Hospital security guard tasers man carrying newborn baby.

[jakee 1,254]

Full story here.

Short version, a man with a history of domestic abuse tries to take his new born kid out of the hospital against doctors orders. The security guard tries to talk him out of it for less than 2 minutes before tasering him.

What the fuck? I can understand the importance of stopping the dude from leaving but tasering him while he is holding the baby is just moronic. It's supposed to be about protecting the child, not taking down the asshole!

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[BillyVance 34]

Yeah that was kinda dumb. He could have dropped the baby on its head or fell on it with devastating results. Security guards can be real assholes sometimes. Most of them are rejects from police academy or got fired from their cop jobs.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[NCclimber 0]

Looks like a lose/lose situation.

You got a pissed off man, holding a newborn, trying to leave (illegally) with the baby. If he leaves, then the hospital is liable. If he gets violent and the baby gets injured, then the hospital is liable.

The father (who definitely seems a few cards short) says the baby has problems as a result of the incident. Social Services and doctors say no.

Definitely a big ole can of worms.

IMO the father bears the brunt of the blame here.

[jakee 1,254]

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You got a pissed off man, holding a newborn, trying to leave (illegally) with the baby. If he leaves, then the hospital is liable. If he gets violent and the baby gets injured, then the hospital is liable.

He had been trying to get into a lift that was automatically locked down, there was obviously no immediate danger of him reaching the exit. As for the risk of the man getting violent, the action the security guard took was guaranteed to knock him down while he was still holding the baby, never mind the possible danger of sending some pretty serious current through it.

The father does sound like a cunt, no question, but I still just cannot believe what the security guard did.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[livendive 8]

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You got a pissed off man, holding a newborn, trying to leave (illegally) with the baby.

That's the only part I didn't find clear in the article. Doctors don't usually get to decide when a parent may take their child home, unless that parent doesn't have custody. It says at the end that CPS has custody, and if that was true at the time of the incident, then I think the action by the security guard was proper.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[JohnRich 4]

How would YOU have stopped that unauthorized man from taking the baby?

[billvon 2,384]

>but I still just cannot believe what the security guard did.


He did a great job! His job is to win; I can't believe anyone would want him to lose. (Of course, I'm sure there are people out there who want our security guards to be defeated, because they are incapable of conceiving of winning. Like the french.)

If the kid gets hurt? Well, that's sad. But you have to expect some collateral damage when you are fighting evil people like this. After all, it wouldn't be the security guard's fault if the kid was electrocuted. In the end, all that matters is winning. Anything else will embolden the babysnatchers.

[jakee 1,254]

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How would YOU have stopped that unauthorized man from taking the baby?

Gee I just don't know John. I guess before tasers were invented security guards were all completely helpless

First off I think that talking to the man for more than 2 minutes while backup arrived would have been a good start. He was evidently no where near an exit at the time so it wasn't as if he could have disappeared at any moment.

Question to you John, do you really think that tasering a man holding a new born baby was an intelligent course of action?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[nanook 1]

Well, what other options did he have? Telling him to stop did not work. It probably won't work again. Forget pepper spray. Trying to physically stop him? I would rather use the taser. A neborn cannot possibly survive a tug-of-war or wrestling match between two full grown adults. an infant's neck is easilier snapped in this scenerio than a drop. Hostage negotiation? Not a security guard. . .unless he is a retired HRT type.

Problem is, I don't know what other stuff he had on him so I don't know that other tools he had to utilize. Maybe there's something better he could have done, but this is a charged situation. This was not a game of chess or Stratego, the bad guy was kidnapping(technically) someone and the guard had to do something fast.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[cloudseeker2001 0]

There is video...watch the video and see for yourself.

The wristband disables the elevator, doors and tracks the child while on campus-they were not going anywhere. How did the child not receive a shock? It was not handled very well and I think the cop failed.

It was not a security guard, it was an HPD cop. Hospitals set up companies and hire police to enforce the Law. The hospital cannot be at fault for what the police do. Dad used poor judgment, cop used even worse judgment, baby received nasty shock.........bum deal all the way around.

"Some call it heavenly in it's brilliance,
others mean and rueful of the western dream"

[Zenister 0]

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How would YOU have stopped that unauthorized man from taking the baby?

Gee I just don't know John. I guess before tasers were invented security guards were all completely helpless

and THIS is the exact problem with weapons like tasers... half trained ass hats use them indiscriminately instead of applying judgment, because they are 'non-lethal'

____________________________________
Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[skydyvr 0]

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You got a pissed off man, holding a newborn, trying to leave (illegally) with the baby.

Not necessarilly illegal at all. Where'd you come up with that?

. . =(_8^(1)

[nanook 1]

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You got a pissed off man, holding a newborn, trying to leave (illegally) with the baby.

Not necessarilly illegal at all. Where'd you come up with that?

the child was in custody of the CPS. There was a history of abuse in the family. They weren't allowed to take the baby. You now have a agitated person holding a baby that is now cornered. A cornered person is dangerous; with abusal history, you can't predict the guys action or mentality. I'm not applauding the taser part, but I am applausing the fact they at least took some sort of action.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[nanook 1]

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There is video...watch the video and see for yourself.

The wristband disables the elevator, doors and tracks the child while on campus-they were not going anywhere. How did the child not receive a shock? It was not handled very well and I think the cop failed.

It was not a security guard, it was an HPD cop. Hospitals set up companies and hire police to enforce the Law. The hospital cannot be at fault for what the police do. Dad used poor judgment, cop used even worse judgment, baby received nasty shock.........bum deal all the way around.

The video is inconclusive and doesn't show anything at all.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[skydyvr 0]

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the child was in custody of the CPS. There was a history of abuse in the family. They weren't allowed to take the baby. You now have a agitated person holding a baby that is now cornered. A cornered person is dangerous; with abusal history, you can't predict the guys action or mentality. I'm not applauding the taser part, but I am applausing the fact they at least took some sort of action.

Had not heard about the child being held by CPS. But from what I've read, the guards had no awareness of the the family history, so that's no excuse for the moronic use of the taser.

. . =(_8^(1)

[nanook 1]

I don't think the guards had an awareness either. All googled articles point to the same AP article, which states that he was uncooperative with staff and guards when they were trying to find out his relationship to the baby.

The taser may not have been a good idea. What would you have done?

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[skydyvr 0]

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What would you have done?

Simple, I would've continued to reason with the guy as long as it took to ensure a safe outcome for all. The taser should've been reserved as an extreme last resort had the father threatened harm to the baby in some way.

I'm guessing the cop saw his "opportunity" to use the nifty taser toy and jumped on it.

What would you have done?

. . =(_8^(1)

[nanook 1]

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What would you have done?

Simple, I would've continued to reason with the guy as long as it took to ensure a safe outcome for all. The taser should've been reserved as an extreme last resort had the father threatened harm to the baby in some way.

I'm guessing the cop saw his "opportunity" to use the nifty taser toy and jumped on it.

What would you have done?

Knowing what only the security guards knew; someone has a newborn that isn't its known parent. I would have tasered him too.

The guy was past being reasoned with. He was irratable, aggressive in stance and action and abusive. He was a danger: elevators off and nowhere to go. That's textbook cornering and VERY BAD. People WILL get irrational and highly unpredictable in this situation. There's no de-escalation after this point. the Extreme Last resort was now. The guy's actions cornered himself and brought in a baby.

these cops aren't just making stuff up as they are going along, there are written procedures(written in blood) that they adhere to. If you are in a job that may require Deadly Force, you will practice these procedures very often. If you do not know of the Levels of Force, you may not understand what's going on in a lot of these cop videos.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[jenfly00 0]

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How would YOU have stopped that unauthorized man from taking the baby?

Gee I just don't know John. I guess before tasers were invented security guards were all completely helpless

First off I think that talking to the man for more than 2 minutes while backup arrived would have been a good start. He was evidently no where near an exit at the time so it wasn't as if he could have disappeared at any moment.

Question to you John, do you really think that tasering a man holding a new born baby was an intelligent course of action?

No less so than fighting a man holding a new born baby.

Tough call. With the taser, you immediately incapacitate him and perhaps control his fall to protect the kid. In a physical struggle, the kid could easily be crushed.

I know it takes a minimum four well trained individuals to safely restrain an out of control adult to keep him for hurting himself. How would you go about restraining someone in this situation?

-----------------------
"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[jakee 1,254]

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Well, what other options did he have?

He had time.

The elevators were locked down, they weren't right next to the front door, there was no immediate danger of the dude disappearing into thin air.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[NCclimber 0]

It seems like a number of people have some serious issues with authority.

Bad Cop!

Bad Cop!

Bad Cop!

[Nightingale 0]

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You got a pissed off man, holding a newborn, trying to leave (illegally) with the baby.

Not necessarilly illegal at all. Where'd you come up with that?

the child was in custody of the CPS. There was a history of abuse in the family. They weren't allowed to take the baby...

The article wasn't clear on this... it said "CPS has custody", which I took to mean that CPS has custody at this time, but it didn't say whether CPS had custody at the time of the incident. The incident may have been what got CPS's attention, and if so, the doctors probably couldn't have stopped the guy from leaving with his kid if he wasn't happy with their treatment at the hospital.

[Zipp0 1]

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The taser may not have been a good idea. What would you have done?

Pop quiz hot shot - An abusive father is leaving the hospital with a baby. What do you do?

Shoot the hostage.

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Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

[skydyvr 0]

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the Extreme Last resort was now.

Good argument, but the Extreme Last Resort point was reached after only 2 minutes? I think not.

Unless, of course, the "Fresh Hot Donut" sign was flashing at Krispy Kreme at the time. In that case, things might be different.

. . =(_8^(1)

[JohnRich 4]

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How would YOU have stopped that unauthorized man from taking the baby?

First off I think that talking to the man for more than 2 minutes while backup arrived would have been a good start. He was evidently no where near an exit at the time so it wasn't as if he could have disappeared at any moment.

You didn't answer the question. And what would you have done to retrieve the baby once backup arrived? Please try again.

If you're going to criticize what was done, then you must have some other idea of what would have been better. And yet, you seem unable to explain what that alternative might have been, that would have been safer for the baby. That makes your criticism rather cheap and hollow.