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Lefty

Ahmadinejad to speak at Columbia University

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Actually, it's not so self evident to me. Care to elaborate after reading my response to your question?



Read it finally. Sounds the same as here.


Sorry, you totally lost me. What should I read?
And what sounds like what?
I feel like I'm missing a piece of the conversation.

Vale


"I" read your response (:Dred, not reed). Thanks, Italy sounds like it has the same policy as most everyone else in the west - including the US.

Edit: Reviewing the e-mail string, I see you were mocking NCclimber instead of implying that the US didn't do this as I had first inferred. My bad.


Actually, I was starting to suspect that you might have misunderstood my position, and weren't just being sarcastic.
But my misunderstanding of your last sentence (if only English spelling wasn't so bloody arbitrary >:() had me leaning towards the latter interpretation, but evidently there was some misunderstanding on my part too.
Oh well, what really matters is that we did manage to understand each other, eventually ;)

Cheers,

Vale

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Having ROTC entails a financial obligation on the part of the university to provide office staff, office space, etc., and having a professor of military (or naval or air force) science along with a bunch of instructors.


Of course, this had little (if anything) to do with why ROTC was kicked off campus. :P

Nice try, though.


Allowing free speech does NOT involve accepting a financial obligation, setting aside office space, hiring support staff, etc.

ROTC does not have "chapters", it is a structured educational program.


Where'd all these red herrings come from? [:/]


Here.


Of course, this had little (if anything) to do with why ROTC was kicked off campus.

Nice try, though.

Dayum, this is easy. :D:D:D


Sorry, I thought you ACTUALLY wanted to know where the red herring came from originally, rather than just playing your silly word games. My mistake.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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When the San Francisco school system kicked JROTC off the high schools against large dissent from students and parents.

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I find it ironic that Columbia will let Ackmindickahead speak at their campus but they will not let the ROTC have a chapter on their campus.



Come on' guys ... if one wants the officer corps to continue to become more conservative, we want to keep ROTC & JROTC out of leftist universities and places like San Francisco. I agree with Duncan Hunter on that one!

VR/
Marg

p.s. Columbia's ROTC site: http://www.columbia.edu/cu/rotc/

&

Gadzooks! UC Berkeley's: http://armyrotc.com/edu/univcaberkeley/index.htm

Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters.
Tibetan Buddhist saying

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So what are trying to say? That ROTC has been kept off campus as a financial matter... and that politics hasn't been a leading factor?



Why don't you pay attention?

The presence or absence of a ROTC program on any university campus has nothing whatsoever to do with freedom of speech. THAT was the red herring.

PS

Here's a nice picture I took on the Carl Vinson, courtesy of the NROTC.

Here's a nice picture I took from a KC135 somewhere over Arizona, courtesy of the AFROTC.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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So what are trying to say? That ROTC has been kept off campus as a financial matter... and that politics hasn't been a leading factor?



Why don't you pay attention?

The presence or absence of a ROTC program on any university campus has nothing whatsoever to do with freedom of speech. THAT was the red herring.


Well then, you should have stated that it was, instead of countering it with your own red herring!!! :D:D:D

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So what are trying to say? That ROTC has been kept off campus as a financial matter... and that politics hasn't been a leading factor?



Why don't you pay attention?

The presence or absence of a ROTC program on any university campus has nothing whatsoever to do with freedom of speech. THAT was the red herring.


Well then, you should have stated that it was, instead of countering it with your own red herring!!! :D:D:D


Since when have you been in charge here? Did I miss the announcement?:D
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Is anybody actually following what he said?

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,297823,00.html

&
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/24/us.iran/index.html (CNN gets bonus points for use of "excoriated" to describe Columbia's President's comments to Ahmadinejad: "Mr. President, you exhibit all the signs of a petty and cruel dictator.")

Ahmadinejad continues to question the Holocaust (although he appears to have been more subtle/crafty this time) and asserted that "In Iran we don't have homosexuals like in your country ... In Iran we do not have this phenomenon. I don't know who's told you that we have this." (Denial anyone?)

Comment from President Bush (cited by Fox): "He's the head of a state sponsor of terror, and yet, an institution in our country gives him the chance to express his point of view, which really speaks to the freedoms of the country."

I want to be part of the better state -- a liberal democracy founded on rule of law with a concept of civil liberties -- not pull us (America) down to the behavior of a repressive theocratic state.

VR/Marg

Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters.
Tibetan Buddhist saying

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Can anyone tell me what so many people are afraid Ahmandinejad will say? I know words can be quite powerful, but by the responses I've seen/heard, letting this man open his mouth will result in pestilence, massive cross-breeding, and the resurgence of polyester leisure suits. Personally, I'm guessing he'll just talk and a few people will listen while most will not, and tomorrow we'll move on to the next furor du jour without any sort of catastrophic consequences. It's just rhetoric people, you hear some form of it from your own politicians all the time.

Blues,
Dave
"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

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I like the part where he slipped up at the end. He was trying to thank CU for inviting him to speak, but said USA instead of CU. He quickly corrected himself.

EDIT: the Booing from the audience was in poor taste, IMHO.

I would love to take a trip to Iran, though, and spend the whole time eating their wonderful food. Seriously.

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

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Come on' guys ... if one wants the officer corps to continue to become more conservative, we want to keep ROTC & JROTC out of leftist universities and places like San Francisco. I agree with Duncan Hunter on that one!


Gadzooks! UC Berkeley's: http://armyrotc.com/edu/univcaberkeley/index.htm



if we trust Berkeley with the nuclear program, we can trust them to provide some leutenants.

The leftists are a minority on the campus. The very very loud minority that the right wingers and apolitical types choose to ignore.

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Kicking ROTC off campus certainly has a dollar impact on students that would have used that to pay for their tuition.



If you have a ROTC scholarship there are plenty of schools that will accept you. This has ZERO to do with whether any particular school is obliged to run any particular program, and ROTC is a program.



Your assertion was that having an ROTC program is a financial commitment by the university, and the implication is that it's a loss leader, costing too much for the few people it would serve.

But the obvious counter is that the ROTC provides a lot of scholarship money for students that want to go to Columbia. If that's not there, it has to be replaced with (among many things) endowment money.

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"In Iran we don't have homosexuals like in your country ... In Iran we do not have this phenomenon.



Uh oh... he can funnel munitions into Iraq and kill our guys...but now he's denying the gays. Those liberal NYC types will never tolerate that. He had a good run.

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Kicking ROTC off campus certainly has a dollar impact on students that would have used that to pay for their tuition.



If you have a ROTC scholarship there are plenty of schools that will accept you. This has ZERO to do with whether any particular school is obliged to run any particular program, and ROTC is a program.



Your assertion was that having an ROTC program is a financial commitment by the university, and the implication is that it's a loss leader, costing too much for the few people it would serve.

But the obvious counter is that the ROTC provides a lot of scholarship money for students that want to go to Columbia. If that's not there, it has to be replaced with (among many things) endowment money.



And the obvious conclusion is that the university administration (not the students, not you, and not NCclimber) are the only folks in a position to make the call.

I spent 10 years as faculty coordinator with our ROTC units (AF and Navy) and twice had to fight off administration attempts to close the program due to its being a drain on resources.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Yep. Demetrieus and Zeus are going to jump him while he is leaving Columbia University. Cause of Death: Beat to death with Cole Haan loafers.
The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

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But the obvious counter is that the ROTC provides a lot of scholarship money for students that want to go to Columbia. If that's not there, it has to be replaced with (among many things) endowment money.



SHUSHHHH

If the leftist universities figure this out, then they'll be demanding tax increases for the purpose of replacing the funding they chose to reject.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

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And the obvious conclusion is that the university administration (not the students, not you, and not NCclimber) are the only folks in a position to make the call.



While the final say does come down to the people in charge of a given university and...
(in my opinion), banning ROTC from campus is not a violation of the First Amendment...
universities that put themselves out there as beacons of free speech, but prohibit ROTC on philosophical grounds, are clearly hypocritical.

From what I've read regarding Columbia's recent history, regarding whether or not to let ROTC back on campus, it is a philosophical issue, not a financial one.

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But the obvious counter is that the ROTC provides a lot of scholarship money for students that want to go to Columbia. If that's not there, it has to be replaced with (among many things) endowment money.



SHUSHHHH

If the leftist universities figure this out, then they'll be demanding tax increases for the purpose of replacing the funding they chose to reject.



You are aware, I take it, that only approx. 3% of US colleges and universities have ROTC units. Since you righties think ROTC is such a cash cow, wouldn't you expect the other 97% to be clamoring to get a piece of the action?
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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So what are you trying to say? That ROTC has been kept off campus as a financial matter... and that politics hasn't been a leading factor?



I can't attest to why the program was cancelled back in the 60's but when I was an undergrad there in the 90's I knew of only one ROTC student. Seemed to me like they just didn't have enough interest on campus to justify building a high quality ROTC program.
Fordham already offers a fantastic program at their manhattan campus. Why start a program on campus that may take years to get up to speed and even then, may never be as good as what is already available to its students?

In fact, the same argument can be made of the Columbia medical school. Their classrooms are off the main campus deep in the freaking hood, right next to the Columbia hospital.

Or how about evil cornell medical school located not in Ithaca, NY along with the rest of the students but in the heart of New York City?

My point is that maybe they've gotten to the point where Columbia ROTC students can get better training off campus than they can on campus. Anyone ever stop to think about that?

Gotta go... plaything needs to spank me
Feel the hate...
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You are aware, I take it, that only approx. 3% of US colleges and universities have ROTC units. Since you righties think ROTC is such a cash cow, wouldn't you expect the other 97% to be clamoring to get a piece of the action?



Hell I would think the righties would jump on the chance to cash in..

Oh yeah thats right.. serving the country is for someone else.. not them.....they just support the financial gain of the war.

cluk cluck BRAAAAAAAKK

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