Lefty 0 #1 September 23, 2007 Story Not good enough to visit Ground Zero, but good enough to speak at Columbia. Go figure.Provoking a reaction isn't the same thing as saying something meaningful. -Calvin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jjiimmyyt 0 #2 September 23, 2007 Anyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. "This isn't an iron lung, people. You can actually disconnect and not die." -Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,621 #3 September 23, 2007 QuoteAnyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. Correct - and the speaker can expect his or her audience to voice their opinions too. It will do Ahm..jd good to see that ordinary Americans, not just the government, strongly oppose his policies.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NickDG 23 #4 September 23, 2007 >>Correct - and the speaker can expect his or her audience to voice their opinions too. It will do Ahm..jd good to see that ordinary Americans, not just the government, strongly oppose his policies.Bush should try that too. Seems he only speaks in front of soldiers . . . NickD BASE 194 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1969912 0 #5 September 23, 2007 Quote Quote Anyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. Correct - and the speaker can expect his or her audience to voice their opinions too. It will do Ahm..jd good to see that ordinary Americans, not just the government, strongly oppose his policies. Hopefully the audience will be allowed to voice their opinions. Wasn't Columbia University taken over by leftist students on April 24, 1968? Was the school ever released from the takeover? "Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ." -NickDG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,380 #6 September 24, 2007 >and the speaker can expect his or her audience to voice their opinions too. Anyone who voices their opinions (instead of asking a polite question) will, of course, be tasered and arrested. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,621 #7 September 24, 2007 Quote Quote Quote Anyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. Correct - and the speaker can expect his or her audience to voice their opinions too. It will do Ahm..jd good to see that ordinary Americans, not just the government, strongly oppose his policies. Hopefully the audience will be allowed to voice their opinions. Wasn't Columbia University taken over by leftist students on April 24, 1968? Was the school ever released from the takeover? Columbia U. tuition $36997; Room/board:: $9098. Expect another $1,000 for books. At some $47k per year to attend, I suspect only the sons and daughters of capitalists can afford to go there these days.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kschilk 0 #8 September 24, 2007 Bang!!! (thud) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #9 September 24, 2007 QuoteQuoteAnyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. Correct - and the speaker can expect his or her audience to voice their opinions too. It will do Ahm..jd good to see that ordinary Americans, not just the government, strongly oppose his policies. Wrong. Not everyone is allowed to speak at a University. Some speakers (especially conservative speakers) have been cancelled because the univ. administration decided their views might offend or whatever. Don't you remember any such incidents happening? I can. The word hypocrite should come to mind.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,621 #10 September 24, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteAnyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. Correct - and the speaker can expect his or her audience to voice their opinions too. It will do Ahm..jd good to see that ordinary Americans, not just the government, strongly oppose his policies. Wrong. Not everyone is allowed to speak at a University. Some speakers (especially conservative speakers) have been cancelled because the univ. administration decided their views might offend or whatever. Don't you remember any such incidents happening? I can. The word hypocrite should come to mind. He is a very conservative Islamist, and likely to offend. So do you think he should be canceled, or allowed to speak?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #11 September 24, 2007 He should definitely be allowed to speak. Particularly in an open forum where he is exposing himself to criticism of his ideas. It's a good opportunity for the students to learn and a good opportunity to show the world once again what an idiot he is. I'm looking forward to hearing some of the questions the students ask and Ahmadinejads responses to them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vpozzoli 0 #12 September 24, 2007 Quote Anyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. Funny. I always thought most Universities were private institutions (at least in the US) and a national monument was by definition a public area. So now freedom of speech only applies automatically to private venues, but can be denied in public places? I always believed it was the opposite, I must have outdated information Vale Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Royd 0 #13 September 24, 2007 Anyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote institutions (at least in the US) and a national monument was by definition a public area. So now freedom of speech only applies automatically to private venues, but can be denied in public places? I always believed it was the opposite, I must have outdated information Doesn't the rights granted by the Constitution apply only to citizens? He is being granted permission, he does not have a right to speak. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #14 September 24, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteAnyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. Correct - and the speaker can expect his or her audience to voice their opinions too. It will do Ahm..jd good to see that ordinary Americans, not just the government, strongly oppose his policies. Wrong. Not everyone is allowed to speak at a University. Some speakers (especially conservative speakers) have been cancelled because the univ. administration decided their views might offend or whatever. Don't you remember any such incidents happening? I can. The word hypocrite should come to mind. He is a very conservative Islamist, and likely to offend. So do you think he should be canceled, or allowed to speak? Of course I was referring to speakers that get cancelled because they might be offensive to liberal sensibilities. Quite a revealing contrast, what universities/colleges will not allow because of what might offend the tender feelings of liberals, versus the desire to have Ahmabubba speak. I think the decision about his speaking at schools should rest solely with schools. The schools should also be prepared to face criticism based upon that decision, that is also what free speech is about. If the decision were up to me, no way would he be invited.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vpozzoli 0 #15 September 24, 2007 QuoteAnyone can speak at a University, not everyone can speak at a national monument. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote institutions (at least in the US) and a national monument was by definition a public area. So now freedom of speech only applies automatically to private venues, but can be denied in public places? I always believed it was the opposite, I must have outdated information Doesn't the rights granted by the Constitution apply only to citizens? He is being granted permission, he does not have a right to speak. Man I can't believe people really believe that! The Constitution applies to every human being who falls within its jurisdiction, i.e. anyone who finds himself on anything that is currently considered to be US soil. Same goes for all other bodies of Law, if this weren't the case then a foreigner on US soil would be in fact a lawless entity free to do as he pleases (though without any rights). There are no second class individuals, the only thing the US government can do is keep somebody from entering its territory, once you're allowed in you have the same rights as everybody else. The only difference between an alien resident and a citizen is a citizen cannot be expelled from the country (even if he did, other countries would simply keep sending him back, barring political asylum of course), an alien under the right circumstances can be expelled (but there are procedures and safeguards in that regard too). Sheesh... Vale Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AWL71 0 #16 September 24, 2007 I find it ironic that Columbia will let Ackmindickahead speak at their campus but they will not let the ROTC have a chapter on their campus. Doesn't free speech apply to all parties? Guess it doesn't at Columbia. Talk about hypocrisy. I thought leftys were more open minded.The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #17 September 24, 2007 Not there according to one very well informed, and articulate student. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vpozzoli 0 #18 September 24, 2007 Quote I find it ironic that Columbia will let Ackmindickahead speak at their campus but they will not let the ROTC have a chapter on their campus. Doesn't free speech apply to all parties? Guess it doesn't at Columbia. Talk about hypocrisy. I thought leftys were more open minded. Free speech applies to all parties by the very definition of universal right. This does not automatically give anybody the right to enter Columbia's premises (I'm assuming Columbia University is indeed a private institution, correct me if I'm wrong) regardless of their purpose. To claim differently would be like claiming that you cannot prevent me from entering your house if, while citing my right to free speech, I claim that my purpose is to make a speech in your kitchen, which is obviously nonsense. This has nothing to do with the previous poster's claim that a foreign citizen cannot exercise his right to free speech in a public venue, because this right allegedly should not apply to foreign citizens on US soil Incidentally, we're talking about basic human rights here, this has nothing to do with "leftys" or "righties[sp?]", let's not try and make everything a partisan issue please? Cheers, Vale Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #19 September 24, 2007 I wonder if campus security will be on par with that provided Jim Gilchrist. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vpozzoli 0 #20 September 24, 2007 Quote I wonder if campus security will be on par with that provided Jim Gilchrist. I really doubt it, after all he's not even a citizen, and he has a funny name too... Vale Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #21 September 24, 2007 As the leader of a nation member of the UN, he has the right to come here to attend the UN session, but the US has the right to restrict his visa to that purpose only, and not let him travel outside his hotel room except to travel to & from the UN building. But Columbia's academic freedom is important, too. My solution to balance these interests: restrict him to his hotel room, but let Columbia set up a live video-conference link from his hotel room. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #22 September 24, 2007 Quote As the leader of a nation member of the UN, he has the right to come here to attend the UN session, but the US has the right to restrict his visa to that purpose only, and not let him travel outside his hotel room except to travel to & from the UN building. But Columbia's academic freedom is important, too. My solution to balance these interests: restrict him to his hotel room, but let Columbia set up a live video-conference link from his hotel room. How about we extend to foreign dinitaries the same level of rights and privileges that they afford their citizens??? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vpozzoli 0 #23 September 24, 2007 Quote How about we extend to foreign dinitaries the same level of rights and privileges that they afford their citizens??? How about you extend to them the same rights and privileges that you afford your own citizens? After all, you're the ones claiming to have the moral higher ground, actually acting like it might do you some good. Vale Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #24 September 24, 2007 V - What is Italy's position on giving non-citizens the same rights as Italians? (the actual position, not just your opinion on how you 'should' do it?) ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #25 September 24, 2007 Quote V - What is Italy's position on giving non-citizens the same rights as Italians? Or even the citizens.... like Oriana Fallaci? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites