and hatred which are projected onto the folks with advanced degrees. The fact that one has to work hard for those degrees is irrelevant to those projecting that ire. The fact that those with such degrees work hard at their job in order to become successful post-graduation is also irrelevant to those projecting the hatred of which you speak. You see class envy used as a tool in almost every election cycle. It's nothing new. "Tax cuts for the rich" and "tax cuts for working families" abound from Republican and Democrat during every election cycle. I'd like for somebody to show me the non-working electorate some day. They're quite few in number. The rich are out there - and they work their asses off for the most part. Those who have achieved will always face jealousy from those who have not - and some of those jealous folks choose to release that jealousy in a non-constructive manner. I have no problem with higher education and think we as a society do naught but benefit from increased levels of education for all. The failure of the public school system in many cases is one of the worst tragedies we as a nation must confront. Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ErricoMalatesta 0 #39 October 10, 2008 Quote The rich are out there - and they work their asses off for the most part. Hahaha Yeah sure they do. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheAnvil 0 #40 October 10, 2008 Yes, they do indeed. Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,394 #41 October 10, 2008 >Intelligence and education are two different things. Agreed, but they are closely related for a number of reasons. One, selection bias. Smarter people, on average, tend to go to (and remain in) school* more often than less smart people. So a graduating class of a high school contains more intelligent people than the equivalent "dropout" class purely because the smarter kids made it through school without flunking out. Two, increase in intelligence relative to specific areas. It is difficult to define intelligence without using specific examples of intelligence (number theory, pattern recognition, language usage etc.) Most of these specific skills are improved by education. Three, increase in general intelligence. It is now pretty clear that the brain is like many other parts of your body - the more you use it, the better it works. You can see actual physical changes in the brains of people who are deprived of normal learning experiences (like seeing lots of motion or hearing a lot of spoken language) during their development. Learning new tasks (like learning to speak a new language) helps slow down the onset of senility. None of this says that people who don't go to school are dumb, or that everyone who goes to school is smart. It's more like saying that people who go to a gym tend to be in better shape than people who don't. Not 100% true, but true at a general level. (* - school in this case meaning some sort of formal education, whether public, private or home schooled.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjulia 2 #42 October 10, 2008 McCain-Obama advisors to debate on education In case you can't get enough of political debates, the education advisers to the Democratic and Republican presidential candidates will debate education issues on October 21 at Teachers College of Columbia University in a matchup sponsored by EDUCATION WEEK, which will also webcast the event. Senator Obama will be represented by Linda Darling-Hammond, a professor of education at Stanford University, and Senator McCain by Lisa Graham Keegan, a former Arizona superintendent of public instruction. The moderator will be Susan Fuhrman, Teachers College president. The debate, which begins at 4 p.m. PDT, will be webcast by Education Week ; Since the candidates have been virtually silent on education, you may want to tune in. Julia M. Murphy A16070 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
